I129f when the truth might sound bad

[austinoscar 0]

I have some expunged records from when I was a juvenile. The record were expunged but I am still reporting the offense as the instructions dictate.

 

The issue I am having is will being honest hurt me if it could be interpreted as me lying or downplaying the incident? I plead not guilty and didn't believe I committed any crime. Should I ommit this fact?

Here is what I wrote:

 

When I was in middle school my sister and her friend played a prank on someone and said threatening things. Parents of the victim called my sister during the act and asked what kids were in the house, my sister included my name and that alone was enough to convict me. I knew my sister and her friend were playing a prank but I never knew what they were saying. My sister, her friend, and I were all convicted of Terroristic Threat. The records have been expunged. I have attached paperwork to show this.

[Keithn85 400]

16 minutes ago, austinoscar said:

I have some expunged records from when I was a juvenile. The record were expunged but I am still reporting the offense as the instructions dictate.

 

The issue I am having is will being honest hurt me if it could be interpreted as me lying or downplaying the incident? I plead not guilty and didn't believe I committed any crime. Should I ommit this fact?

Here is what I wrote:

 

When I was in middle school my sister and her friend played a prank on someone and said threatening things. Parents of the victim called my sister during the act and asked what kids were in the house, my sister included my name and that alone was enough to convict me. I knew my sister and her friend were playing a prank but I never knew what they were saying. My sister, her friend, and I were all convicted of Terroristic Threat. The records have been expunged. I have attached paperwork to show this.

Just my opinion.  Be honest.  Prove you are honest, your relationship is honest and all this will go a long way.  If they were concerned about this, it would be on the record and you would be treated as such.  Have you had any issues with government ID's because of this?  If you had any issues since the records were expunged, then you would have every reason to be concerned.  

[austinoscar 0]

20 minutes ago, Keithn85 said:

Just my opinion.  Be honest.  Prove you are honest, your relationship is honest and all this will go a long way.  If they were concerned about this, it would be on the record and you would be treated as such.  Have you had any issues with government ID's because of this?  If you had any issues since the records were expunged, then you would have every reason to be concerned.  

It's never shown up on any employment background check. The court clerk told me it was probably destroyed. I'm just worried mentioning I don't take blame or that I didn't take part in the crime looks bad even though it's the truth. 😅

Edited March 12, 2021 by austinoscar

[Keithn85 400]

1 hour ago, austinoscar said:

It's never shown up on any employment background check. The court clerk told me it was probably destroyed. I'm just worried mentioning I don't take blame or that I didn't take part in the crime looks bad even though it's the truth. 😅

Say the truth and let them decide whether they want to make it a big deal.  I highly doubt it though, especially since it does not appear on your current background.

[NoMansLand2020 298]

I only admitted to charges/convictions that occurred since I was 18. That was over twenty years ago now.  I've had numerous background checks with employers and even hold an active Top Secret clearance. So my background has been investigated thoroughly.  None of the juvenile records I had have ever showed up and I think at some point they were destroyed. 

[JKLSemicolon 327]

Consider the following:

• It is in your best interest to be honest throughout the immigration process, since if you are less than truthful even about small things, and that is later discovered, it casts doubt on all the information you have provided;
• Being prepared to tell the truth if it/when it comes up will prevent you from thinking about all sorts of "what-if" scenarios during what is a lengthy process from start to finish;
• There are many different stages to go through in the immigration journey. The K-1 is only the beginning. Do you want to feel like you are hiding something throughout all of them?

Just my 2 cents.

 

 

[In4theJourney 171]

Terroristic threats sound like a case for Vermont- don’t want to end up there 

[austinoscar 0]

1 hour ago, In4theJourney said:

Terroristic threats sound like a case for Vermont- don’t want to end up there 

Can you explain what you mean by this?

[Sinead91 242]

7 hours ago, austinoscar said:

Can you explain what you mean by this?

Some more complex cases get sent to the Vermont processing centre and they have a longer wait time.

 

if it has not been an issue for you in the past, then you will probably be fine. 
 

Attach all of the information you have relating to the case and sign your statement above also. It is always possible that they may take up issue with it, but it is possible that they won’t either. You won’t know until you submit your application.

