More Immigration Restrictions?

[AJ2019 58]

The president’s immigration advisers are drawing up plans for a coming executive order, expected this month, that would ban the issuance of some new temporary, work-based visas. The order is expected to focus on visa categories including H-1B, designed for highly skilled workers, and H-2B, for seasonal migrant workers, as well as student visas and the work authorization that accompanies them.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-pushes-to-extend-immigration-limits/ar-BB13MYiJ

[py6 43]

This year is especially painful for F1 students.

[MovingToFlorida 71]

11 hours ago, AJ2019 said:

The president’s immigration advisers are drawing up plans for a coming executive order, expected this month, that would ban the issuance of some new temporary, work-based visas. The order is expected to focus on visa categories including H-1B, designed for highly skilled workers, and H-2B, for seasonal migrant workers, as well as student visas and the work authorization that accompanies them.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-pushes-to-extend-immigration-limits/ar-BB13MYiJ

This article just made me lose a little more hope. We are a family visa. F3 category and we were 5 days away from our visa interview when the consulate closed in Canada. Then he closed immigration. Reading this makes me feel like it will be a year or 2 at least before we may have our interview now😔.

[sl1pstream 551]

1 hour ago, MovingToFlorida said:

This article just made me lose a little more hope. We are a family visa. F3 category and we were 5 days away from our visa interview when the consulate closed in Canada. Then he closed immigration. Reading this makes me feel like it will be a year or 2 at least before we may have our interview now😔.

I'm thinking it'll take until the next president. Once it's in place there's no incentive for it to be changed back, so either until 2021 or at least 2025, depending on election results.

[Cyberfx1024 7,978]

13 hours ago, AJ2019 said:

The president’s immigration advisers are drawing up plans for a coming executive order, expected this month, that would ban the issuance of some new temporary, work-based visas. The order is expected to focus on visa categories including H-1B, designed for highly skilled workers, and H-2B, for seasonal migrant workers, as well as student visas and the work authorization that accompanies them.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-pushes-to-extend-immigration-limits/ar-BB13MYiJ

Well what do you expect honestly? They are talking about 15% unemployment for USCs right now. Why would we bring in H-1/2B visa holders to do jobs that Americans can do? Also from what I can see this is just an extension on the EO already in place

[geowrian 22,336]

35 minutes ago, Cyberfx1024 said:

Why would we bring in H-1/2B visa holders to do jobs that Americans can do?

Sure, although an existing requirement of most work visas (those included) is demonstrating that a US authorized worker (not just Americans) is unable to be obtained.

The bar to demonstrate may need to be looked at again given the circumstances, sure. That bar has far too often been set ridiculously low, and the visas have been abused as a result.

 

IMO...

We do not need more programmers/developers and closely related fields. Many were needed back during the tech booms, but that turned into a revolving door of abuse by the large tech companies and foreign agencies. This category makes up the overwhelming majority of current H-1B workers (https://www.myvisajobs.com/Reports/2020-H1B-Visa-Category.aspx?T=OC). The fields have changed over the years, and more people in the US are capable of performing this type of work. You don't even need a 4 year degree for most of this anymore.

I would note that more and more "engineer" titled positions have been popping up here (look at the by title page), and I would argue that is an attempt to make the positions justify needing somebody abroad even if the actual job requirements have not significantly changed.

 

I know too many people nowadays that have these skills but don't even get callbacks. A number of them have ended up in other positions for years just to make ends meet, while looking for an opening. The money and opportunity isn't really in software development as much as it used to be...it's in all the other layers of technology to produce the end product. Actual development is not the driving factor like it used to be. At least that's my $0.02.

 

We do still need healthcare workers, engineers, etc. Pulling that talent from other countries has been a big gain for the US over the years.

 

H2 is a little different beast...I think we would have a hard time filling those jobs with just US workers. it generally doesn't pay well enough for the work involved to get people to relocate for employment.

The ones related to tourism-based fields likely don't even make sense anymore, though. It's going to be a while before there's enough tourism again to warrant needing outside help.

[SalishSea 16,848]

1 hour ago, geowrian said:

We do still need healthcare workers, engineers, etc. Pulling that talent from other countries has been a big gain for the US over the years.

 

For the first time in a long while, health care workers are being laid off en masse.  Hopefully with the return to elective surgeries and wider use of ERs, that will change.

 

My son is a software engineer in SF for a major app-based company, and they are doing layoffs.  All those tech workers will need new jobs.

