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Astrid M

Could I marry my USC spouse on an ESTA?

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2 minutes ago, Astrid M said:

I didnt know this was a different option! How does it differ from filing back home, please?

It's pretty much the same. I-130 is filed by the US citizen. The screenshot above is from the online filing option of I-130. One of the very few differences between filing during visit and filing after is signature on I-130A supplement:

Supplemental Information for Spouse Beneficiary (I-130A)

If you are filing for your spouse, he or she must complete and sign Supplemental Information for Spouse Beneficiary (I-130A). If your spouse is overseas, the I-130A must still be completed, but your spouse does not have to sign the I-130A.

 
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12 minutes ago, Astrid M said:

I didnt know this was a different option! How does it differ from filing back home, please?

 

It is still the same CR1 process.  No procedural difference with filing after you return home, except that there is a section in the I-130 form that you must fill out (I-94 information).  Even so, you still cannot stay in the US to wait out the visa.

 

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22 minutes ago, HRQX said:

It's pretty much the same. I-130 is filed by the US citizen. The screenshot above is from the online filing option of I-130. One of the very few differences between filing during visit and filing after is signature on I-130A supplement:

Supplemental Information for Spouse Beneficiary (I-130A)

If you are filing for your spouse, he or she must complete and sign Supplemental Information for Spouse Beneficiary (I-130A). If your spouse is overseas, the I-130A must still be completed, but your spouse does not have to sign the I-130A.

 
File upload icon
Drag files here or choose a file
Maximum size: 6MB per file
Accepted formats: JPG, JPEG, PDF, TIF, or TIFF
No encrypted or password-protected files
 
Attaching your files
Use a scanner or take pictures of each document. Make sure each image you attach is clear and that all text is readable.
 
Translations
If your documents are in a foreign language, upload an English translation along with the original.
 

 

Either way, the following question is left completely blank:

FB_IMG_1603177415118.jpg

Thank you so much, this is so helpful!

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On 12/14/2020 at 11:36 PM, Lucky Cat said:

Absolutely, it is legal.

Your reply above was to the very first OP question (before she even elaborated on her situation) therefore I just want to address that before someone draws wrong "general" conclusions from your answer.

 

Is it legal? Legal in what sense? You must be unfamiliar with the so called "90 day rule". (used to be 30 or 60 long time ago).

 

Can you marry? sure. But immigration wise you are breaking the rules (purpose) under which you entered US in the first place.

 

It is one thing to enter US, stay over 90 days (even if it means overstay) then marry and do AOS, one way or another. It is completely different to do it within first 90 day timeframe though.

 

It will be extremely hard to convince AO that you entered w/o intention to marry (only business or pleasure) but the marriage "just happened" within 90 days. That's not what "normal" people do and I'm sure AO would look at that as well (subject to specific countries as well).

 

Now, in that particular case, OP explained later that she has been dating this guy and are separated due to covid/proclamations etc, therefore she does have a good explanation (if backed with proper documentation) for AO. Notwithstanding that, everyone else thinking of breaking 90 day rule should understand possible ramifications. "Possible" because in some countries (especially Western) AO's are more lenient.

 

just my $0.02

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43 minutes ago, Punisher said:

Your reply above was to the very first OP question (before she even elaborated on her situation) therefore I just want to address that before someone draws wrong "general" conclusions from your answer.

 

Is it legal? Legal in what sense? You must be unfamiliar with the so called "90 day rule". (used to be 30 or 60 long time ago).

 

Can you marry? sure. But immigration wise you are breaking the rules (purpose) under which you entered US in the first place.

 

It is one thing to enter US, stay over 90 days (even if it means overstay) then marry and do AOS, one way or another. It is completely different to do it within first 90 day timeframe though.

 

It will be extremely hard to convince AO that you entered w/o intention to marry (only business or pleasure) but the marriage "just happened" within 90 days. That's not what "normal" people do and I'm sure AO would look at that as well (subject to specific countries as well).

 

Now, in that particular case, OP explained later that she has been dating this guy and are separated due to covid/proclamations etc, therefore she does have a good explanation (if backed with proper documentation) for AO. Notwithstanding that, everyone else thinking of breaking 90 day rule should understand possible ramifications. "Possible" because in some countries (especially Western) AO's are more lenient.

 

just my $0.02

Did you miss OP saying that she intends to return home after the marriage in that first post ? The 90 day rule is irrelevant in her case as she did not plan to stay and adjust.
 

