Inadmissible for admitting smoking weed

[K24z7 2]

Hello everyone,

I've been a a lurker on these fourms for quite some time. Finally could use some advice/guidance myself :/

 

My fiance, whom is Taiwanese, visited me in the U.S. 3 times prior to incident with no issues. Aug 24, 2015, Customs denied her entry. She was on a ESTA visa but they claimed she was trying to work in the U.S. and stay longer than anticipated. Visa was still valid and they didn't think she had enough money to stay with me almost a month. After that, they also took her phone and found a picture of some herb I'd shown her. At the time I had a California legal medical marijuana card (expired 2 years ago and I quit it) She admitted to trying it only twice and definitely didn't enjoy smoking at all. They forcibly/confiscated and  searched her phone, bombarding her with questions. She has no criminal record in Taiwan at all, nor never been in trouble with the law. It's borderline death penalty for these things in Asia I hear. There is no way she would ever jeopardize herself like that, she simply tried it out of curiosity.  Unfortunately being honest bit her in the butt. She has a clean record as do I myself. They didnt give her any paperwork and said she wasn't banned but had to apply for a waiver. The only paper she signed was the conversation between the officer and her.

We have been together 6.5 years and trying to apply for a K1 visa now, we are engaged with a ring. It kills me reading online regarding permanent bans for admissions of prior useage/simply trying it out of curiosity. She hasn't attempted to get a visa/visit since the incident. Ive visited her 8 times now since she was denied. Should we proceed with the K1 visa? Her passport is stamped both 212(a)(2)(A)(i)(II) / 212(a)(7)(A)(i)(I). Officer told her she wasn't banned and was very understanding of this issue, as it occurs often apparently. She was told she had to apply for a waiver and was not sent off with anything other than a passport stamp with the listed codes above.

They cancelled the ESTA visa, almost 3 years later we are ready for the next step in our lives, marriage/family etc. We've contacted online lawyer's whom said she had to apply for a Waiver after the K1 application process and a lawyer would be highly advised. I just want some advice from some real people not looking to 4500+ for filing fees etc.. I'm not willing to throw us away, I've even signed up for Mandarin classes in preparation for the worst case scenario, moving to her.  I've read online i601 and 212 (h) waivers are possible? Is it even worth it to procceed with the K-1 visa process? I've also read it's up to the medical examiner/K1 visa interviewer to ultimiatly make a final decision regardless of passport codes? If one can prove they're not an abuser/user/clean drug tests/or a threat to the country, it greatly helps. Advice would be greatly appreciated. Please:/... Thank you kindly 

Edited June 22, 2018 by K24z7

[sunshinelove 52]

So I googled what they stamped in her passport and this is what I found. It says, "Foreign nationals may be inadmissible if CBP believes the foreign national intends to remain in the US permanently but does not have a dual intent nonimmigrant visa nor an immigrant visa." To me that entry denial has more to do with the fact they thought she was going to come here to stay and work and not just visit, moreso than having anything to do with weed. I'm not sure exactly how harsh they will be, but I don't think they would deny someone a visa for just trying pot a couple times. If she was involved in selling it or other major drug related crimes, then that would be a different story. If I were you, I wouldn't stress on it too much. I don't see this getting in the way of her coming to the US on a K1. 

[K24z7 2]

Thank you very much for your feedback sunshinelove.  It's definitely a breath of fresh air. We have been doing research for weeks/months reading absolute worst case scenerios galore. Horribly stressing ourselves out. I would imagine as well as long as one isn't an abuser/user, admitting to trying it wouldn't dictate permanent bans. Pending waivers and honesty.  Again, thank you for your response.

[Alabamak1 688]

@K24z7 remember there is a question in the medical exam where they ask if you ever used drugs. Not to shoot your dreams down, but you might get a delay for 1 year as I understand it

[geowrian 22,344]

Was she allowed to withdraw her application for admission or was she issued an expedited deportation?

If it's the former, then she's fine to apply for the visa and she won't have a bar.

If it's the latter, then there is a 5 year bar in play that you can either let expire or waive it via an I-212. That said, timing-wise, it sounds like letting it expire would be simpler.

 

Don't be surprised if she is asked about having ever used drugs during the medical, in which case there may or may not be a 1 year bar, or a psychological evaluation.

 

58 minutes ago, K24z7 said:

Unfortunately being honest bit her in the butt.

Actually, it likely saved her from a permanent bar. Always be honest with anybody in immigration...misrepresentation is never a good idea.

