About to file I-751 & on the brink of divorce: have you gone through that?

[AT20000 33]

Hi everybody,

I have to renew my GC and I am on the brink of divorce. I need some info. I mean, being divorced and filing separately by proving I entered the marriage in good faith, I get the concept. But filing for removal of conditions while things are really going south and I am considering filing for divorce, it is all at the same time and I have to confess I don't know what to do. It takes 6 months minimum to divorce and I have 3 months to file for removal of conditions.

I have also to add that my husband is extremely abusive and has anger management issues with no hope of change as he does not seek the psychiatric help he needs (he has a mental condition he hid to me for years until I found a pill on the carpet) and I discovered that he has also copiously abused his ex-wife.

I have loved him with all my heart but I cannot safely stay in this marriage any longer (ended up in the ER lately due to his threats, abuses and all the distress I am subjected to).

Any suggestion?

Thanks

[del-2-5-2014 1,339]

Separate the two issues, IMHO.

1) Divorce

2) ROC

Good luck.

[AT20000 33]

Separate the two issues, IMHO.

1) Divorce

2) ROC

Good luck.

Thank you for you reply but Separating the 2 issues is mathematically impossible (otherwise I would not have asked).

- A divorce takes minimum 6 months (this is the mandatory minimum wait time in California)

- There only is a 3 month time window to file for ROC.( so even if I file for divorce right now and wait for the divorce to happen in order to file for ROC, I will be illegal for at least 3 months! I cannot do that.)

- It is too dangerous for me to stay with my husband (I mean one time in the Emergency Room because of him, that's already one too many)

- Besides, if I file for divorce, and USCIS asks for an interview with the both of us, it smells like a huge mess in the making.

[Gosia & Tito 199]

Hi everybody,

I have to renew my GC and I am on the brink of divorce. I need some info. I mean, being divorced and filing separately by proving I entered the marriage in good faith, I get the concept. But filing for removal of conditions while things are really going south and I am considering filing for divorce, it is all at the same time and I have to confess I don't know what to do. It takes 6 months minimum to divorce and I have 3 months to file for removal of conditions.

I have also to add that my husband is extremely abusive and has anger management issues with no hope of change as he does not seek the psychiatric help he needs (he has a mental condition he hid to me for years until I found a pill on the carpet) and I discovered that he has also copiously abused his ex-wife.

I have loved him with all my heart but I cannot safely stay in this marriage any longer (ended up in the ER lately due to his threats, abuses and all the distress I am subjected to).

Any suggestion?

Thanks

You mention ER: First thing is your safety. You should have/get/find a safe place, friends, family, on your own if the financial situation allows. Only then would be the time to define steps towards divorce (or at least a legal separation to preserve your financial standing) and ROC. Next thing is to secure your assets and financial being, as it applies.

As you might know, you can file ROC on your own. If the situation is unsustainable, it would seem that you shoulf follow with the divorce filing and while that is taking its course, file ROC when the time comes.

Assuming you have some documentation: ER, other incidents, etc; that you could use to sustain your ROC. Finally, maybe you need to look into VAWA and see whether that applies to your case.

In case the financial situation os not as good, look up the immigration services in your area, usually Catholic churches have those services pro-bono, tough they screen cases as they don't have all the bandwidth they would like to.

Good luck and stay safe

[del-2-5-2014 1,339]

Apologies for not being verbose.

The picture created in my mind was of an unsafe condition which I thought necessitated you getting away into a safe place first then divorce and then tackle immigration afterwards.

Apologies once again.

[David & Diana R 1,005]

Get away from the danger. Then make the next move.

[JayJayH 546]

There really are only two options, divorce or joint ROC. You can file ROC with a divorce waiver before the divorce is final. What will happen is you'll get an RFE for the final divorce decree. If the divorce still isn't final, you'll be brought before an immigration judge, and the judge will order the decision to be on hold until USCIS gets the divorce decree.