 

Edited by SusieQQQ
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2 hours ago, Punisher said:

Your reply above was to the very first OP question (before she even elaborated on her situation) therefore I just want to address that before someone draws wrong "general" conclusions from your answer.

 

Is it legal? Legal in what sense? You must be unfamiliar with the so called "90 day rule". (used to be 30 or 60 long time ago).

 

Can you marry? sure. But immigration wise you are breaking the rules (purpose) under which you entered US in the first place.

 

It is one thing to enter US, stay over 90 days (even if it means overstay) then marry and do AOS, one way or another. It is completely different to do it within first 90 day timeframe though.

 

It will be extremely hard to convince AO that you entered w/o intention to marry (only business or pleasure) but the marriage "just happened" within 90 days. That's not what "normal" people do and I'm sure AO would look at that as well (subject to specific countries as well).

 

Now, in that particular case, OP explained later that she has been dating this guy and are separated due to covid/proclamations etc, therefore she does have a good explanation (if backed with proper documentation) for AO. Notwithstanding that, everyone else thinking of breaking 90 day rule should understand possible ramifications. "Possible" because in some countries (especially Western) AO's are more lenient.

 

just my $0.02

In this case, the OP intends to return home after marriage.....perfectly legal.  But, there is no 90 rule for USCIS...... Show me some cases where a couple married within 90 days of entering the US, then were denied adjustment of status.  There are many, many here who have entered via ESTA or a tourist visa, then married within 90 days after their plans changed.  I have seen only ONE case denied.....and that was due to a misrepresentation charge for a specific statement made during a secondary interview at POE.  I have seen ZERO denials due to the fictitious 90 day rule.......the subject is never even addressed at the interview. 

 

The fact is it is illegal to enter the US via a non-immigrant route with the intent to stay and adjust status.  When CBP allows a person to enter via ESTA or a tourist visa, then their intent has been established.  If circumstances change, they can legally marry and apply for adjustment....within 90 days or not.

 

That's my take......Thanks.

Edited by Lucky Cat

"The US immigration process requires a great deal of knowledge, planning, time, patience, and a significant amount of money.  It is quite a journey!"

- Some old child of the 50's & 60's on his laptop 

 

Senior Master Sergeant, US Air Force- Retired (after 20+ years)- Missile Systems Maintenance & Titan 2 ICBM Launch Crew Duty (200+ Alert tours)

Registered Nurse- Retired- I practiced in the areas of Labor & Delivery, Home Health, Adolescent Psych, & Adult Psych.

IT Professional- Retired- Web Site Design, Hardware Maintenance, Compound Pharmacy Software Trainer, On-site go live support, Database Manager, App Designer.

______________________________________

August 7, 2022: Wife filed N-400 Online under 5 year rule.

November 10, 2022: Received "Interview is scheduled" letter.

December 12, 2022:  Received email from Dallas office informing me (spouse) to be there for combo interview.

December 14, 2022: Combo Interview for I-751 and N-400 Conducted.

January 26, 2023: Wife's Oath Ceremony completed at the Plano Event Center, Plano, Texas!!!😁

February 6, 2023: Wife's Passport Application submitted in Dallas, Texas.

March 21, 2023:   Wife's Passport Delivered!!!!

May 15, 2023 (about):  Naturalization Certificate returned from Passport agency!!

 

In summary, it took 13 months for approval of the CR-1.  It took 44 months for approval of the I-751.  It took 4 months for approval of the N-400.   It took 172 days from N-400 application to Oath Ceremony.   It took 6 weeks for Passport, then 7 additional weeks for return of wife's Naturalization Certificate.. 
 

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30 minutes ago, SusieQQQ said:

Did you miss OP saying that she intends to return home after the marriage in that first post ? The 90 day rule is irrelevant in her case as she did not plan to stay and adjust.
 

 

No, I did not "miss" her info in the first post regarding the intention to return home, this is EXACTLY why I reminded about 90 day rule. 90 day rule IS RELEVANT for anybody that will have to go through DOS. Has she not stated in the very first post about returning home then I would assume AOS through USCIS.

 

90 rule is relevant for anyone going through DOS. It is not about whether you planned to stay but whether you seek visa/entry into US that is not with your true intentions. You may enter on ESTA, take illegal employment for 2 months never considering staying over 3 months and you are still breaking the rules!  

