France Rejects Far Right

[CaliCat 3,957]

2 hours ago, Mr&Mrs G. said:

!. Is a joke about the Irish building America and honestly I was not expecting to have to defend it. It's more to do with the amount of builders who emigrated and left us with very little at home.

 

2. I wish it was as you describe and it's just us bad Europeans putting the immigrants from the middle east in ghetto's. But unfortunately that's not the way it is in real life. If I want to talk about a segment of people how do I describe them without using a "them" type word without you taking it as if I am a racist. Ireland is a very free country with no restrictions whatsoever but yet "they" choose to segregate themselves from the rest of the community. No one has to lose their national identity when they emigrate but you should assimilate, it's not a bad word. Why move to another country if you have no wish to embrace the culture and the people. 

 

I will say it again, what you have crossing your southern border is not the same as we have coming in to the EU.  

 

I don't think Europeans are bad, but I believe that many people can be led down the wrong path with fallacies. There was a time in Europe when jews were the undesirables, who congregated in ghettos, and refused to assimilate into the culture, so the relationship with the ME has always been delicate. How can you state that "they" choose to segregate from the community when "their" children must attend the same schools, "they" must shop at the same places, and "they" are your co-workers and neighbors?

This is a very uncomfortable subject to many Europeans, but there is a lot of racism in Europe, and a lot of social segregation. Immigrants come for jobs and a better life. If they encounter an atmosphere of segregation - cultural, religious, or otherwise - they will stick together because that is what people do. Every American city has its Chinatown, Little Italy, and other ethnic communities. Manhattan's lower east side was notorious for being the home to various generations of jews at different times. It's very easy to cross our arms in indifference and claim that "they chose to live in the ghetto." No person leaves the home country to live in a ghetto. 

Edited May 8, 2017 by CaliCat

[IAMX 3,055]

Europeans of the past were like this yes.. this is how much of Africa and the Middle East still are now. Racism, Slavery, bigotry toward homosexuals and other religions plus atheists/agnostics. Of course, the left still focus on da evil white guy, which is a modern caricature based on the Nazi era, KKK, etc.. selective outrage, only worse. This is why no one with a backbone listens to the left anymore.

Edited May 8, 2017 by IAMX

[spookyturtle 9,466]

18 minutes ago, IAMX said:

Europeans of the past were like this yes.. this is how much of Africa and the Middle East still are now. Racism, Slavery, bigotry toward homosexuals and other religions plus atheists/agnostics. Of course, the left still focus on da evil white guy, which is a modern caricature based on the Nazi era, KKK, etc.. selective outrage, only worse. This is why no one with a backbone listens to the left anymore.

And why no one with a backbone talks about them all the time?

[Mr&Mrs G. 903]

49 minutes ago, CaliCat said:

 

I don't think Europeans are bad, but I believe that many people can be led down the wrong path with fallacies. There was a time in Europe when jews were the undesirables, who congregated in ghettos, and refused to assimilate into the culture, so the relationship with the ME has always been delicate. How can you state that "they" choose to segregate from the community when "their" children must attend the same schools, "they" must shop at the same places, and "they" are your co-workers and neighbors?

This is a very uncomfortable subject to many Europeans, but there is a lot of racism in Europe, and a lot of social segregation. Immigrants come for jobs and a better life. If they encounter an atmosphere of segregation - cultural, religious, or otherwise - they will stick together because that is what people do. Every American city has its Chinatown, Little Italy, and other ethnic communities. Manhattan's lower east side was notorious for being the home to various generations of jews at different times. It's very easy to cross our arms in indifference and claim that "they chose to live in the ghetto." No person leaves the home country to live in a ghetto. 

So let's not call them ghettos because that seems to offend, we can use the word communities instead. If you go to Chinatown or Little Italy will you find people preaching how to take your country down? What about the local Jewish Temple are they preaching hate against fellow citizens? 

 

Was Isreal or Italy or even China on Trump or Obamas list of terrorist countries? Its not because France treated the terrorists badly that they attacked, it's because they are terrorists. What your implying is that if they had been taken straight to the good people of California then they would not have turned into terrorists. 