As far as filing jointly. You can file jointly even if you're separated. The law says you must be in a bona fide marriage. It does not say it has to be a happy marriage. If you're separated. You will both be required to attend a likely interview. Be prepared to show evidence that you are taking measures to work things out or fix things.

[Steve&Ema 25]

Yeah I agree with the above posters. You need to get away from your husband but you don't need to file for divorce right way. You need to speak to an attorney and start gathering information on assets you both own, income etc.

Have you thought of calling the police on him the next time he threatens you or is abusive? I know that the police in CA are very intolerant of domestic abuse. Also that might help your case when filing the ROC.

[AT20000 33]

There really are only two options, divorce or joint ROC. You can file ROC with a divorce waiver before the divorce is final. What will happen is you'll get an RFE for the final divorce decree. If the divorce still isn't final, you'll be brought before an immigration judge, and the judge will order the decision to be on hold until USCIS gets the divorce decree.

As far as filing jointly. You can file jointly even if you're separated. The law says you must be in a bona fide marriage. It does not say it has to be a happy marriage. If you're separated. You will both be required to attend a likely interview. Be prepared to show evidence that you are taking measures to work things out or fix things.

Than you all for your replies:

Bona fide marriage:I definitely have all proofs that I entered in this marriage in good faith. We dated 3 years before we got married, we have filed jointly with the IRS since I got there. Short of the kids, (we cannot have any) I have the whole list of proofs USCIS asks for. I can prove I am even very much in good terms with my in-laws and to tell the truth it breaks my heart to have to leave my mother in law. She is just a-d-o-r-a-b-l-e with me: we text each other, she never miss my birthday and makes quilts for me, we cook, shop together etc. His kids from previous marriage are also in touch with me... I will have NO problem to prove this point.

For "working things out", My husband has been abusing me for a while now, we have been attending couple therapy, I have begged him repeatedly (in writing) to seek the psychiatric help he needs - he has extreme anger management issues - and all this is very very well documented (I have a police report, I am followed by a DV organisation for over a year, etc). I think I will move towards separation first, hoping that the electroshock will shake him enough to push him towards getting the help he needs.

However, I am not very confident as about a year ago, I discovered that he is a serial abuser as he has been abusing his first wife for 10 years also (she said that under oath during a hearing, I was attending as they were fighting for kids visitation). He also brought her from Europe (Germany this time) and she obviously remains very fearful of having him anywhere close to her.

Does the immigration case have to necessarily go before a judge if one of us files for divorce? Because he could as well file for divorce in retaliation of me filing for separation. He has blackmailed me for a long time saying he would not hesitate to use my immigration status to keep me under his control. He has been violent also and his emotional abuses are just permanent.

I describe the situation here: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/284053-vawa-based-on-emotional-mental-economic-abuse/page-2#entry6650409

My son's visa depends of mine and he is in college right now, being deported would be a catastrophe for both of us, hence I am just trying to figure out a way to get out of this ordeal without giving him the possibility of using the administration to avenge the fact that I dared to leave him because his abuses.

[TBoneTX 43,290]

*** Thread moved from ROC forum to Effects of Major Changes forum -- topic is more complex than an unobstructed ROC. ***

[Brian1967## 119]

OP,,,If your husband ever touches you or does anything to mentally abuse you call the police make a report, if there is more than one report go to the local DA and ask for a Order of Protection, Please note this is different than a restraining order, A Order Of Protection, if violated, your husband can be thrown in jail and prosecuted, a Restraining Order is civil in nature. Meaing the cops cannot do much if it is violated.

If divorce takes 6 months no problem send in for your ROC and send copy of divorce petition seeking a extension, if you file for divorce this will be granted and you will not be put in removal proceedings. Get all your proofs together for bona fide marriage and file the paperwork, DO not file under extreme cruelty, it adds to the paperwork, you have two year green card there are ways around what you need please contact sandraj or capri on this website or send me a PM, I also know how to do this but I am a male and you may feel more comfortable discussing the situation with a female.