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29 minutes ago, Punisher said:

No, I did not "miss" her info in the first post regarding the intention to return home, this is EXACTLY why I reminded about 90 day rule. 90 day rule IS RELEVANT for anybody that will have to go through DOS. Has she not stated in the very first post about returning home then I would assume AOS through USCIS.

 

90 rule is relevant for anyone going through DOS. It is not about whether you planned to stay but whether you seek visa/entry into US that is not with your true intentions. You may enter on ESTA, take illegal employment for 2 months never considering staying over 3 months and you are still breaking the rules!  

Sorry but you are totally wrong. There is absolutely nothing illegal about using tourist status just to get married in the US. It does have after all two of the most famous destination wedding locations in the world, Hawaii and Vegas. Working on tourist status is inconsistent with the conditions of such status. Getting married is not. 

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36 minutes ago, Lucky Cat said:

In this case, the OP intends to return home after marriage.....perfectly legal.  But, there is no 90 rule for USCIS...... Show me some cases where a couple married within 90 days of entering the US, then were denied adjustment of status.  There are many, many here who have entered via ESTA or a tourist visa, then married within 90 days after their plans changed.  I have seen only ONE case denied.....and that was due to a misrepresentation charge for a specific statement made during a secondary interview at POE.  I have seen ZERO denials due to the fictitious 90 day rule.......the subject is never even addressed at the interview. 

 

The fact is it is illegal to enter the US via a non-immigrant route with the intent to stay and adjust status.  When CBP allows a person to enter via ESTA or a tourist visa, then their intent has been established.  If circumstances change, they can legally marry and apply for adjustment....within 90 days or not.

Re-read you reply to me, so perhaps you realize that you are contradicting yourself, not me missing the point.

 

On one hand (including your pre edited post) you say that I'm missing the point (which I'm not) since USCIS does not implement 90 day rule (which is true, DOS does, she intends to return home) then rumble about people that adjust status within 90 day of entry (therefore through USCIS). You can't have it both ways.

 

Stick to the facts! The very first OP's post she said clearly that she intends to return home, therefore do DOS adjustment, therefore it is "possible" 90 day rule would be verified. Later she elaborated about dating etc so she would be possibly OK, but as I stated in the beginning I was against making BLANK statements like you did in your reply.

 

I'm afraid you are missing point on 2 subjects:

 

1. Just because YOU haven't seen/heard something, does that mean that the law is irrelevant? Do you even realize it is the minority of the immigration that leaves its footprint on this (and similar) forums?

 

2. 90 day rule is not whether you stayed in US and tried adjusting status through USCIS,  rather if your intentions when seeking visa and entering US matched your classification and your ACTIONS during first 90 days need to match that as well. No, your plans CAN NOT change on a whim. If the circumstances change, you are supposed to go back, seek new visa and act accordingly (unless you marry and do AOS through USCIS which wouldn't be DOS by definition). See my example given to SusieQQQQ regarding "employment w/o adjustnment/overstay".

 

Again in this particular case OP would be likely be fine during DOS interview (assuming she would be able to complete that feat in the first place: she should state her marriage intentions at POE, which may or may not fly well with CBP) because I'm assuming she would have documentation for DOS interview regarding relationship/dating. But that dating thing didn't come up until later in the thread (which you couldn't know about) and therefore I was against making general blank statements like that.

 

I would claim that people that enter US by mis-stating their true intentions are either going to end up with AOS going through USCIS or very likely to overstay, so even if at some point they have to go back in order to do AOS through DOS, then they have to be very careful what they say during the interview regarding the first 90 days in the US, which is not a problem if you overstayed considerably. Of course, by overstaying you are triggering other bars/bans. 90 day rule is supposed to check whether you broke rules/intentions during your supposed authorized stay.

 

There is enough great info on the internet regarding 90 day rule. I hope that my posts will spark enough interest so that people going through DOS adjustment know what to look out for.

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2 minutes ago, Punisher said:

Re-read you reply to me, so perhaps you realize that you are contradicting yourself, not me missing the point.

 

On one hand (including your pre edited post) you say that I'm missing the point (which I'm not) since USCIS does not implement 90 day rule (which is true, DOS does, she intends to return home) then rumble about people that adjust status within 90 day of entry (therefore through USCIS). You can't have it both ways.

 

Stick to the facts! The very first OP's post she said clearly that she intends to return home, therefore do DOS adjustment, therefore it is "possible" 90 day rule would be verified. Later she elaborated about dating etc so she would be possibly OK, but as I stated in the beginning I was against making BLANK statements like you did in your reply.