[SalishSea 16,848]

16 hours ago, AJ2019 said:

The president’s immigration advisers are drawing up plans for a coming executive order, expected this month, that would ban the issuance of some new temporary, work-based visas. The order is expected to focus on visa categories including H-1B, designed for highly skilled workers, and H-2B, for seasonal migrant workers, as well as student visas and the work authorization that accompanies them.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-pushes-to-extend-immigration-limits/ar-BB13MYiJ

Makes sense that the employment-based visa numbers change as labor needs change.  The purpose of those visas is til fill jobs that cannot be filled by American citizens and LPRs.

[geowrian 22,336]

3 minutes ago, Jorgedig said:

For the first time in a long while, health care workers are being laid off en masse.  Hopefully with the return to elective surgeries and wider use of ERs, that will change.

 

My son is a software engineer in SF for a major app-based company, and they are doing layoffs.  All those tech workers will need new jobs.

True, although presumably that is a fairly temporary situation for most areas. I would be surprised if that extended through the end of the year. Unfortunately, there will almost certainly be some areas where that does not hold true.

 

Yes they will. And I think that's where the H-1B program will really get hit by this. There does not appear to be a lot of public support for that IMO. People are aware of how it's been abused in tech, especially among larger employers.

[cd37 229]

1 hour ago, geowrian said:

Sure, although an existing requirement of most work visas (those included) is demonstrating that a US authorized worker (not just Americans) is unable to be obtained.

The bar to demonstrate may need to be looked at again given the circumstances, sure. That bar has far too often been set ridiculously low, and the visas have been abused as a result.

 

IMO...

We do not need more programmers/developers and closely related fields. Many were needed back during the tech booms, but that turned into a revolving door of abuse by the large tech companies and foreign agencies. This category makes up the overwhelming majority of current H-1B workers (https://www.myvisajobs.com/Reports/2020-H1B-Visa-Category.aspx?T=OC). The fields have changed over the years, and more people in the US are capable of performing this type of work. You don't even need a 4 year degree for most of this anymore.

I would note that more and more "engineer" titled positions have been popping up here (look at the by title page), and I would argue that is an attempt to make the positions justify needing somebody abroad even if the actual job requirements have not significantly changed.

 

I know too many people nowadays that have these skills but don't even get callbacks. A number of them have ended up in other positions for years just to make ends meet, while looking for an opening. The money and opportunity isn't really in software development as much as it used to be...it's in all the other layers of technology to produce the end product. Actual development is not the driving factor like it used to be. At least that's my $0.02.

 

We do still need healthcare workers, engineers, etc. Pulling that talent from other countries has been a big gain for the US over the years.

 

H2 is a little different beast...I think we would have a hard time filling those jobs with just US workers. it generally doesn't pay well enough for the work involved to get people to relocate for employment.

The ones related to tourism-based fields likely don't even make sense anymore, though. It's going to be a while before there's enough tourism again to warrant needing outside help.

Well you can say the same thing for people who come on immigrant visas. The i 864 requirements are bare minimum and people somehow show that they meet requirements and then when they reach US they directly go on public benefits. Abuse is on both non immigrant and immigrant categories. 

[geowrian 22,336]

8 minutes ago, cd37 said:

Well you can say the same thing for people who come on immigrant visas. The i 864 requirements are bare minimum and people somehow show that they meet requirements and then when they reach US they directly go on public benefits. Abuse is on both non immigrant and immigrant categories. 

I think that's comparing apples and oranges. Family-based immigration and employment-based immigration are entirely different categories. This topic is regarding non-immigrants with impacts to jobs, not anything to do with the public charge. I'm not sure how the same thing could be said, as nothing was said about the public charge inadmissibility.

 

The equities of family based immigration favor close relations and reunification over jobs. That's just the way the law has been written and/or interpreted by the courts. If you have a close tie to the US such of that as a close family member (IRs specifically), that basically trumps that of a business having a job vacancy to fill. There also is no requirement to show that a family member will not take a job from a US worker. There is one to show for most employment-based visas.

It's a topic of discussion for whether a more merit-based system should be implemented or not, but that's a topic for another discussion.

[Lucky2Lucky 2,526]

2 hours ago, Jorgedig said:

For the first time in a long while, health care workers are being laid off en masse.  Hopefully with the return to elective surgeries and wider use of ERs, that will change.