[K24z7 2]

1 hour ago, Alabamak1 said:

@K24z7 remember there is a question in the medical exam where they ask if you ever used drugs. Not to shoot your dreams down, but you might get a delay for 1 year as I understand it

Thank you for your response. The medical examiner ultimately can make or break the situation? Pending the possibility of issued drug tests they might administer? I've read online people go to clinics and take continuous drug tests (hair, nail, urine, blood) over the course of X amount of time prior to examination to prove they are 100% clean.  A possibility to help our case as well?

[K24z7 2]

1 hour ago, geowrian said:

Was she allowed to withdraw her application for admission or was she issued an expedited deportation?

If it's the former, then she's fine to apply for the visa and she won't have a bar.

If it's the latter, then there is a 5 year bar in play that you can either let expire or waive it via an I-212. That said, timing-wise, it sounds like letting it expire would be simpler.

 

Don't be surprised if she is asked about having ever used drugs during the medical, in which case there may or may not be a 1 year bar, or a psychological evaluation.

 

Actually, it likely saved her from a permanent bar. Always be honest with anybody in immigration...misrepresentation is never a good idea.

Thank you for responding. Unfortunately, she was held in a waiting room type of place for about half the day. Then they sent her off on Customs expense. So i guess to answer your question, yes expedited deportation. 

 

An online lawyer had mentioned it's possible to mail out a waiver with the initial K1 at the same time. I've only heard that from one of the many who have given free basic consultation. Which they don't elaborate to much, understandable. Might that be a possibility as well sending both a waiver and K1 at once? I do realize waiting might be ideal but we want to get the ball rolling.

 

I'm really hoping both the medical/K1 interviewer can really really see her character and the innocent personality she possesses, not reflecting what's stamped on her passport.

 

Indeed, honesty is key. My apologies.

[Chris Duffy 1,257]

5 hours ago, K24z7 said:

Thank you for your response. The medical examiner ultimately can make or break the situation? Pending the possibility of issued drug tests they might administer? I've read online people go to clinics and take continuous drug tests (hair, nail, urine, blood) over the course of X amount of time prior to examination to prove they are 100% clean.  A possibility to help our case as well?

They don't ban people from Asia for admitted weed usage. A few years ago it was lifetime ban depending on the country.  Now of days at least in Philippines if you admit to sampling weed you get to go to "Psychologic Counseling".

 

I wouldn't be too concern regarding the weed issue. 

[Teemo 252]

It pisses me off how CBP sometimes treats the issue of weed CONSUMPTION in the past, as opposed to weed POSSESSION at the border which obviously is a much much bigger deal.  Canada just legalized recreational weed, so CBP better be prepared for 40m people from their nearest and dearest ally having committed the "crime" of weed smoking in their lives, and not ask about it or care about it. Unfortunately I think we are in line to see some horror stories. 

[geowrian 22,344]

12 hours ago, K24z7 said:

Thank you for responding. Unfortunately, she was held in a waiting room type of place for about half the day. Then they sent her off on Customs expense. So i guess to answer your question, yes expedited deportation. 

 

An online lawyer had mentioned it's possible to mail out a waiver with the initial K1 at the same time. I've only heard that from one of the many who have given free basic consultation. Which they don't elaborate to much, understandable. Might that be a possibility as well sending both a waiver and K1 at once? I do realize waiting might be ideal but we want to get the ball rolling.

 

I'm really hoping both the medical/K1 interviewer can really really see her character and the innocent personality she possesses, not reflecting what's stamped on her passport.

That's not necessarily the case. They could have detained her and refused entry without an expedited deportation. She should have received a piece of paper stating if she was withdrawing her application for entry, or if she was being issued an expedited deportation. It's very weird that she didn't have or sign either such paper...? At the same time, it's confusing that the officer said she didn't have a ban but she would need a waiver.

 

The actual part of the INA that she was refused under was 212(a)(7)(A)(i)(I), which falls under immigrant intent, not anything related to drugs. This refusal can be with or without an expedited deportation, so it doesn't help on that part, but I don't think the drug aspect of it is an issue for a waiver.

 

If she was issued an expedited deportation, an I-212 can be filed before the interview. If she is inadmissible, then an I-601 would be needed after the interview. Both circumstances are not, IMHO, a reason to avoid trying for a visa. A well presented waiver goes a long way, so it would be a delay and extra cost, but not really a brick wall standing in your path.

