married before entering on K-1

[Ramsis 1]

I am in the same BOATTTTT...and i need an Advice guys

We applied for K1 visa. we are Muslims and she lives in an Egypt. so as you all probably know that my fiancee's family will never allow her to leave to the US unless we get married in Egypt.

so i know you are going to ask why we did not apply for CR1. well simply because i can not travel to Egypt often due to work & financial reasons. because we thought we can apply for K1 and start the process and i get married to her after the interview and after she get her visa!!! and not mention that we did get married when she arrives to the US. and we get married again (civil marriage) in the US and apply for AOS using the US marriage certificate not the Egyptian one, right??!! i mean how would USCIS know about it.

Edited August 9, 2011 by Ramsis

[Harpa Timsah 13,258]

i mean how would USCIS know about it.

Um, I would hope it's plainly obvious that they do background checks on you and her and your fiance would be deported and likely banned FOREVER with no available waiver for lying on official paperwork. If this is your attitude then you will not be successful and probably experience dire consequences. If it was important to get married in Egypt then that you shouldn't have done K-1.

[Rufus2012 175]

"i mean how would USCIS know about it."

It's people like who you take this approach and have this mentality that makes this process a burden for everyone else wanting to play by the rules. Telling a lie to a government official in the course of them performing their duties is a crime; perhaps they don't know immediately, perhaps they never find out, but if they do, you're screwed. As you should be.

[joyjohn 18]

YOU JUST TOLD THEM.......... ....... THEY READ THESE BOARDS!!!!...........

[Kathryn41 3,205]

Three posts have been split off from the end of an older thread and made into its own thread.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[belinda63 3,039]

Maybe they won't know at first and will give her the conditional green card, then maybe when she applies to remove conditions (for the 10 year green card) they will discover it and deport her. Or maybe they won't discover it then but when she applies for citizenship they will and then deport her. Or maybe they will find out 10 years from now and then deport her. You getting the point here? If they EVER find out she misrepresented herself for the purpose of immigration benefits she will lose those benefits (green card or citizenship) and will be deported, likely with a life time ban.

Possible out, as I don't know the rules of marriage in your country, could you have a ceremony there that is not registered with the government but only qualifies as a religious marriage.

Edited August 9, 2011 by belinda63

[Ramsis 1]

Three posts have been split off from the end of an older thread and made into its own thread.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Ya i was intending to reply on a thread and may be i started one by mistake. wasn't intentional.

Relax guys, we have not gotten married yet. i was just asking how would they be able to find out if lets say we get married in Egypt "AFTER" she gets the visa. like even 1 day before she travels to the US...just to make her family satisfied. Which means after the background checks are done and she has the visa. And we still get married in the US again few days after.

and please...no one needs to get defensive here. im just asking for your opinion not your "conscience" .. lol with all do respect to all of course

[Kathryn41 3,205]

If you think that USCIS wouldn't find out then you need to do a lot more research than you have yet done into US immigration processes.

Just to clear up some issues:

You apply to sponsor a fiancee to the US. USCIS investigates to make sure you are qualified to sponsor a fiancee. If you are, your petition is approved. The process then moves overseas to your fiancee' home country. The Department of State which oversees consulates now investigate whether she is eligible to receive a K-1 visa. She provides them with detailed information about who she is, where she lives and works, and her marital status. They will investigate with a fine tooth comb all aspects of her situation, her background, and your relationship looking for evidence of fraud. They ensure that you have followed proper cultural procedures/rituals and have the evidence to prove it. They run security and criminal checks. Some countries also require additional processing which can include 'home visits' and contacting family members to ask them about the relationship. You will both state in writing that you are free to marry and intend to marry when she arrives in the US and sign these documents. If you lie about this, then the lie will be discovered - and it will be discovered - sooner or later. If sooner, then she will be denied the visa. If later then several things may happen.

