[Master Thread] Federal & State Charges Against Pres. Trump

[Family 3,558]

Trump sought to ‘exploit the violence and chaos’ of Jan. 6 with lies, indictment says

Kevin Breuninger

Dan Mangan

 

WASHINGTON — Former President Donald Trump was criminally chargedTuesday with illegally conspiring to overturn his election loss to President Joe Biden in 2020.

Trump was indicted on four federal felony charges that centered on his alleged efforts to discount legitimate votes in the 2020 presidential race and subvert the election itself.

The

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/08/01/trump-indictment-live-updates-former-president-predicts-charges.html

[Mike E 11,727]

After St George Walker (aka Michelle Obama’s bf) fired a U.S. attorney who failed to indict Democrats whom the GOP believed stole the  2004 WA state gubernatorial election, oddly President Obama did not hunt St W like President Biden hunts Trump.

 

It just goes to show: if you are going to “interfere” with an election, make your successor’s wife your gf first. And the current first lady has history of having a boyfriend while married, so this should have been easy.

 

Sadly Trump was never on speaking terms with St W, and so this valuable wisdom was not imparted.

Edited August 2, 2023 by Mike E

[TBoneTX 43,436]

2 hours ago, Crazy Cat said:

it is a direct assault on Trump's freedom of speech

That was my overriding reaction.  Is the First Amendment now a privilege subject to elite decisions?

[Jericho 28]

3 hours ago, Crazy Cat said:

This latest Jack Smith absurdity is really laughable...but it is a direct assault on Trump's freedom of speech, among other things such as political persecution.  This will go down in flames as it strengthens Trump.  The Biden administration and the other democrats have created a politically motivated DOJ and ridiculous impeachments which will have unintended consequences sooner or later.  Biden will be the useful idiot who pays a price.  If Biden had any sense left (which is pretty obvious), he would pardon Trump.  

 

How does this assault his freedom of speech? Contrary to popular republican opinion, not all speech is covered under the first amendment. In this case, incitement is specifically not covered, as well as false statements are not protected either. To some degree, I do agree with you that many of the charges are inflated, but the mishandling of documents, and the incitement one charges pretty obviously have merit. I guess we'll find out what a jury believes.

[TBoneTX 43,436]

3 minutes ago, Jericho said:

incitement

Good discussion question.  Yet to be resolved:

-- compare Democrats' statements about the 2016 election with these

-- "peacefully and patriotically" doesn't reasonably sound like incitement

-- the disturbance started half a mile away before Trump was finished speaking

-- there's increasing evidence of Federal agents in the crowd at the building

-- no one ever heard of an unarmed insurrection that ended after 4 or so hours.

[Crazy Cat 39,694]

12 minutes ago, Jericho said:

 

How does this assault his freedom of speech? Contrary to popular republican opinion, not all speech is covered under the first amendment. In this case, incitement is specifically not covered, as well as false statements are not protected either. To some degree, I do agree with you that many of the charges are inflated, but the mishandling of documents, and the incitement one charges pretty obviously have merit. I guess we'll find out what a jury believes.

Doesn't matter.  Either the appeals court and/or the SCOTUS will overturn any conviction of these latest charges.  Yes, Trump had freedom of speech to say he thought some state elections were faulty......just like Hillary, Waters, Schumer, and a myriad of looney dems/media did right after the 2016 election.   Hillary grossly mishandles classified document....as did Biden...Hillary actually destroyed evidence.   WHERE ARE THE CHARGES??????   There is a two-tiered justice system in this country which must not stand. 

Edited August 2, 2023 by Crazy Cat

[Crazy Cat 39,694]

7 minutes ago, Jericho said:

incitement

Just like Waters and KAMALA HARRIS incited riots during that summer...... WHERE ARE THE CHARGES???????  As I said, Trump is a victim of political persecution because they FEAR him.  

[Family 3,558]

This thread began June 9, 2024 with Trump-Charging Document. 

