coming to US VWP/B1/B2 with intent to marry

[Jason32 5]

I like this idea because if the tourist visa cannot be "converted" to another visa that means there will be a higher chance of approval for those who TRULY want to just visit and go back. I know a number of people who just want to visit this country and go back but because getting a B2 is almost impossible, they are forced to use another visa route.

So if a B2 is so hard to get, why should it be a problem for someone who does have one to adjust status from it? Not everyone that has a B2 or comes over on the VWP wants to immigrate. That's why these visas and programs exist. For people to visit the US. Those that you hear about that come over here with "Intent to marry" are very few, and I agree that they are committing fraud. That shouldn't mean that those who had no intention of immigrating should be punished.

That's another point that I would like to make. There is no such thing as "Intent to marry". There is no law that says that a foreigner with a B1/B2 or on the VWP can't come to the US to get married. So, what, you can't get married in the US unless you come on a K1 and intend to immigrate??? That is quite frankly the stupidest thing I have ever heard. Not everyone that wants to get married in the US wants to STAY in the US. A couple should be able to get married however they want, wherever they want. It is the Intent to IMMIGRATE that is the issue here. If someone intends to immigrate, then there is the K1 or the CR1/IR1. But not everyone's circumstances are the same. Companies go out of business. Houses burn down. Family members die. People get sick. THINGS HAPPEN!

As for me, my fiancee and I are planning on getting married in the US and then she will return to Taiwan to wait for the visa. After she stays as long as she is allowed due to her B2 visa. Despite popular belief, the US government isn't in the habit of displeasing it's citizens. After all, this is a "...government of the people, by the people, and for the people..." If you don't like a law, use the process and get it changed. Vote. Take part in YOUR government. Otherwise, don't come in here to complain about what is FAIR or NOT FAIR. LIFE is not fair!!!

Edited January 21, 2013 by Jason32

[blankmedia 41]

If the government wants to deny people, they can, easily. They don't deny most marriages because intent to "get married and stay" is a non-issue. Someone can't just come to America and adjust status, they need to get married first and have the person they marry petition + sponsor for them. There is no way for the immigrant to actuallly plan this before entering because it requires future consent and legally binding agreements from a USC which is not guaranteed based on just the immigrants intent or actions.

All the K-1's that complain are just bitter because of the time that it takes. What's the actual issue? That a Spouse is immigrating to the USA? It's not like these are criminals or delinquents that shouldn't be in the USA.

The same people that complain about how K-1's/CR-1's should be easier and take too long are the same people that complain about how AOS is so easy/cheating/illegal and should be banned, ETC. What a joke.

In obvious cases where people have done paperwork ahead of time, lied to CBP and were obviously deceptive, AOS cases do get denied. Other than that, I don't think it's much of an issue.

[spn1025 38]

.

Edited January 21, 2013 by spn1025

[Little_My 463]

I've seen many of these conversations on these boards, and to be honest, they never result in anything except useless and mean-spirited debating over an issue that people will never, ever agree on. The thing is, that immigration, particularly for marriage, is an extremely emotional issue - and emotional people rarely make rational judgements or arguments.

My two cents into this debate, however, is this: Not everyone sees America as the paradise that it is always portrayed as in these conversations. This debate starts from the assumption that everyone enters a relationship with an American with the end goal of immigrating and permanently moving to America, and that every foreign spouse of an American wants to get to the US as quickly, easily, and cheaply as possible - for which the AOS option is of course the most covenient route.

This is not always the case. Don't get me wrong - I love many things about America. I fully understand the priviledged situation I am in, as a foreign spouse of an American, to be able to work, live, study and stay there pretty much for as long as we choose. But this was not what I came after. I did not fall in love with America - I fell in love with a person, an individual, who happened to be from America. I did not want to immigrate to America - but in our particular situation, given our professional backgrounds, given the fact that he does not speak Finnish and I am native level in English, at this point in our lives America made more sense. It was a logistical decision - but I didn't choose America. I chose a person. And had I not fallen in love with this particular individual, I would have never looked into immigrating to the US. When I came to the US on a student visa almost four years ago, we had not even entertained the possibility of marriage, not to mention immigration - nothing related to that had ever been brought up in conversations. We got engaged a year before I graduated, and at the time of my graduation, marriage was the natural first step. Not because I desperately needed a route to stay in the US - I could have gone for OPT. Not because that was the only way for me to return to the US - I come from a very low fraud, VWP country. I could have easily kept visiting under VWP. We got married because we wanted to get married, and because the time was right.