 

My son is a software engineer in SF for a major app-based company, and they are doing layoffs.  All those tech workers will need new jobs.

It depends where you live. I work in a hospital of over 10,000 employees and there hasn’t been a single layoff. We were short doctors and nurses before COVID and could definitely use more now. I’m also in a state getting pretty hard hit by COVID...

[cd37 229]

10 hours ago, geowrian said:

I think that's comparing apples and oranges. Family-based immigration and employment-based immigration are entirely different categories. This topic is regarding non-immigrants with impacts to jobs, not anything to do with the public charge. I'm not sure how the same thing could be said, as nothing was said about the public charge inadmissibility.

 

The equities of family based immigration favor close relations and reunification over jobs. That's just the way the law has been written and/or interpreted by the courts. If you have a close tie to the US such of that as a close family member (IRs specifically), that basically trumps that of a business having a job vacancy to fill. There also is no requirement to show that a family member will not take a job from a US worker. There is one to show for most employment-based visas.

It's a topic of discussion for whether a more merit-based system should be implemented or not, but that's a topic for another discussion.

Majority of job losses are in restaurant and hotel industry in current situation  who works on minimum wage and h1b workers doesnt compete to these people. So even If they restrict h1b holders by the EO, its certainly not the root cause of the situation.

[geowrian 22,336]

24 minutes ago, cd37 said:

Majority of job losses are in restaurant and hotel industry in current situation  who works on minimum wage and h1b workers doesnt compete to these people. So even If they restrict h1b holders by the EO, its certainly not the root cause of the situation.

No doubt. The virus is clearly the root cause of the current situation, not anything to do with work visas.

Work visas also only make up a small fraction of the jobs that would become available as the economy open up.

My take on an EO that across-the-board restricts those visas is that it would have minimal impact on the unemployment rate as a whole. At the same time, my thoughts on selective restrictions for abused areas of the program remain. I think a change in the law to adapt to modern circumstances is needed, not an EO that just blocks them.

[Cyberfx1024 7,978]

21 hours ago, geowrian said:

Sure, although an existing requirement of most work visas (those included) is demonstrating that a US authorized worker (not just Americans) is unable to be obtained.

The bar to demonstrate may need to be looked at again given the circumstances, sure. That bar has far too often been set ridiculously low, and the visas have been abused as a result.

 

IMO...

We do not need more programmers/developers and closely related fields. Many were needed back during the tech booms, but that turned into a revolving door of abuse by the large tech companies and foreign agencies. This category makes up the overwhelming majority of current H-1B workers (https://www.myvisajobs.com/Reports/2020-H1B-Visa-Category.aspx?T=OC). The fields have changed over the years, and more people in the US are capable of performing this type of work. You don't even need a 4 year degree for most of this anymore.

I would note that more and more "engineer" titled positions have been popping up here (look at the by title page), and I would argue that is an attempt to make the positions justify needing somebody abroad even if the actual job requirements have not significantly changed.

 

I know too many people nowadays that have these skills but don't even get callbacks. A number of them have ended up in other positions for years just to make ends meet, while looking for an opening. The money and opportunity isn't really in software development as much as it used to be...it's in all the other layers of technology to produce the end product. Actual development is not the driving factor like it used to be. At least that's my $0.02.

 

We do still need healthcare workers, engineers, etc. Pulling that talent from other countries has been a big gain for the US over the years.

 

H2 is a little different beast...I think we would have a hard time filling those jobs with just US workers. it generally doesn't pay well enough for the work involved to get people to relocate for employment.

The ones related to tourism-based fields likely don't even make sense anymore, though. It's going to be a while before there's enough tourism again to warrant needing outside help.

I completely agree with you on this. There are jobs in the IT field that H2b workers can and will do but for everything else there are more than enough American workers to fill those jobs. But many in the tech community are very much ageist against older workers, espeically if they have been laid off. 

You see more "Engineer" title positions because they are trying to tailor those jobs for H2b workers with some unrealistic requirements and/or salary. That no USC would take that job unless they were done on their luck. I have been interviewed for a couple jobs with Indian-centric outsourcing companies that won't to pay $25 an hour for IT Security jobs. I work in IT security and compliance so I see some of this stuff going on as well. 

 

The H2 visa has been abused because many of the workers are brought in to fill tourism based jobs. My niece has been here on a J1 and  H2 visa for tourism based employment, and I met someone last year who has come every year for the last 5 years to fill a job at a store at the beach I go to.