 

 

most importantly, be honest and be honest to your other half  sometimes at interviews it is brought up if one of the couple have a “criminal past”. Good luck!  

[Crazy Cat 39,404]

13 hours ago, austinoscar said:

I have some expunged records from when I was a juvenile. The record were expunged but I am still reporting the offense as the instructions dictate.

 

The issue I am having is will being honest hurt me if it could be interpreted as me lying or downplaying the incident? I plead not guilty and didn't believe I committed any crime. Should I ommit this fact?

Here is what I wrote:

 

When I was in middle school my sister and her friend played a prank on someone and said threatening things. Parents of the victim called my sister during the act and asked what kids were in the house, my sister included my name and that alone was enough to convict me. I knew my sister and her friend were playing a prank but I never knew what they were saying. My sister, her friend, and I were all convicted of Terroristic Threat. The records have been expunged. I have attached paperwork to show this.

You are wise to disclose.  There is a very prominent member here who failed to disclose an expunged conviction when he submitted an I-129f a couple years ago. .  The process continued through the interview, then the consulate denied the application......because he failed to disclose the expunged conviction. They then started from scratch with a CR-1.

A word to the wise is sufficient.

[Chauncey 138]

I had an expunged record and I just wrote a letter along with the documents saying what happened and signed it and my petition was approved

[Villanelle 4,121]

You have gotten some good advice but I dont believe anyone has directly answered your question so heres how it is.  

 

VSC (Vermont) does handle AWA cases or review cases to see if they are AWA. (AWA is Adam Walsh Act and is centered around abuse, sexual abuse, abuse involving minors, etc). I do not believe what you described will fall under AWA unless this incident you vaguely described as a 'prank' had a sexual tone to any of it.  "Terroristic Threat" can mean different things depending on the jurisdiction which you also did not provide but generally means a threat of violence against a person or place. It doesnt have to have sexual undertones to it but it could. If it did then you are going to be looked at under the AWA guidelines. If not then it would be reviewed as any other conviction. 

 

So the first thing I would say is you need to look at the exact statute you were convicted of. Anything with the word 'terrorism' or a alternation of said word (or something involving 'fraud') is going to be given a much harder look then a conviction of shoplifting would. They are going to want ALL the records about it (regardless if it was expunged). All of the facts surrounding the incident and subsequent conviction will be considered including your age (to an extent- you were a minor but that doesnt mean you get a free pass) and they will also consider if you made any false statements to the police or courts during the process. If so that can be held against you as you lied for a benefit (not going to jail/avoid punishment). It seems you were found guilty right? So was there a court hearing? Did you accept a plea or did you plead innocent but were found guilty. See the thing is personally I think its a huge problem to be saying what you did above "I don't take blame or that I didn't take part in the crime looks bad even though it's the truth". Seriously?? There was enough evidence for a Judge or jury to convict you- yet you maintain the Judge/jury were WRONG and you are actually innocent. When a Judge makes a ruling in a criminal case it is accepted as being "fact". Your refusal to acknowledge that can be a problem. Usually when theres a conviction for something USCIS likes to see you admit what you did, acknowledge it, show you learned from the mistake. Its never a good idea to take the position that the conviction was wrong. It doesnt seem like you attempted to appeal the conviction either right? So on one side is what USCIS considers to be fact, indisputable fact, as a Judge said this is what happened- and on the other side is you saying they are wrong. Who are they going to believe? The facts. Which again the facts are what the court rules are the facts not your opinion. By saying yeah I was convicted of terrorism but I dont think what happened was terrorism then whats to stop you in the future from committing similar acts if you dont believe they were wrong?? 