I am not saying this is the case with everyone else. People come from different backgrounds, differnet countries, different situations. But it annoyes the ####### out of me that everyone always seems to assume that America is always this ultimate paradise that every foreign spouse of an American desperately wants to immigrate to. This isn't always the case. And again - please don't throw any misplaced patriotic anger at me about how I am not appreciative of my situation. I am. America is a great country. But it is not the only great country, not for me, and not for my husband. The world is big. There are many places to discover. And as I said before, I didn't fall in love with America - I fell in love with An American. Immigrating to America wasn't just a priviledge, it was also a sacrifice. I think this side of things is often forgotten in these conversations about fraudulent status adjusters. Life is unpredictable - and I sincerely believe most people just find themselves in love, and then try to make it work. I don't think that is fraudulent - that's just life.

Edited January 21, 2013 by Little_My

[happywife 4]

at least i know 3 people they had dicided to marry their bf before they came here on b2 visas. all in sudden? i do not believe it.

[dekedwin 52]

This is an emotionally charged post. I can understand the opinions of some of the people here, because we live in an area where there are many illegals that appear to be taking advantage of whatever they can related to social services and so on. But, I am not harshly judging those people because many of them are very poor and driven by desperation. I do not judge them or despise them. If they can get here and better their lives that is great, and I can't see where that is hurting me.

As an impartial observer I think there are many angry people on this forum that see the process as taking too long. They are already bitter, hurting, and angry, so they view people AOSing as people who are causing them their inconvinience and pain. Like several people have said on her, life is not fair, but I believe in "LIve and let live." So if someone can legally without getting into trouble with the immigration people, AOS for the visa waver more power to them. The people who are waiting, and waiting, and waiting are becoming angry and this subject makes them more angry.

Someone said that if we are unhappy about procedures then change the laws, and that is a good idea. Even if I have a harder time gaining my goal, I am not going to resent the person who finds acheiving that goal easier. I think some people here just need to calm their nerves, relax, do the best they can, and not allow their personal troubles to drive them to bitterness against other people, such as the ones getting married, and AOSing while being in the country on the visa waver, or other non immigration visas.

[Ismael&Blair 66]

What I recommend to change is if you want to be together, get married in US, go back to your home country and wait for approval of CR1 like anyone else. In case of overstay: this is YOUR responsibility not to overstay visa. If USC decides to marry someone with overstay they have an option to move to another country. Harpa mentions that overstay is not USC fault. What about criminnal history of beneficiary? Or communicable diseases? Or other things that make beneficiary non-admissable?? Should those be forgiven too according to your logic???

[Ismael&Blair 66]

Then extend the courtesy to all USC to have their spouses come to the US while thier I-130 is pending. Wait ...no its not possible to enter the U.S while an I-130 is pending for fear of intent to migrate , huh? I would love for my husband to come on a visitor visa to wait out the decision on our case and interview here in the U.S...but rules are rules , or are they?

It would make a better decision to just close it out entirely and have everyone follow the process the same way.

[Ismael&Blair 66]

This is an emotionally charged post. I can understand the opinions of some of the people here, because we live in an area where there are many illegals that appear to be taking advantage of whatever they can related to social services and so on. But, I am not harshly judging those people because many of them are very poor and driven by desperation. I do not judge them or despise them. If they can get here and better their lives that is great, and I can't see where that is hurting me.

As an impartial observer I think there are many angry people on this forum that see the process as taking too long. They are already bitter, hurting, and angry, so they view people AOSing as people who are causing them their inconvinience and pain. Like several people have said on her, life is not fair, but I believe in "LIve and let live." So if someone can legally without getting into trouble with the immigration people, AOS for the visa waver more power to them. The people who are waiting, and waiting, and waiting are becoming angry and this subject makes them more angry.