In the face of hostile takeover , it attempted to nudge a safe haven as Trump-Charges formerly known as Trump-Charging Document.

 

We shall forge ahead, notwithstanding the challenges ..though we are not amused 😂

 

The views , “ attitude “ and spirit of this post are not aligned with Master T     thus we hope there remains a bit of room on VJ ( off topic or hot topics) for a voice of the other half. 
 

Here goes :

 

Could Donald Trump serve as president if convicted?

By Zachary B. Wolf and Jack Forrest, CNN

Updated 8:43 AM EDT, Wed August 2, 2023

 

02:17 - Source: CNN

Fmr. prosecutor: Why it's difficult to send powerful people to prison

 

CNN — 

Donald Trump has been indicted on federal charges related to 2020 election subversion, a stunning third time this year that the former president has faced criminal charges. 

But could the former president, who remains the front-runner for the 2024 Republican presidential nomination, assume the Oval Office again if convicted of the alleged crimes? In short, yes.

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2023/08/01/politics/president-serve-vote-indictment-trump-2020-election/index.html

 

[Jericho 28]

2 minutes ago, Crazy Cat said:

Doesn't matter.  Either the appeals court and/or the SCOTUS will overturn any conviction of these latest charges.  Yes, Trump had freedom of speech to say he thought some state elections were faulty......just like Hillary, Waters, Schumer, and a myriad of traitors did right after the 2016 election.   Hillary grossly mishandles classified document....as did Biden... WHERE ARE THE CHARGES??????   There is a two-tiered justice system in this country which must not stand. 

 

You're missing the finer points of it. Merely suggesting irregularities in the voting, or even saying it's rigged is covered under the first amendment. However, when you have an armed mob at a rally, blocks from the capitol building, and you say "We fight like hell. And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore" , that can very easily be construed as a call to arms. Like I said, we'll have to see what a judge and jury believe.

[Jericho 28]

6 minutes ago, Crazy Cat said:

Just like Waters and KAMALA HARRIS incited riots during that summer...... WHERE ARE THE CHARGES???????  As I said, Trump is a victim of political persecution because they FEAR him.  

 

Where have they said anything to the effect that they are calling on supporters to rise up? You're arguing based on emotion, not facts. There is a definitive difference between political speech, puffery, and incitement.

[TBoneTX 43,436]

7 minutes ago, Jericho said:

an armed mob

But it was not.

7 minutes ago, Jericho said:

"We fight like hell. And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore"

A problem from the beginning remains that people (the media, et al.) take him literally, whereas those who understand him know that he speaks figuratively.  Full context is often either not considered or is willfully deleted to further political agendas.

Edited August 2, 2023 by TBoneTX

[Crazy Cat 39,694]

5 minutes ago, Jericho said:

 

You're missing the finer points of it. Merely suggesting irregularities in the voting, or even saying it's rigged is covered under the first amendment. However, when you have an armed mob at a rally, blocks from the capitol building, and you say "We fight like hell. And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore" , that can very easily be construed as a call to arms. Like I said, we'll have to see what a judge and jury believe.

What a twist!!!  🤣

[Jericho 28]

The only breaches of law that I think really should be looked at is his family's continued breach of the emoluments clause. Not only did he continue to actively run his business' during his administration, but his family used their positions to secure and expand their business' in China and the Middle East. Then there is the fact that Trump forced federal government to use his privately owned properties to house traveling diplomats and government agents. This required the government to finance upgrades to his properties to meet diplomatic travel standards.

[Jericho 28]

1 minute ago, Crazy Cat said:

What a twist!!!  🤣

 

It's not a twist, it's a legal standard.

[TBoneTX 43,436]

3 minutes ago, Jericho said:

Trump forced federal government to use his privately owned properties to house traveling diplomats and government agents. This required the government to finance upgrades to his properties to meet diplomatic travel standards.

Links, please?  The last report that I remember was that the guests paid standard rates, whatever those were (rack, government, something else).  He himself was not involved, apparently.

Edited August 2, 2023 by TBoneTX