For instance, if she gets a K-1 visa, then you marry before she arrives in the US, she is no longer eligible to enter the US on the fiance visa as she is no longer a fiance. If she tries to use the K-1 visa and lies at the POE that she is not married, she has then committed misrepresentation - one of the biggest 'crimes' as far as USCIS is concerned. Her arrival to the US is only valid for 90 days. She needs to request permission to remain in the US by applying to change her status from non-immigrant fiancee to permanent resident. Part of this application includes the marriage certificate - the date of which needs to be after her entry to the US - and further proof of the relationship. Once again your relationship is put under a fine tooth comb and may involve another interview. If she was married before she entered, it is likely to be discovered. She will be guilty of several counts of misrepresentation which will lead to detainment by USCIS, deportation and a life time ban on ever being allowed to enter the US.

If the fraud is not discovered at the AOS stage, then 2 years later your relationship is once again put under the microscope when she applies to remove the conditions of her two year card - oh yes, she is only allowed to be in the US for 2 years before she has to prove the validity of your marriage once again. There are more security checks and the possibility of another interview.

Even if it is not discovered now, there is no statute of limitation on immigration fraud. Anytime in her whole life it can be discovered that she did not get married in the US but was married before she came and used a K-1 visa knowingly and fraudulently - leading to detention, deportation and a life time ban.

Seriously, if you love this woman you will NOT subject her to any sort of illegal immigration activity. The news media are filled with tragic stories of families being torn apart because one member has committed some sort of illegal immigration activity and has been banned from the US. There is a fairly recent story of a US citizen who did exactly what you are proposing with his Japanese wife. It was discovered 2 years later after they already had a family. They have spent the last few years apart fighting to try and find some sort of loophole to allow his wife to re-enter the US. Their claim that their family wanted to see her married before she left Japan held no water with USCIS. She was guilty of immigration fraud and is now banned for life while she and her family are suffering the consequences of her misrepresentation.

If you do not have the time and the money to do it properly, then you need to re-think your situation. It will be a lot more time-consuming, expensive and heart-rending to be commit immigration fraud because you don't see how USCIS would ever know. It is USCIS's business to know. Uncovering immigration fraud is their bread and butter.

On another issue, it is also a violation of the Terms of Service for Visa Journey to commit or to condone any sort of illegal immigration activity. I have left your post rather than removing it as I feel you need to be advised about the degree of danger your suggested course of action holds for someone you are supposed to love. Don't be so selfish. If she cannot leave her home unmarried, then you need to get married and file for the correct visa for her to come to the US. That is your only real course of action.

Edited August 9, 2011 by Kathryn41

[Ramsis 1]

Possible out, as I don't know the rules of marriage in your country, could you have a ceremony there that is not registered with the government but only qualifies as a religious marriage.

Thanks Belinda, well unfortunately. we do not have "for show" ceremony in Egypt. really the whole point is for her family to see and witness a religious marriage and feel that they handed her to me under god...etc.

so I'm stuck now??!!..me & her like all of you guys can not wait to be with each other. we don't mind the wait for the visa but we wanted to "be" married as soon as possible ASAP. not just because we love each other but because of many other issues that are rising that are trying to part us apart,...i don't want to get into details.

God help us

[Ramsis 1]

If you think that USCIS wouldn't find out then you need to do a lot more research than you have yet done into US immigration processes.

Thanks Kathryn, i appreciate what you are doing truly.

I know USCIS investigates and microscope and the whole thing. They would not find anything NOW because we are not married yet. And we were planning to get married again after entering the US. we thought each government would have a wedding date and that they would never conflict. how would each government find out about the other date?...USCIS asks the Egyptian government for criminal history as far as i know, lets say they check on martial status as well..lets say they ask her martial status when she applies for citizenship years from now, would the Egyptian government give the wedding date they have!!

p.s. i m starting to feel where you are coming from. if i do cancel the K1 visa...its going to be wait time from hell...oh god...i know you guys would say wait now and have a piece of mind vs take the chance and risk getting her deported years later

[Kathryn41 3,205]

Here is a link to a similar story to the one I quoted above - also from Japan - http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/70350-family-separated-by-immigration-policies/page__view__findpost__p__943472

Edited August 9, 2011 by Kathryn41

[Harpa Timsah 13,258]

Lets say they ask her martial status when she applies for citizenship years from now, would the Egyptian government give the wedding date they have!!