 

I'm afraid you are missing point on 2 subjects:

 

1. Just because YOU haven't seen/heard something, does that mean that the law is irrelevant? Do you even realize it is the minority of the immigration that leaves its footprint on this (and similar) forums?

 

2. 90 day rule is not whether you stayed in US and tried adjusting status through USCIS,  rather if your intentions when seeking visa and entering US matched your classification and your ACTIONS during first 90 days need to match that as well. No, your plans CAN NOT change on a whim. If the circumstances change, you are supposed to go back, seek new visa and act accordingly (unless you marry and do AOS through USCIS which wouldn't be DOS by definition). See my example given to SusieQQQQ regarding "employment w/o adjustnment/overstay".

 

Again in this particular case OP would be likely be fine during DOS interview (assuming she would be able to complete that feat in the first place: she should state her marriage intentions at POE, which may or may not fly well with CBP) because I'm assuming she would have documentation for DOS interview regarding relationship/dating. But that dating thing didn't come up until later in the thread (which you couldn't know about) and therefore I was against making general blank statements like that.

 

I would claim that people that enter US by mis-stating their true intentions are either going to end up with AOS going through USCIS or very likely to overstay, so even if at some point they have to go back in order to do AOS through DOS, then they have to be very careful what they say during the interview regarding the first 90 days in the US, which is not a problem if you overstayed considerably. Of course, by overstaying you are triggering other bars/bans. 90 day rule is supposed to check whether you broke rules/intentions during your supposed authorized stay.

 

There is enough great info on the internet regarding 90 day rule. I hope that my posts will spark enough interest so that people going through DOS adjustment know what to look out for.

Your entire argument seems to be predicated on the belief that OP plans to misrepresent her intention for visiting in the US. Where does she say that?

 

Also there is no such thing as “DOS adjustment”!!! What on earth do you think you are talking about when you say that? Adjustment takes place inside the US via USCIS.  Visa issuance takes place outside the US via DoS. “DOS adjustment” does not exist. Great info indeed lol 

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Filed: Citizen (apr) Country: Taiwan
Timeline
3 minutes ago, Punisher said:

Stick to the facts! The very first OP's post she said clearly that she intends to return home, therefore do DOS adjustment, therefore it is "possible" 90 day rule would be verified. Later she elaborated about dating etc so she would be possibly OK, but as I stated in the beginning I was against making BLANK statements like you did in your reply.

What the OP intended is 100% legal. ...thus, my answer was correct.    What is a "DOS adjustment"??

"The US immigration process requires a great deal of knowledge, planning, time, patience, and a significant amount of money.  It is quite a journey!"

- Some old child of the 50's & 60's on his laptop 

 

Senior Master Sergeant, US Air Force- Retired (after 20+ years)- Missile Systems Maintenance & Titan 2 ICBM Launch Crew Duty (200+ Alert tours)

Registered Nurse- Retired- I practiced in the areas of Labor & Delivery, Home Health, Adolescent Psych, & Adult Psych.

IT Professional- Retired- Web Site Design, Hardware Maintenance, Compound Pharmacy Software Trainer, On-site go live support, Database Manager, App Designer.

______________________________________

August 7, 2022: Wife filed N-400 Online under 5 year rule.

November 10, 2022: Received "Interview is scheduled" letter.

December 12, 2022:  Received email from Dallas office informing me (spouse) to be there for combo interview.

December 14, 2022: Combo Interview for I-751 and N-400 Conducted.

January 26, 2023: Wife's Oath Ceremony completed at the Plano Event Center, Plano, Texas!!!😁

February 6, 2023: Wife's Passport Application submitted in Dallas, Texas.

March 21, 2023:   Wife's Passport Delivered!!!!

May 15, 2023 (about):  Naturalization Certificate returned from Passport agency!!

 

In summary, it took 13 months for approval of the CR-1.  It took 44 months for approval of the I-751.  It took 4 months for approval of the N-400.   It took 172 days from N-400 application to Oath Ceremony.   It took 6 weeks for Passport, then 7 additional weeks for return of wife's Naturalization Certificate.. 
 

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2 minutes ago, Lucky Cat said:

What the OP intended is 100% legal. ...thus, my answer was correct.    What is a "DOS adjustment"??