 

From where you are in the US you can speak about how and where you live and it's not for me to say or deny what you say to be true. So where I live in Dublin there is no social segregation,  the local Muslims who came from the middle east tend to all rent homes within a community not too far from me. They have their own shops and most have there own schooling. Rarely do you see them stray from the area around their mosque. It is not a ghetto, in fact the rent would fairly high because it's close to the city centre, they choose not to mix they are not being forced. There would be a lot of mixed nationalities where I live, mostly staff for the local hospitals. I am by no means a racist or anti immigrant, in fact I enjoy meeting others of different cultures. But there is a large section of the Muslim community who do not want anything from Ireland or it's people, being in this country is nothing more than an escape. They create their own little country within mine and they do it in every country across Europe and they will do it in the USA if allowed. When American cities start getting attacked the way it's happening in France people will look back wondering how and why, just look at Europe and it will come to a city near you if you don't take notice.

Edited May 8, 2017 by Mr&Mrs G.

[OriZ 3,165]

1 hour ago, CaliCat said:

 

I don't think Europeans are bad, but I believe that many people can be led down the wrong path with fallacies. There was a time in Europe when jews were the undesirables, who congregated in ghettos, and refused to assimilate into the culture

????? 

 

Like, never.

 

That's why you have so many famous jews from even way back when, Jews were always a part of the community and have always and still always contribute tremendously in each and every country they are in.

[CaliCat 3,957]

39 minutes ago, Mr&Mrs G. said:

So let's not call them ghettos because that seems to offend, we can use the word communities instead. If you go to Chinatown or Little Italy will you find people preaching how to take your country down? What about the local Jewish Temple are they preaching hate against fellow citizens? 

 

Was Isreal or Italy or even China on Drumpf or Obamas list of terrorist countries? Its not because France treated the terrorists badly that they attacked, it's because they are terrorists. What your implying is that if they had been taken straight to the good people of California then they would not have turned into terrorists. 

 

From where you are in the US you can speak about how and where you live and it's not for me to say or deny what you say to be true. So where I live in Dublin there is no social segregation,  the local Muslims who came from the middle east tend to all rent homes within a community not too far from me. They have their own shops and most have there own schooling. Rarely do you see them stray from the area around their mosque. It is not a ghetto, in fact the rent would fairly high because it's close to the city centre, they choose not to mix they are not being forced. There would be a lot of mixed nationalities where I live, mostly staff for the local hospitals. I am by no means a racist or anti immigrant, in fact I enjoy meeting others of different cultures. But there is a large section of the Muslim community who do not want anything from Ireland or it's people, being in this country is nothing more than an escape. They create their own little country within mine and they do it in every country across Europe and they will do it in the USA if allowed. When American cities start getting attacked the way it's happening in France people will look back wondering how and why, just look at Europe and it will come to a city near you if you don't take notice.

 

What you're saying is that there is a part of Dublin where you find many immigrants who are in exile - is they see it as nothing more than an escape. Are they calling for the dissolution of the Irish state as such? Doesn't seem that way. At least I don't thing that a bunch of drunken and disorderly Aussies in Shepherd's Bush are "they" and promoting the dissolution of the British government. 
 

Edited May 8, 2017 by CaliCat

[CaliCat 3,957]

3 minutes ago, OriZ said:

????? 

 

Like, never.

 

That's why you have so many famous jews from even way back when, Jews were always a part of the community and have always and still always contribute tremendously in each and every country they are in.

 

Jews were always part of the jewish community. That was one of the main sore points with the nazis, who used it to spread their antisemitic propaganda. Jews were segregated and discriminated against in Europe for a long time. I don't think many did so willingly or by design, but I do believe the prevalent bias and xenophobia were at play then as they are at play now. 

 

[Mr&Mrs G. 903]

33 minutes ago, CaliCat said:

 

What you're saying is that there is a part of Dublin where you find many immigrants who are in exile - is they see it as nothing more than an escape. Are they calling for the dissolution of the Irish state as such? Doesn't seem that way. At least I don't thing that a bunch of drunken and disorderly Aussies in Shepherd's Bush are "they" and promoting the dissolution of the British government. 
 

I wouldn't imagine any are calling for the dissolution of the Irish state but there are many wishing to destroy the United States. A few were picked up fundraising and sending funds to the middle east. Maybe we should just leave them alone because they mean us no harm, but your government might be just a little interested. 