 

I think the first step is getting the full details of what happened and if she was actually issued an expedited deportation or not. You can also look into a FOIA request to pull her records while waiting out the processing timelines.

 

As for the medical, they may or may not refer her to an evaluation and subject her to a 1 year bar/waiting period to verify that she is clean. Or they may not do it, or do it for a shorter period...nobody can know what they will determine beforehand. The CO will look at the results of the medical and go from there based upon the law.

 

Best wishes.

 

6 minutes ago, Teemo said:

It pisses me off how CBP sometimes treats the issue of weed CONSUMPTION in the past, as opposed to weed POSSESSION at the border which obviously is a much much bigger deal.  Canada just legalized recreational weed, so CBP better be prepared for 40m people from their nearest and dearest ally having committed the "crime" of weed smoking in their lives, and not ask about it or care about it. Unfortunately I think we are in line to see some horror stories. 

The issue is the INA. CBP is responsible for enforcement of the law...while some officers are certainly more lax than others, they are required to follow the letter of the law + policies.

So we would need to either see a policy change (or EO) to basically not enforce those provisions of the law (good luck with that...), or congressional intervention to change the law (which is even less likely).

[K24z7 2]

On 6/22/2018 at 9:38 AM, geowrian said:

That's not necessarily the case. They could have detained her and refused entry without an expedited deportation. She should have received a piece of paper stating if she was withdrawing her application for entry, or if she was being issued an expedited deportation. It's very weird that she didn't have or sign either such paper...? At the same time, it's confusing that the officer said she didn't have a ban but she would need a waiver.

 

The actual part of the INA that she was refused under was 212(a)(7)(A)(i)(I), which falls under immigrant intent, not anything related to drugs. This refusal can be with or without an expedited deportation, so it doesn't help on that part, but I don't think the drug aspect of it is an issue for a waiver.

 

If she was issued an expedited deportation, an I-212 can be filed before the interview. If she is inadmissible, then an I-601 would be needed after the interview. Both circumstances are not, IMHO, a reason to avoid trying for a visa. A well presented waiver goes a long way, so it would be a delay and extra cost, but not really a brick wall standing in your path.

 

I think the first step is getting the full details of what happened and if she was actually issued an expedited deportation or not. You can also look into a FOIA request to pull her records while waiting out the processing timelines.

 

As for the medical, they may or may not refer her to an evaluation and subject her to a 1 year bar/waiting period to verify that she is clean. Or they may not do it, or do it for a shorter period...nobody can know what they will determine beforehand. The CO will look at the results of the medical and go from there based upon the law.

 

Best wishes.

 

The issue is the INA. CBP is responsible for enforcement of the law...while some officers are certainly more lax than others, they are required to follow the letter of the law + policies.

So we would need to either see a policy change (or EO) to basically not enforce those provisions of the law (good luck with that...), or congressional intervention to change the law (which is even less likely).

Your insight and advice is extremely appreciated and valued, thank you kindly.

 

Let me clarify a bit. She was on a "working holiday" in Australia, I'm sure you're familiar with that term. She was working there for 2 years all over the country successfully. During that holiday her and her friend, chose to visit me. Their flight path to Los Angleles was Melbourne to Brisbane on Virgin air. After that, a connecting flight the same day was on Delta Airlines from Brisbane to Los Angeles.

 

Upon arrival, they both passed through the first stage of customs successfully.  After passing customs, they proceeded to get their luggage. There was an issue with the airline routing bags incorrectly, it wasn't just their bags (Her friend didn't get her bags for a week. I had to pick up my fiances bags in LA and send it to her, while she was in Taiwan). It was the majority of the flight. She, my fiance, did have a carry on bag which she had in her possession. Fiance and her friend both had to go to the lost and found which they issued them a paper pretty much saying the airline made a mistake misrouting bags.

 

On the final step when you exit the airport. The officer stands taking decleration of good forums/checking bags began asking her where my fiances bags where. She presented him with the lost and found form, the officer then sent her to a second checkpoint.

 

Her friend was on working holiday visa which had just began, so she was going back to Australia to work after the L.A. trip. My fiance on the other hand, her working holiday had come to an end so she chose to visit me before going back to her home country in Taiwan. Her friend successfully passed the final stage of customs and was given the given the green light to pass through successfully. My fiance was sent to a second check point as stated.