Yes, a millions times YES!

[Kathryn41 3,205]

Thanks Kathryn, i appreciate what you are doing truly.

I know USCIS investigates and microscope and the whole thing. They would not find anything NOW because we are not married yet. And we were planning to get married again after entering the US. we thought each government would have a wedding date and that they would never conflict. how would each government find out about the other date?...USCIS asks the Egyptian government for criminal history as far as i know, lets say they check on martial status as well..lets say they ask her martial status when she applies for citizenship years from now, would the Egyptian government give the wedding date they have!!

p.s. i m starting to feel where you are coming from. if i do cancel the K1 visa...its going to be wait time from hell...oh god...i know you guys would say wait now and have a piece of mind vs take the chance and risk getting her deported years later

Oh I am so glad you are starting to see why we are concerned. It would just take one unplanned, off the cuff comment in an interview anywhere from AOS to citizenship - or a comment or document from somewhere else with conflicting information - to bring down the whole house of cards!

Your options are to withdraw the K-1 and get married in her home country, then start the process all over again with a CR-1. It would add a few months at the beginning of your relationship but would also add many happy and worry free years of marriage afterwards not having to look over your shoulder for USCIS, hoping no one in the family says anything, hoping nothing causes USCIS to 'investigate' a fraud charge. If at any interview appears like you are withholding information, then you would probably face being interviewed and grilled - harshly with accusations of fraud - separately, not knowing what the other is saying. When you actually are guilty it is almost impossible to stand up to 'Stokes" interview.

If it is an issue of her family not allowing her to leave unmarried, is there a way you can apply for a visitor visa for her mother to accompany her to the US after your fiancee gets the K-1 (she will have 6 months time in which to use it), then arrange for a place where she and her mother can live until you are married and allowed to live together in the US? That would take care of some of the 'leaving the country unmarried' issues. It is unlikely that both parents would be allowed visas but one may if the other and the rest of the family remain behind. Then when she is free to leave the US (has her AP or her green card) you can travel back to her home for another ceremony?

No one wants to be separated during this process but unfortunately, when we fall in love with people from other countries, we are bound by the rules of those countries in order to allow the relationship to proceed to the next level. The future is so unpredictable - it is always best to make sure that you have all of the details done correctly and completely from the very beginning so you don't have to deal with any unexpected -and devastating - surprises in the future.

Short term pain for long term gain,I think, is the phrase you need to consider.

Edited August 9, 2011 by Kathryn41

[Ramsis 1]

Short term pain for long term gain,I think, is the phrase you need to consider.

How long does CR1 take these days compared to a K1? ...man i cant believe i wasted 3 months of wait. i will consider those 3 options though

[gland 5]

I am in the same BOATTTTT...and i need an Advice guys

We applied for K1 visa. we are Muslims and she lives in an Egypt. so as you all probably know that my fiancee's family will never allow her to leave to the US unless we get married in Egypt.

so i know you are going to ask why we did not apply for CR1. well simply because i can not travel to Egypt often due to work & financial reasons. because we thought we can apply for K1 and start the process and i get married to her after the interview and after she get her visa!!! and not mention that we did get married when she arrives to the US. and we get married again (civil marriage) in the US and apply for AOS using the US marriage certificate not the Egyptian one, right??!! i mean how would USCIS know about it.

why would you want to live the rest of your lives hiding something? Do it right like the rest of us. Trying to be dishonest is why this is made so hard for us honest people.