You will be okay and the paperwork will fall into place:) It just takes time:(

Also contact your local BAR association and see if there are pro bono attorneys that might help, also did some research in California and every courthouse there has classes on how to file for divorce on you own, they will have a class you can sign up for and show you what to do line by line, they will even help you file to keep you husband away during the divorce. California is also a alimony state which means your husband will have to help support you. Which means if you were married for 2 years he will have to pay alimony for one year which will help you get on your feet and settle into a new life. Hope this helps any questions please send me a message will be glad to help with all I can.

Please note I understand and I am sorry for what you are going through. Brian1967##

Edited November 16, 2013 by Brian1967##

[JayJayH 546]

Than you all for your replies:

Bona fide marriage:I definitely have all proofs that I entered in this marriage in good faith. We dated 3 years before we got married, we have filed jointly with the IRS since I got there. Short of the kids, (we cannot have any) I have the whole list of proofs USCIS asks for. I can prove I am even very much in good terms with my in-laws and to tell the truth it breaks my heart to have to leave my mother in law. She is just a-d-o-r-a-b-l-e with me: we text each other, she never miss my birthday and makes quilts for me, we cook, shop together etc. His kids from previous marriage are also in touch with me... I will have NO problem to prove this point.

For "working things out", My husband has been abusing me for a while now, we have been attending couple therapy, I have begged him repeatedly (in writing) to seek the psychiatric help he needs - he has extreme anger management issues - and all this is very very well documented (I have a police report, I am followed by a DV organisation for over a year, etc). I think I will move towards separation first, hoping that the electroshock will shake him enough to push him towards getting the help he needs.

However, I am not very confident as about a year ago, I discovered that he is a serial abuser as he has been abusing his first wife for 10 years also (she said that under oath during a hearing, I was attending as they were fighting for kids visitation). He also brought her from Europe (Germany this time) and she obviously remains very fearful of having him anywhere close to her.

Does the immigration case have to necessarily go before a judge if one of us files for divorce? Because he could as well file for divorce in retaliation of me filing for separation. He has blackmailed me for a long time saying he would not hesitate to use my immigration status to keep me under his control. He has been violent also and his emotional abuses are just permanent.

I describe the situation here: http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/284053-vawa-based-on-emotional-mental-economic-abuse/page-2#entry6650409

My son's visa depends of mine and he is in college right now, being deported would be a catastrophe for both of us, hence I am just trying to figure out a way to get out of this ordeal without giving him the possibility of using the administration to avenge the fact that I dared to leave him because his abuses.

The truth of the matter is, he can call the USCIS and scream fraud all he wants, but unless he has some sort of evidence, the CIS will consider it for what it is: a bitter ex spouse calling with no evidence. They simply won't do I much about it or give it much weight unless he has evidence.

Do you have any proof of him wanting to blackmail you? Text messages etc? This could be helpful in case it ever becomes an issue.

There are three instances in which you can file without your husband, those are 1. If your husband died, 2. If you divorced, or 3. If you or your children were subject to extreme cruelty and abuse by your husband. However, unless he actually has a domestic violence conviction, it is generally very difficult to prove extreme cruelty, as the burden of proof is on you. The abuse would in most cases have to be physical, and well documented.

It sounds like you should just divorce the guy, although I am no family therapist. If you get divorced, and the final divorce decree is not ready by your expiration date on your conditional green card, file for ROC with a divorce waiver anyway. The CIS will later send an RFE for the divorce decree.

In determining a bona fide marriage, the USCIS looks mostly for co-mingled assets, shared finances etc. the theory is that "anyone can take pictures together" but few illegitimate couples would "share financial risks." Evidence of a shared bank account, joint insurance policies, life insurance policies, shared loans, shared credit cards etc, coupled with a wide array of pictures spanning your entire relationship, plus an affidavit or two.. I'm just brainstorming out loud for you. Most ROC cases are approved when there is reasonable evidence that the marriage was in good faith.

In a worst case scenario, where your ROC is denied, you and your son would not be deported immediately. You will have a chance to appeal, and the case would go in front of an immigration judge. Even at that point, your case could still be appealed to the Board of Immigration Appeals.