 

At that second checkpoint, they began questioning my fiance as to where her bags were, how long she was staying, how much money she has for this trip, and proceeded to search her carry on. One of the contents of her carry on was resume which was for a school project, not a real resume.  They began questioning her more and she had to explain what the resume was for. It was a school project helping them pretty much find work around Australia. Everything listed on the resume was regarding Australian addresses etc. 

 

After the resume issue, they began questioning more and more. They came to the conclusion she was trying to work in U.S. illegally. (She was supposed to visit me for a month on her valid ESTA visa). Which they cancelled her ESTA. The questioning led to them checking her bank accounts and her phone.  Once they searched her phone they saw the picture of weed I had shown her. 

 

Immediately they flipped off of that and sent her to a small waiting room.  In that waiting room she was called into a customs officers office, which proceeded to ask her several more questions off a checklist face to face.  One of them being "Have you ever smoked weed", which she honestly answered "Yes, I've tried it once and didn't like it". They began questioning her where/how she would possibly commend with smoking.  At the time, I had  legal marajuana card. They started asking why I (me) doesn't go to a doctor for my back pain rather than using a medical card (expired 2 years ago) etc. Which she had no answer for. She told the officers she didn't know state laws differed. They then asked if she smoked for pleasure or curiosity.  Curiosity obviously.

 

The officers treated her with alot of decency and respect ironically during that process. Her English is actually really well, so she was able to stand her ground. They offered her a translator at first from Chinese to English which she wilfully accepted. The problem is, fiance had told the translator she had to go back to Taiwan on her return date listed on her ticket for her cousins wedding. Translator translated to the officers it was for my fiances wedding. Translator was actually translating the wrong thing/words to the officers from Chinese to English!. My fiance immediately told them she doesn't need the translator and spoke freely in English.

 

The only paper she signed was the conversation between the customs interviewer and her. My fiance asked if she was charged with a crime or convicted of something etc. Officer responded by saying "No charges, but there is now a record on file with U.S customs of this incident". The record only stays with the U.S. and doesn't follow her anywhere else. They asked her if U.S. customs wanted to contact her Taiwanese embassy to make sure she wasn't under any threat answering their questions etc (part of her rights supposedly). She declined, officer stated "If you don't mention this incident to any country, nobody will know. Strictly on file with the U.S.".  Officer interviewing her was at the end of his shift and offered kindly to get her back to her country in Taiwan. He passed her onto another officer who was Taiwanese himself, which was comforting to her. Taiwanese officer off the record/on a more personal note said not to mention to her country because then her country would have a record of her smoking weed.

 

They specifically stated she wasn't banned. My fiance did ask that question if she was banned or not. She also asked if she would be allowed to visit me again, which the officer responded "Yes, with a waiver, since you're not a criminal or have anything on your criminal record. You are fine." They then stamped her passport with the following codes listed in my inital post.

 

What sucked horribly is, I myself an Airline employee was at work that day across the airport terminals. She texted me telling me she was outside with the officers who escorted her to her new flight. The officers allowed her to wait for me for a little with their supervision. I bolted across the airport, steel toe boots and all just to hold her in my arms for a few minutes. Excuse my language, it ###### sucked.

 

As for the flight home after being held half the day, she did not pay for her trip home. Customs didn't send her to Australia as her final destination, her returning ticket was to Taiwan. They actually routed her from LAX/AUSTRALIA/SINGAPORE, final destination to Taiwan. Didn't cost her a dime nor did an airline seek payments for airfare afterwards.

 

Upon arrival to Taiwan. Her customs officers why she got sent back and she replied "They didn't think i had enough money to stay there so they denied me" she was successfully admitted to her country.

 

3 years later I've visited her 8 times. Currently here in Taiwan for 2 months putting together our K1 applications. 

 

As for the FOIA, I most definitely will look into it. As you've stated with the immigrant intent I understand it more clearly after researching . Now hopefully I gave you more insight as to what happend. Maybe you might have some extra insight into it as well. It seems to supersede the admitting of trying weed moreso they thought she was coming here illegally to work. I feel like they just tacked it on as well on top of the initial immigrant intent.

 

If you've read all of this, again, I greatly appreciate it. Thank you kindly.

 

Edited June 24, 2018 by K24z7

[Jen&Cal 85]

Hello! This is a little similar to our situation. My fiancee came to visit me on an ESTA and was turned back due to him mentioning getting work. They told him he is banned from using the ESTA in the future. However, they told him that he would just need to come back on the appropriate visa. They gave him a form and told us to present it once we apply for the visa. We are filing the K1 now. From what I have researched and from the lawyers I have spoken to, this is not an issue. Even though he is banned from ESTA - it is just a waiver so all he needs is the K1 and it won't cause any issues.