It’s so strange when people claim to know all the facts and then repeatedly refer to something that doesn’t even exist  😂 

Edited by SusieQQQ
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8 minutes ago, Punisher said:

Re-read you reply to me, so perhaps you realize that you are contradicting yourself, not me missing the point.

 

On one hand (including your pre edited post) you say that I'm missing the point (which I'm not) since USCIS does not implement 90 day rule (which is true, DOS does, she intends to return home) then rumble about people that adjust status within 90 day of entry (therefore through USCIS). You can't have it both ways.

 

Stick to the facts! The very first OP's post she said clearly that she intends to return home, therefore do DOS adjustment, therefore it is "possible" 90 day rule would be verified. Later she elaborated about dating etc so she would be possibly OK, but as I stated in the beginning I was against making BLANK statements like you did in your reply.

 

I'm afraid you are missing point on 2 subjects:

 

1. Just because YOU haven't seen/heard something, does that mean that the law is irrelevant? Do you even realize it is the minority of the immigration that leaves its footprint on this (and similar) forums?

 

2. 90 day rule is not whether you stayed in US and tried adjusting status through USCIS,  rather if your intentions when seeking visa and entering US matched your classification and your ACTIONS during first 90 days need to match that as well. No, your plans CAN NOT change on a whim. If the circumstances change, you are supposed to go back, seek new visa and act accordingly (unless you marry and do AOS through USCIS which wouldn't be DOS by definition). See my example given to SusieQQQQ regarding "employment w/o adjustnment/overstay".

 

Again in this particular case OP would be likely be fine during DOS interview (assuming she would be able to complete that feat in the first place: she should state her marriage intentions at POE, which may or may not fly well with CBP) because I'm assuming she would have documentation for DOS interview regarding relationship/dating. But that dating thing didn't come up until later in the thread (which you couldn't know about) and therefore I was against making general blank statements like that.

 

I would claim that people that enter US by mis-stating their true intentions are either going to end up with AOS going through USCIS or very likely to overstay, so even if at some point they have to go back in order to do AOS through DOS, then they have to be very careful what they say during the interview regarding the first 90 days in the US, which is not a problem if you overstayed considerably. Of course, by overstaying you are triggering other bars/bans. 90 day rule is supposed to check whether you broke rules/intentions during your supposed authorized stay.

 

There is enough great info on the internet regarding 90 day rule. I hope that my posts will spark enough interest so that people going through DOS adjustment know what to look out for.

You are confidently incorrect. 

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4 minutes ago, SusieQQQ said:

Sorry but you are totally wrong. There is absolutely nothing illegal about using tourist status just to get married in the US. It does have after all two of the most famous destination wedding locations in the world, Hawaii and Vegas. Working on tourist status is inconsistent with the conditions of such status. Getting married is not. 

Getting married in US is not illegal, that's why I said before "legal, in what sense?".

 

As I said before, "normal" people don't go on to another country (as tourists) and within 90 days get married to a foreigner they don't know or have ever met before (again, forget that she was dating the guy, you couldn't know that from OP's 1st post). It could happen but would likely (depending on the Embassy post) be frowned upon.

 

Making BLANK statements like you do could be read by some that it is OK to seek ESTA, enter US as tourist, "change" my plans by getting married to someone you have never met before, return home and claim all is nice and dandy I just want to AOS.

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7 minutes ago, SusieQQQ said:

Your entire argument seems to be predicated on the belief that OP plans to misrepresent her intention for visiting in the US. Where does she say that?

 

Also there is no such thing as “DOS adjustment”!!! What on earth do you think you are talking about when you say that? Adjustment takes place inside the US via USCIS.  Visa issuance takes place outside the US via DoS. “DOS adjustment” does not exist. Great info indeed lol 

You know what I'm referring to or you conveniently pretend not to.

 

Inside US you do AOS through USCIS. Consular processing (DOS) can be referred to trying to adjustment of the status (as non-immigrant, alien , whatever the case may be) to immigrant. Is is that hard to comprehend? Once given "immigrant visa" by DOS you are pretty much cleared to enter US. From US perspective your status is "adjusted" from alien to immigrant (assuming you enter within visa validity). Very convenient of you to pretend you don't understand that. 

 

And no, my argument is not predicated on what OP said at all! I have no problems whatsoever with what OP said but with blank statements you and others make.

 

In fact I assume OP would state her intentions clearly at POE, yet it will be up to CBP to consider the risk OP truly intends to return later home instead of seeking AOS through USCIS.

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