Beto O'Rourke says women should be able to choose abortion even the day before birth

[Boris Farage 353]

1 hour ago, laylalex said:

I am not saying that a man should NOT have an opinion on this topic but I AM saying that his opinon should not override that of the woman

So the man gets to have an opinion, but not a meaningful opinion.

 

I was in Washington DC some months ago. Their license plates read "Taxation without representation." Because while Washington DC residents still must pay income tax to the government, they do not have a voice in congress. You want the same thing from men. And if I understand American history correctly, you're on the wrong side of that argument.

 

[TBoneTX 43,057]

Beeto, Beeto [dumb bum dumb bum]

Beeto, Beeto [dumb bum dumb bum]

[Dashinka 23,238]

On ‎9‎/‎7‎/‎2019 at 11:50 PM, yuna628 said:

Let's look at it this way, shall we? A man chooses an abortion (statistically) every time they rape a woman and every time they abandon a woman without taking responsibility for their actions. No babies formed, no abortions chosen.

So in your world a woman would only have the choice of an abortion if she were raped or abandoned?

 

As to the OP topic, why did O'Rourke stop at just the day before, why not the day after, 10 days after?

Edited September 9, 2019 by Bill & Katya

[yuna628 9,528]

14 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

So in your world a woman would only have the choice of an abortion if she were raped or abandoned?

 

As to the OP topic, why did O'Rourke stop at just the day before, why not the day after, 10 days after?

I think I've made my position clear before. I'm not an absolutist in this regard.

In cases of rape, incest, abuse, and abandonment such decisions should be entirely up to the woman.

In many and most other cases decisions about abortions are made together with loving couples every single day. There is little dispute or conflict in those cases and it is often a difficult decision for that couple.

In other cases, especially young teenage mothers, decisions in this regard are sometimes forced via peer pressure, and the shame and embarrassment of from their church or parents. There's little help or compassion for the youngin' even if they want to keep it. In some cases the parents even force it. Thankfully this statistic is actually going down, but it still happens.

 

[Dashinka 23,238]

1 minute ago, yuna628 said:

I think I've made my position clear before. I'm not an absolutist in this regard.

In cases of rape, incest, abuse, and abandonment such decisions should be entirely up to the woman.

In many and most other cases decisions about abortions are made together with loving couples every single day. There is little dispute or conflict in those cases and it is often a difficult decision for that couple.

In other cases, especially young teenage mothers, decisions in this regard are sometimes forced via peer pressure, and the shame and embarrassment of from their church or parents. There's little help or compassion for the youngin' even if they want to keep it. In some cases the parents even force it. Thankfully this statistic is actually going down, but it still happens.

 

I think the point is that even though a loving couple may make a decision, in reality the male in that couple has no real say.  In that case with the abortion choice completely in the woman's court, then she really should be the responsible party when it comes to reproductive choices she makes.

[yuna628 9,528]

14 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

I think the point is that even though a loving couple may make a decision, in reality the male in that couple has no real say.  In that case with the abortion choice completely in the woman's court, then she really should be the responsible party when it comes to reproductive choices she makes.

Let me put it this way. I have long struggled with reproductive issues, and before starting treatment it was highly unlikely that I would conceive using any natural method or without some sort of help. This disorder for many women actually makes it very hard to determine if you are pregnant at all. For many years, I had no way of knowing. Store tests aren't the answer either, as many throw up false positives with this issue. My risk of ectopic pregnancy, miscarriage, or illness etc are all very high. If it ever happened that I was in this situation, it would be a decision that would be made together. My husband would have a say, as I value and respect his opinion, he values and respects mine. He went through this situation enough with his own sister. Everyone and anyone had a say to the point her voice got lost in the mix, she nearly died under the irresponsible care of the NHS, and the resulting baby suffered an agonizing death a few hours after it was born - leading to the trauma of all parties involved that they will never forget. Abortion and the choices of why and how you got there is rarely ever black and white.

 

Men and women equally make choices whenever they choose to have sex (the word here is choose - not in cases where bodily autonomy is stolen). No method is fullproof and babies can always result. Both sexes often pressure each other to spend a few moments of passion and think little beyond what could result. Don't want such questions to ever come up? Don't have sex. I am of course an old fashioned woman in this regard.

Edited September 9, 2019 by yuna628

[Dashinka 23,238]

4 minutes ago, yuna628 said:

Let me put it this way. I have long struggled with reproductive issues, and before starting treatment it was highly unlikely that I would conceive using any natural method or without some sort of help. This disorder for many women actually makes it very hard to determine if you are pregnant at all. For many years, I had no way of knowing. Store tests aren't the answer either, as many throw up false positives with this issue. My risk of ectopic pregnancy, miscarriage, or illness etc are all very high. If it ever happened that I was in this situation, it would be a decision that would be made together. My husband would have a say, as I value and respect his opinion, he values and respects mine. He went through this situation enough with his own sister. Everyone and anyone had a say to the point her voice got lost in the mix, she nearly died under the irresponsible care of the NHS, and the resulting baby suffered an agonizing death a few hours after it was born - leading to the trauma of all parties involved that they will never forget. Abortion and the choices of why and how you got there is rarely ever black and white.

 

Men and women equally make choices whenever they choose to have sex (the word here is choose - not in cases where bodily autonomy is stolen). No method is fullproof and babies can always result. Both sexes often pressure each other to spend a few moments of passion and think little beyond what could result. Don't want such questions to ever come up? Don't have sex. I am of course an old fashioned woman in this regard.

Only because you gave him that say.

[yuna628 9,528]

2 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

Only because you gave him that say.

 And? Millions of loving couples give their spouses a say every day. We rarely disagree on most topics, even if we approach a subject from a different perspective. I made a good choice of a man, after learning the hard way in my youth. He never has to demand a say nor do I have to 'permit' him, he knows he has; it's a part of the marriage vows.