 

I wouldn't imagine the people at Westminster were too worried about Aussies running about in Shepherds Bush, remind me again who they should fear.

[X Factor 1,113]

Overnight SPX futures are tame. Apparently the markets like the election results

[Amica Nostra 4,803]

1 hour ago, CaliCat said:

 

What you're saying is that there is a part of Dublin where you find many immigrants who are in exile - is they see it as nothing more than an escape. Are they calling for the dissolution of the Irish state as such? Doesn't seem that way. At least I don't thing that a bunch of drunken and disorderly Aussies in Shepherd's Bush are "they" and promoting the dissolution of the British government. 
 

OKAY this sounds w bit familiar  so let me set the record straight: on my last trip to Temple Bar  some drinks were drunk , some hen parties propositioned and we may have peed in the Liffey, and we may have tried out our Samuel L Jackson ordering a Royal at MacDonalds but we did not call for the dissolution of the Irish state.

 Plus I am American and Not Aussie

[Amica Nostra 4,803]

2 hours ago, OriZ said:

????? 

 

Like, never.

 

That's why you have so many famous jews from even way back when, Jews were always a part of the community and have always and still always contribute tremendously in each and every country they are in.

What are you talking about? Jews in Europe have contributed mightily to all communities they lived in BUT maintained faithfully their set apart status with there food,  worship , marriage, language.  For that lack of assimilation the community frequently made the pay the price. And now Muslims in Europe are facing similar pressures.

[OriZ 3,165]

6 hours ago, CaliCat said:

 

Jews were always part of the jewish community. That was one of the main sore points with the nazis, who used it to spread their antisemitic propaganda. Jews were segregated and discriminated against in Europe for a long time. I don't think many did so willingly or by design, but I do believe the prevalent bias and xenophobia were at play then as they are at play now. 

 

Well in your original post you said they refused to assimilate which for the most part isn't true, more like they were forced into hiding. Most of the time in most places they could not even let anybody know they were Jewish and had to pray secretly. Now, I'm not saying there aren't some who refuse even to this day, but nobody's ever been afraid of walking into a Jewish neighborhood so it's not really comparable to modern day ghettos. Still, by and large Jewish people always see themselves as an integral part of the country they live in.

 

Regarding the Nazis, they actually used Jewish involvement in so many things(the economy, science, arts, physics, literature, journalism, politics, culture, medicine, education and so on) against them when they tried to claim the Jews control everything. That was part of their propaganda. And while Jews don't control everything, the level of involvement in these areas is pretty staggering when you consider the Jewish population is only 0.2% of the world population. Yet 22.4% of nobel prize winners(including 41% of economics, 28% of medicine, 26% of physics) are either Jewish or of Jewish descent. If it often feels like Jews are alot more than the 0.2% they actually are it's because they're not afraid to get out and get involved.

Edited May 8, 2017 by OriZ

[OriZ 3,165]

4 hours ago, ccneat said:

What are you talking about? Jews in Europe have contributed mightily to all communities they lived in BUT maintained faithfully their set apart status with there food,  worship , marriage, language.  For that lack of assimilation the community frequently made the pay the price. And now Muslims in Europe are facing similar pressures.

That's not what we're talking about and has nothing to do with assimilation. You can eat Kosher food and still be part of the community around you and contribute to it in many ways(see above). My point Jews never just stayed in their own little world(again with the exception of few) refusing to be involved in anything else in their country, that just never happened. They didn't pay a price "for that lack of assimilation"...that's a really silly way to blame the victim of centuries of persecution. Muslims and other immigrants in western countries in the last 50-60 years are treated way way better than Jews have been throughout history yet - they assimilate much less. Explain that.

[OriZ 3,165]

Hey going back to the topic, I just realized I haven't seen any claims that France is misogynistic...

[IAMX 3,055]

1 hour ago, OriZ said:

Hey going back to the topic, I just realized I haven't seen any claims that France is misogynistic...

Macron should have identified as female. Then you'd be seeing not only misogynistic claims but bigotry against people who identify as another gender. 

 

Guess the left missed out on a golden opportunity to be ignored again.