Someone said that if we are unhappy about procedures then change the laws, and that is a good idea. Even if I have a harder time gaining my goal, I am not going to resent the person who finds acheiving that goal easier. I think some people here just need to calm their nerves, relax, do the best they can, and not allow their personal troubles to drive them to bitterness against other people, such as the ones getting married, and AOSing while being in the country on the visa waver, or other non immigration visas.

[JTB11 1,079]

All right. I have read most of these posts so if I repeat something that has already been said...my apologies.

I come from one of the countries that can travel on ESTA without a visa. Me and my (now) fiance knew we would eventually get married about a year into our relationship. I had flown to the US in 2011 and 2012 for a stay of about 2.5 months each. He asked me to marry him the day before I was to depart and I have heard of people just staying because they suddenly decided to marry. It was not an option for us....it simply did not feel right, it was spontaneous sure but I came on tourist visa and as such felt I had to leave no matter what. And honestly, it is a good test of our relationship - if we manage to get thru these months of waiting (which now seem to be averaging 7 apparently).....we can get thru anything. Is it hard ? Absolutely ! I left my job so I could visit him before we got engaged and am living off of my savings. I moved, after 12 years of living in Switzerland, back to my parents house in the middle of nowhere but I am willing to do it because I feel it is the correct path.....I hate it very much but as they say "good things come to those who wait".

That being said...this entire discussion is somewhat "pointless"...(my personal opinion)....it is as if people are trying to equalize a system that will not be equal ever...there will always be countries with high fraud potential and countries that "have it easier" as much as there will always be people who make more money than others not because they are so much better but because they were lucky to be born in a country with more opportunities. If we wanted to have an equal system we would have to make sure that everyone has the same thought process that everyone in the world has the morals not to commit fraud but it will simply not happen.

Let's all stick together and wish each other speedy process !

ps: each case is different and if someone stayed on tourist visa and got married - I am happy for you as much as I will be happy for people who get approved before us. And those who commit fraud...remember...karma is a b...ch and it will get you

ps2: now of course should there be any problems with our case I will go absolutely insane but hey...for now, I am zen thanks to visa journey, among others.

[Jarrod&Vicky 17]

Correct me if I'm wrong... But we were advised to do the K1 route instead of adjusting for a B1/B2 (in Argentina we are not part of the VWP anymore and I had my B1/B2 issued many years ago and had been using it) because when you Aos from a tourist visa, even though the chances of everything working out fine are big, you are creating a problem for the family members of the K1 holder. Heard stories (outside of this board) where family members from, in my case, Argentinians, went to get a visitors visa to be able to visit the person on the US and were denied on the simple question "if your family member came and applied for a non immigrant visa and eventually used it to stay (we let them adjust due to marrying to a usc, and as a courtesy to the usc), how can I be sure that you won't be doing the same thing specially now that you have your daughter (or whatever the case may be) in the Country?

This info might be wrong, but just in case, and since we want my parents to be active members in our future children's life here in the US, we went the K1 way. I wouldn't want to jeopardize their chance of getting a B1/B2 visa renewed in their case.

[SAT 9,609]

Wow what a touchy subject. I'm compelled to add my 2 cents. I'm glad my wife was able to adjust from a B2.

Out of high school, she came to the US to visit relatives. She packed 2 suitcases with every intention of returning to Malaysia to attend college. Then she met me, a total stranger.... No fault of hers, I strung her along for the next 7 years. I think it was because I felt she was young, and I wanted to let her get her wildness out of her system. Boy was I wrong, I discovered that I stumbled across a great girl that I must marry. By this time, she was an overstay by 6 to 7 years.

So based on our case, I must defend the fact that she was able to adjust status. At the same time, fraud is fraud. But it's just so difficult to weed out fraud from legitimacy.

[san diego 407]

Thank you very much for your opinions. I think there were enough arguments on both sides. I recommend closing the thread.

[iaia 8]

Did you know that the VWP has removed countries? Argentina and Uraguay recently. Did you know that in some countries its basically impossible to get a visitor visa? This is because of the high amount of fraud. Others paying for the actions of others.

Argentina was removed from the VWP in 2002...that is 11 years ago.

[VanessaTony 3,567]

Argentina was removed from the VWP in 2002...that is 11 years ago.

I'm just quoting what the ESTA page said when I googled it.