The Daily Trump wins again thread

[Merle 458]

9 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

phoenix being a sanctuary city has nothing to do with small business licensing practices.

I guess you want to talk in circles all day. Im not really interested. 

[smilesammich 10,727]

4 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

so you have a problem with a school collecting and verifying the personal info of parents and kids. Absurd 

 

So how do you propose an employer not hire an illegal without making a citizen prove they are a citizen 

it's not about a school collecting personal information. anyone with a kid in school provides all sorts of personal info. it's about plyler vs doe. and the reasons that decision is law.

 

applying for a job is different. and there are measures in place that employers are supposed to follow, and many don't simply because hiring illegals is no risk to them or their pockets.

 

2 minutes ago, Merle said:

I guess you want to talk in circles all day. Im not really interested. 

i wouldn't expect you to want to be proven wrong any further. understood.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

1 hour ago, Merle said:

You should come down to Phoenix sometime and see who owns all the Landscaping businesses and who works for them. Might change your mind a little bit.

Not everyone understand just how big and real this issue it.  CA and AZ alone probably have more cash-paid illegals than any other 10 states combined.

[smilesammich 10,727]

5 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

Not everyone understand just how big and real this issue it.  CA and AZ alone probably have more cash-paid illegals than any other 10 states combined.

so how does an illegal get a business license in az?

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

2 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

so how does an illegal get a business license in az?

They don’t.  If they are not paying taxes nor filing returns, not sure why they would ever want to.

[smilesammich 10,727]

13 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

They don’t.  If they are not paying taxes nor filing returns, not sure why they would ever want to.

must be super easy to start a business in az.

[spookyturtle 9,465]

1 hour ago, Merle said:

And what prevents those from being deported from sneaking back in? It was a huge joke among the illegals i used to work with when i was in the construction trade that being deported was a free ride home to see the family. They were usually back in a week or 2.

Well, since they were caught and deported that would have meant their employer got caught and had to pay a painful fine. Said worker could sneak back in and  try working for someone else. I'm betting that once there was a real crackdown on the employers, it would be less enticing for them to employ illegal help. $25 billion would buy a lot of enforcement, and companies would quickly tire of paying fines. 

[smilesammich 10,727]

4 minutes ago, spookyturtle said:

Well, since they were caught and deported that would have meant their employer got caught and had to pay a painful fine. Said worker could sneak back in and  try working for someone else. I'm betting that once there was a real crackdown on the employers, it would be less enticing for them to employ illegal help. $25 billion would buy a lot of enforcement, and companies would quickly tire of paying fines. 

my my, what reasonable logic you have 

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

8 minutes ago, spookyturtle said:

Well, since they were caught and deported that would have meant their employer got caught and had to pay a painful fine. Said worker could sneak back in and  try working for someone else. I'm betting that once there was a real crackdown on the employers, it would be less enticing for them to employ illegal help. $25 billion would buy a lot of enforcement, and companies would quickly tire of paying fines. 

why would you assume because  the person was caught it meant, whoever they were working for got caught also. Thats a wobbly leap of logic there.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

3 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

why would you assume because  the person was caught it meant, whoever they were working for got caught also. Thats a wobbly leap of logic there.

my my, what reasonable logic you have.  You seem to have some knowledge of how the system works.

 

I would further add that (even though some don’t believe illegals can start up a business with no business license) if the person getting caught were to happen to be employed by an illegal, turning that employer in would be counter-productive.  Take your lumps, get sent home, then sneak back over and go back to your job in a month or so.  

 

While I am completely on board with fining the employers of illegals, not every deportee is going to turn them in.  And unless the fines are HUGE, the cost savings to an employer who it paying under the table may well make the fines worth it.

[smilesammich 10,727]

makes me wonder why folks in az support all these unlicensed landscapers. 

7 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

While I am completely on board with fining the employers of illegals, not every deportee is going to turn them in.  And unless the fines are HUGE, the cost savings to an employer who it paying under the table may well make the fines worth it.

so the demand for cheap illegal labor can only be stopped by a wall? 

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

3 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

my my, what reasonable logic you have.  You seem to have some knowledge of how the system works.

 

I would further add that (even though some don’t believe illegals can start up a business with no business license) if the person getting caught were to happen to be employed by an illegal, turning that employer in would be counter-productive.  Take your lumps, get sent home, then sneak back over and go back to your job in a month or so.  

 

While I am completely on board with fining the employers of illegals, not every deportee is going to turn them in.  And unless the fines are HUGE, the cost savings to an employer who it paying under the table may well make the fines worth it.

In many states as long as the employer has two forms of ID on the I-9 form, "which they are not required to verify" they are not responsible if they hire an illegal. Use to be that way in GA, before we required e-verify, and if they can skate by e-verify they are still covered. I have seen two forms of ID that were so obviously fake its absurd, but still the employer is not libel. IE 60 year old man with the SSN or photo id that says he is 25. Yes I do have a lot of experience in this area. So even if the illegal rats out the employer, which is almost a zero percent chance, nothing much they can do about it.

 

Bottom line someone getting deported, under current law, will likely have zero effect on the employer. (in most states)

 

Not to mention they may want to come back to work for that employer when they sneak back in.

 

One of the few exceptions might be if the get popped for conspiracy with massive amounts of fraud, likely under a RICO statue 

 

 

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

3 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

makes me wonder why folks in az support all these unlicensed landscapers. 

so the demand for cheap illegal labor can only be stopped by a wall? 

almost every person here on both sides of the road has said, we must make it almost impossible for them to work here. democrats know they are losing main stream America without divided politics and a minority base they are done, and that is the only reason they are pandering to the Hispanic community.

 

On the flip side some Pub bases want access to cheap workers, that will work 

Edited January 31, 2018 by Nature Boy Flair

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

4 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

makes me wonder why folks in az support all these unlicensed landscapers. 

so the demand for cheap illegal labor can only be stopped by a wall? 

I doubt it.  It’s a “war” that needs to be fought on many fronts.  Pursuing those who employ illegals is certainly a good one.  But as I said, the fines would have to be huge.  In the gun world, if you get caught selling guns illegally, not only do you get a fine, you can lose your license.  Obviously, this would only work on legit business owners.  But somehow, some way, we have to get employers to do the right thing.  

 

The wall?  IDK... I’m not convinced either way.  It would have to be pretty deep underground to work, and I am not sure there is a “deep enough” for it to be viable.  Having crawled in the tunnels that go from North to South Korea, I understand that when humans are determined, they can do quite a bit.  

[smilesammich 10,727]

2 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

almost every person here on both sides of the road has said, we must make it almost impossible for them to work here.

what i'm hearing from you and others who support the wall, is that making it impossible for them to work here is not possible. only for them to not get here in the first place. from where i sit, seems a better plan to make sure that their wages are taxed by giving employers the ability to report their earnings. if they're taxed and spending earnings in local economy, there is no downside imo.