 

I would strongly encourage you to NOT use wording of I dont take blame or anything similar. If you are not comfortable doing the opposite (taking blame) then its probably best to avoid the topic of blame/responsibility all together and simply list out in a neutral tone the charges and the general circumstances, that you were not directly involved in the 'prank phone call' but was present and subsequently charged and convicted because of such and you accept the courts ruling. Again you want to look at the paperwork you do have (or can get) and if there is wording in it about you in an 'accessory to the crime' type way then thats what you would acknowledge. You may not agree with the laws that allowed you to be convicted in such a way or think its unfair- similar to how someone who is driving and is stopped by the cops and drugs are found on the passenger and the driver is also charged for whatever reason. You have to accept some type of blame or at least acknowledge you respect the laws that led to your conviction. I believe there is probably a bit more to the story then you are posting. I cant imagine your parents/sister were OK with you being charged and did not communicate to the authorities/court that you were not involved AT ALL and was simply minding your own business in another room of the house unaware of what they were up to. Most likely it seems they 'rounded up' all the kids who were present and assigned blame to all of them and no one stepped up and admitted exactly what happened/who did what/who wasnt involved- so it was left to the Judge who either didnt buy your collective story-or- heard the collective story and decided you were in fact guilty as well. 

 

Typically convictions are not an issue in being able to petition for someone unless they fall under AWA but things that fall under the terrorism umbrella are also major reasons for concern for obvious reasons. Part of applying for immigration benefits requires you to make honest statements (specifically you are not entering the marriage for benefits which is illegal) and someone who does not have GMC (good moral character) can not make such statements. 

 

I would expect extra scrutiny and extra time for processing. You may be asked to go for biometrics so they can ensure you have no other charges you havent disclosed. It can be hard to get old paperwork so do your best to get what you can. It can also help to do as AWA petitioners do- submit additional evidence of you leading a clean life since. Statements of GMC from reputable people like Clergy, Social Workers, employers, etc. You may also be able to find old newspaper articles of the incident that you may want to include depending on the content of the article because most likely your names as minors were not published. Attempt to get a transcript from the clerk. If you have the money for an attny you may want to hire one to help you assemble your package or otherwise get a free consult or limited appt in which you simply get help in drafting the explanation of the crime. If you can not do such now then send what you have or can find and then wait and see what happens. If you get an RFE about it you can then hire an attny to help you respond if needed. You would first get and RFE and then a NOID if they are not satisfied with what you sent or have issues with it. 

 

 

 

 

[austinoscar 0]

30 minutes ago, Villanelle said:

I believe there is probably a bit more to the story then you are posting. I cant imagine your parents/sister were OK with you being charged and did not communicate to the authorities/court that you were not involved AT ALL and was simply minding your own business in another room of the house unaware of what they were up to. 

There's not more the the story. My sister and her friend were playing a prank on some girl and I never was involved. My sister told them I wasn't involved but they didn't care. I actually was in another room playing the guitar when the cops got involvedT. They  just assumed I was guilty and didn't care what I or my sister said because we were the people being prosecuted. Me and this girl didn't get along in school so I think they were just convinced I had to be involved. We were assigned a public defender who we didn't meet until minutes before the case. I told him what happened and he just said you just need to plead guilty it will be better for you. So as a scared kid that's what I did. The court said they had no records of it so I'm not sure how to proceed. I guess I'll just submit the paperwork I have now showing the courthouse couldn't find anything.

 

I also think you're right that I should just accept blame because it looks better. They will assume like you that there is no smoke without fire whether it's true or not.

 

Thanks for your detailed response. It's very helpful.

Edited March 12, 2021 by austinoscar

[JonSeattle 201]

" I plead not guilty and didn't believe I committed any crime. "

 

"I told him what happened and he just said you just need to plead guilty it will be better for you. So as a scared kid that's what I did"

 

It's not clear how to reconcile those two statements. That makes it harder for us to give advice.

 

I  think sending in a clear and objective timeline of what happened may help to explain the situation. A note at the end describing the lessons you learned, such as what situations and people to stay away from, might help as well. 

[austinoscar 0]

8 minutes ago, JonSeattle said:

" I plead not guilty and didn't believe I committed any crime. "

 

"I told him what happened and he just said you just need to plead guilty it will be better for you. So as a scared kid that's what I did"

 

It's not clear how to reconcile those two statements. That makes it harder for us to give advice.

 

I  think sending in a clear and objective timeline of what happened may help to explain the situation. A note at the end describing the lessons you learned, such as what situations and people to stay away from, might help as well. 

Yea, honestly my memory on how I plead isn't entirely clear. At first I thought I plead not guilty but it might have been some nolo contendere plea. I've asked my mom about it and I'm waiting on a call from my sister to talk about it further, she has a much better memory than me.