[Ban Hammer 12,835]

On 9/7/2019 at 11:15 PM, yuna628 said:

 

In short - don't have the sex, and you won't create babies, then you don't have anything to worry about. So many potential babies saved!

that's what many pro lifers say!

[Dashinka 23,238]

2 hours ago, yuna628 said:

 And? Millions of loving couples give their spouses a say every day. We rarely disagree on most topics, even if we approach a subject from a different perspective. I made a good choice of a man, after learning the hard way in my youth. He never has to demand a say nor do I have to 'permit' him, he knows he has; it's a part of the marriage vows.

Yes, that is what would be called a very healthy relationship, and I am glad that is what you have. But how many dysfunctional relationships are there in the US alone where again, all the power for the decision to have an abortion is in the woman’s hands and they do not ask for any input from the spouse?

[yuna628 9,528]

30 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

Yes, that is what would be called a very healthy relationship, and I am glad that is what you have. But how many dysfunctional relationships are there in the US alone where again, all the power for the decision to have an abortion is in the woman’s hands and they do not ask for any input from the spouse?

I don't believe in government regulation over our bodies, relationships, and relationship decisions. Abortion is a legal action in this country with certain guidelines in place, and while many would like other people to make better decisions and choices before it may reach that point, there are many reasons why a person would seek one, with or without further communication with her partner (such as abuse, rape, incest etc). We, as a society have a lot of work to do if we want people to make different decisions - but it's not one that can be done through government regulation. Much like we've discussed in other threads - prohibition does not work - and in countries where it is very difficult or prohibited to obtain... women die needlessly every day and babies are abandoned. I do not believe that abortion is a casual decision taken by most women. There may be that perspective by some.. and lobbying groups have tried hard to push such attitudes across all women as a label, instead of addressing causes of why women seek one. Dysfunctional relationships usually result in the man or women 'skipping out'. In many cases the woman is left with nothing, and the dude doesn't care about any surviving babies he helped create, or any that are forming. This is especially true in many teenage cases. Some in fact, force or pressure the woman to seek an abortion under threat of the destruction of the relationship. I would say if a woman is going to lie to their boyfriend or spouse about obtaining an abortion - the relationship overall has massive problems. Abuse and fear could be one of those factors.

 

These are stories of couples that chose to have abortions, the majority of which seemed to have come to the decision together. It also sounds like for many it was a difficult one, some had deep emotions for years afterwards.

Edited September 9, 2019 by yuna628

[TBoneTX 43,057]

Look what else Beeto is thinking/saying:

https://dailycaller.com/2019/09/09/beto-o-rourke-door-to-door-gun-buyback/

On 9/8/2019 at 2:09 AM, TBoneTX said:

Beeto, Beeto [dumb bum dumb bum]

Beeto, Beeto [dumb bum dumb bum]

 

[Dashinka 23,238]

14 hours ago, yuna628 said:

I don't believe in government regulation over our bodies, relationships, and relationship decisions. Abortion is a legal action in this country with certain guidelines in place, and while many would like other people to make better decisions and choices before it may reach that point, there are many reasons why a person would seek one, with or without further communication with her partner (such as abuse, rape, incest etc). We, as a society have a lot of work to do if we want people to make different decisions - but it's not one that can be done through government regulation. Much like we've discussed in other threads - prohibition does not work - and in countries where it is very difficult or prohibited to obtain... women die needlessly every day and babies are abandoned. I do not believe that abortion is a casual decision taken by most women. There may be that perspective by some.. and lobbying groups have tried hard to push such attitudes across all women as a label, instead of addressing causes of why women seek one. Dysfunctional relationships usually result in the man or women 'skipping out'. In many cases the woman is left with nothing, and the dude doesn't care about any surviving babies he helped create, or any that are forming. This is especially true in many teenage cases. Some in fact, force or pressure the woman to seek an abortion under threat of the destruction of the relationship. I would say if a woman is going to lie to their boyfriend or spouse about obtaining an abortion - the relationship overall has massive problems. Abuse and fear could be one of those factors.

 

These are stories of couples that chose to have abortions, the majority of which seemed to have come to the decision together. It also sounds like for many it was a difficult one, some had deep emotions for years afterwards.

I think that is what the topic of this thread is all about.  Mr. O'Rourke is advocating abortion up to birth, the governor of Virginia says even if a baby survives abortion, they can sort of let it die.  Good old Bernie wants to employ forced abortions in the 3rd world (not sure how he would do this other than to entice foreign governments to do this in order to get US monetary aid) to fight climate change.  The thread has morphed into a discussion as to if the man has a say, and this has already been answered, the man only has a say if the woman gives him that say.  Regardless, I will go back to my earlier question, if the Dems are now advocating abortion to the point of birth, why stop there, why not give women the right to kill their baby after birth, or even after a period of time if for instance they show signs of Downs, or other congenital defect that was not detected during the pregnancy?

[Dashinka 23,238]

2 hours ago, TBoneTX said:

Look what else Beeto is thinking/saying:

https://dailycaller.com/2019/09/09/beto-o-rourke-door-to-door-gun-buyback/

 

OK, didn't have to go any further than the headline here, is a "mandatory" buyback really a buyback, or simply government confiscation?

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

4 hours ago, Bill & Katya said:

OK, didn't have to go any further than the headline here, is a "mandatory" buyback really a buyback, or simply government confiscation?

Again I ask... how can the government buy BACK guns it never even sold?  

 

Also, with all the mental instability I see from so many elected officials, I don't see it as a good idea to put so many guns in their hands.

 

And last but not least, I'd like to remind ANYONE who supports giving our guns to the government what these three gentlemen accomplished when it happened under their control...