Edited November 16, 2013 by Yang-Ja

[Villanelle 4,121]

Hi everybody,

I have to renew my GC and I am on the brink of divorce. I need some info. I mean, being divorced and filing separately by proving I entered the marriage in good faith, I get the concept. But filing for removal of conditions while things are really going south and I am considering filing for divorce, it is all at the same time and I have to confess I don't know what to do. It takes 6 months minimum to divorce and I have 3 months to file for removal of conditions.

I have also to add that my husband is extremely abusive and has anger management issues with no hope of change as he does not seek the psychiatric help he needs (he has a mental condition he hid to me for years until I found a pill on the carpet) and I discovered that he has also copiously abused his ex-wife.

I have loved him with all my heart but I cannot safely stay in this marriage any longer (ended up in the ER lately due to his threats, abuses and all the distress I am subjected to).

Any suggestion?

Thanks

While all of the above posts contain correct information, I kind of feel like they just added to your confusion since you posted a very simple question. So heres the basic answer because a lot of people get confused when it comes to the divorcing close to the ROC date because of the overlapping of dates- plus you have the dilemma of how to file for ROC.

So your choices for filing for ROC. Obviously as you know it must be done by the specific date- no exceptions. That part you seem to understand perfectly. Your choice is just going to be how to file. The are provisions in the code for each way you can file because USCIS does understand divorce moves slower then immigration and situations like this does happen.

So looking at the ROC form what are your specific choices for filing?

Joint: file with your spouse signing it. Because of the DV going on, this is probably not a good idea because you need to remove yourself from the situation for your safety. Your joint application could be approved through the mail but if its not you would have to come in for an interview with your spouse and because of the mentions of him threatening to hold your status against you... well, thats not a good idea. ROc takes apx 9 months to complete so youd be tied to him for that long.

ROC with a divorce waiver. To file for this you dont have to be divorced yet. You can be separated. You could have just filed, already filed etc. Basically you dont need the final divorce decree with your ROC packet. You just send in the packet with your evidence of the marriage and check the box that divorce is going to be the reason why your spouse is not going to be signing it jointly and USCIS will basically RFE you for it. If the ROC process completes before the divorce process (which can happen) like I said USCIS understands that they move faster then divorce court, but they just cant hold your file while they wait for divorce court, so they will 'tentatively deny you' and youll have to go to immigration court when you get your divorce papers to have it adjusted. While it sounds scary its not. Its just paperwork and hassle. NO WHERE are you out of status or lose work privileges.

Your third choice which some abused people do choose, sometimes alone on a ROC application or sometimes in conjunction with the divorce waiver box is the abuse box. While you may feel - hey I was abused and do qualify for this, it is not recommend to be used unless it absolutely must be used. Basically when you dont file jointly and you need to select a waiver, USCIS wants to know whats the reason the USC isnt singing- divorce, abuse, theyre dead? And then you have to prove what you checked off. When you check off abuse it goes to a special division (the VAWA unit) who reviews all claims of abuse. The burden of proof for abuse is very high. You can read the VAWA thread for more information. It would really only be recommended in a ROC case if you had little proof of a bonafide marriage because your spouse was so abusive and controlling that you had little to no evidence of the marriage, so you could counter explain that.

SInce you seem to say you have enough proof of bonafides its best for you to just give the reason of your spouse not jointly signing as 'divorce' and leave the DV out of it because if you dont, well depending on what you check off is what you have to prove. Check off divorce and absue you will then have to prove bonafide marriage, divorce and abuse. Check off just abuse and you have to prove abuse and bonafide marriage, check off just divorce and all you need is the divorce and bonafide marriage.

Your DV paperwork can be useful in divorce court or family court if you have children and should be able to help you obtain a restraining order however.

[NikLR 13,220]

Capri has given you some good advice. I think you should seperate from your husband, why are you staying in an abusive relationship? You could have left at any time. Start divorce proceedings and file the ROC if you wish to stay in the USA.

[JayJayH 546]

I couldn't have said it any better than capri's excellent outline here.