 

Now the medical exam does inquire about past drug use. My fiancee has done LCD and it is dictated in his medical record. I've seen many people advocate that you should lie and deny prior drug use. However, that can get you permanently banned. I am not sure about other embassys but I have been in contact with someone who went through the London embassy admitting to similar drug charges and all he had to do was pass a drug test.

From what I've seen the worst they will do is ban you for a year but I think that is only if you fail the drug test. 

 

I don't think you two will have issues applying for K1. We were very worried at first but after talking to many we are confident.

 

Thanks!

[geowrian 22,344]

On 6/23/2018 at 9:43 PM, K24z7 said:

...

As for the FOIA, I most definitely will look into it. As you've stated with the immigrant intent I understand it more clearly after researching . Now hopefully I gave you more insight as to what happend. Maybe you might have some extra insight into it as well. It seems to supersede the admitting of trying weed moreso they thought she was coming here illegally to work. I feel like they just tacked it on as well on top of the initial immigrant intent.

 

If you've read all of this, again, I greatly appreciate it. Thank you kindly.

Thank you for the very detailed description...that certainly clears up some questions. I appreciate the time and effort...rarely do we see such detail here so it's very appreciated.

It does not confirm that it was not an expedited deportation, but I really don't think that was the case...it sounds like she was only denied entry. Assuming so, then no waiver is necessary.

 

As noted, the prior drug usage will need to be disclosed, which may or may not result in a bar. I don't think the UK medical center is too strict on this like with some countries (i.e. Jamaica is notorious for doing a 1 year bar with minimal past usage, SLEC (Manila, Philippines) refers you to a psych evaluation with any past usage, etc.), but it's just something to be aware of as a possibility.

 

It won't hurt to do a FOIA, and it's not expensive (like up to ~$25 based on the # of pages photocopied I think?). Although based on what you've stated, it may not do  much since it sounds like she was only denied entry.

[K24z7 2]

On 6/25/2018 at 9:56 AM, geowrian said:

Thank you for the very detailed description...that certainly clears up some questions. I appreciate the time and effort...rarely do we see such detail here so it's very appreciated.

It does not confirm that it was not an expedited deportation, but I really don't think that was the case...it sounds like she was only denied entry. Assuming so, then no waiver is necessary.

 

As noted, the prior drug usage will need to be disclosed, which may or may not result in a bar. I don't think the UK medical center is too strict on this like with some countries (i.e. Jamaica is notorious for doing a 1 year bar with minimal past usage, SLEC (Manila, Philippines) refers you to a psych evaluation with any past usage, etc.), but it's just something to be aware of as a possibility.

 

It won't hurt to do a FOIA, and it's not expensive (like up to ~$25 based on the # of pages photocopied I think?). Although based on what you've stated, it may not do  much since it sounds like she was only denied entry.

Thankyou,

 

Easier to get it all out to paint a clearer picture. We are proceeding with the K1 being the cancelation of her ESTA will not adversely affect the K1 application.

 

Filing ourselves without a lawyer, saving quoted costs of 4500 US dollars for their prep and filing fees. If a waiver is needed, we will hit that bump in the road when if it happens pending final interview and medical review.  Quoted around 3000 dollars to push a waiver through. I can't justify paying 4500 to file something we can manage on our own. A waiver is a different story.

 

One more question pertaining to her admitting of experimenting with marijuana but never being arrested or charged with a crime. (Just a passport code stamped). We are currently filling out the K1 application.  What box would be advised to check for 4a and 2c on the i-129 under "Part 3 Criminal Information"?

 

4a-"Have you ever been arrested, cited, charged, indicted, convicted, fined, or imprisoned for breaking or violating any law or ordinance in any country, excluding traffic violations (unless a traffic violation was alcohol- or drug- related or involved with a crime of 500 dollars or more"? Yes__. No__.

 

2c- "Three or more arrests or convictions, not from a single act, for crimes relating to a controlled substance or alcohol"?

 

I've checked "No", just curious what you think.

 

Thank you

 

 

[sunshinelove 52]

If all she did was try a little out of curiosity but never got in any legal trouble with the cops (which I'm assuming she hasn't) then you'd put "no".