'Mass shooting' reported at Sutherland Springs church in Texas

[CaliCat 3,957]

5 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

yep. what does you trying to call me a liar and gutless have to do with the op?

It doesn't. You're just being baited.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

3 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

sorry. i think it goes without saying that i'm not jayjayj or idwaf wifey material. but you guys feeling threatened over hypothetical sandwiches is something else.

I understand.  Not everyone gets to be as lucky as my wife.

 

But I've heard tales of your sandwiches.   I know a little of what lurks under each and every slice of bread...

[Póg mo 1,749]

2 hours ago, IDWAF said:

At the risk of answering incorrectly for jay... imagine being a legal gun owner.  For years, on forums and social media, you are constantly railed against for your views on gun ownership and control. I think after a while, you just assume that everyone who isn't on your side is totally against your right to own guns.  I know that's how I feel sometimes, and mis-read others' posts.

 

Not at all saying you did that, I doubt you did.  But many do.  

 

I do like that with a handful of exceptions here, we mostly agree that there is a problem, something needs to be done (but no one knows WHAT), and more importantly, lawful gun owners are not the problem.

 

In addition to other ideas I have read here, I think because straw purchases are a pretty big portion of the problem, that a life-long ban on buying guns should be the punishment.  Or maybe 10 years, like with immigration fraud.  Of course, this requires catching the straw buyer, and subsequently entering their name into the prohibited database.

I understand what you are saying, but from where I sit, the Republican party has done a really good job at convincing people that Liberals all want to take their guns. I have lost count how many times, I have heard Republicans claim Obama was going to take everyone's guns. The entire seems always to be turned in unlimited gun ownership vs zero guns. I understand that you are not that black and white on this issue, others seem to though. Personally I don't feel that the availability of guns is the root cause of the problem. Something over the past twenty or so years seems to have happened to force people into camps on so many issues, and compromise now seems to be a dirty word these days. Clearly allowing people with with serious mental illnesses to own or keep guns is a bad idea. The same goes for people with histories of violence. What is not so clear is, why does it seem that more people deciding to go on murder rampages. I am not sure if having great  a to mental health professionals is going to have do much, because it might just create extra strain on health insurance premiums that will cause premiums to rise, and ironically more people to go without coverage.  Perhaps instead America as a society could do more to prevent people from developing mental illnesses. What I am not sure. I feel that an end to at will employment contracts would be a good place to start. If it takes someone at least three days to clear preemployment background checks, before they can take up another job, then why would it be unreasonable to require employers to give three days notice?  I mention this because I can't say I have heard of too many disgruntled ex employees in other countries going on rampages because they were fired without any kind of warning, which seems to happen quite a lot in America.

[jayjayj 571]

8 minutes ago, CaliCat said:

It doesn't. You're just being baited.

Simply being called out for being dishonest.  

[ready4ONE 5,400]

1 hour ago, Boiler said:

Liberal is a person with liberal views. However, an EXTREME liberal is the WORST type of person. To start with they brainwash people. Then they convince you that their pre made views they hand to you are open minded. They tell you to hate Republicans and everyone who thinks differently than you. They are the first to throw around the word racist. Most extreme liberal abuse minorities. They look for a group typically blacks or hispanics, convince them they are nothing and need the liberals to survive, then exploit them for political power. Extreme liberals are usually ignorant but claim everyone else is. They pretend to be looking out for the people but are only looking out for themselves. Some day people will realize this is the truth.

Substitute "Liberal" for "2nd Amendment Conspiracy Theorists'" and you have a pretty good paragraph there.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

13 minutes ago, Póg mo said:

I understand what you are saying, but from where I sit, the Republican party has done a really good job at convincing people that Liberals all want to take their guns. I have lost count how many times, I have heard Republicans claim Obama was going to take everyone's guns. The entire seems always to be turned in unlimited gun ownership vs zero guns. I understand that you are not that black and white on this issue, others seem to though. Personally I don't feel that the availability of guns is the root cause of the problem. Something over the past twenty or so years seems to have happened to force people into camps on so many issues, and compromise now seems to be a dirty word these days. Clearly allowing people with with serious mental illnesses to own or keep guns is a bad idea. The same goes for people with histories of violence. What is not so clear is, why does it seem that more people deciding to go on murder rampages. I am not sure if having great  a to mental health professionals is going to have do much, because it might just create extra strain on health insurance premiums that will cause premiums to rise, and ironically more people to go without coverage.  Perhaps instead America as a society could do more to prevent people from developing mental illnesses. What I am not sure. I feel that an end to at will employment contracts would be a good place to start. If it takes someone at least three days to clear preemployment background checks, before they can take up another job, then why would it be unreasonable to require employers to give three days notice?  I mention this because I can't say I have heard of too many disgruntled ex employees in other countries going on rampages because they were fired without any kind of warning, which seems to happen quite a lot in America.

Good points, thanks for sharing.

 

I know the 2nd amendment isn't going away in my lifetime.  But I think there are some out there who would love to see a gun ban in the US.  Are they in a position to do So?  I hope not.

 

But here's an example of how people who shouldn't have any issue owning a gun have actually lost their legal right to do so.  Thousands, if the article is to be believed.  http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/defense/295484-va-is-restricting-veterans-gun-rights-without-due-process

[jayjayj 571]

8 minutes ago, Póg mo said:

I understand what you are saying, but from where I sit, the Republican party has done a really good job at convincing people that Liberals all want to take their guns. I have lost count how many times, I have heard Republicans claim Obama was going to take everyone's guns. The entire seems always to be turned in unlimited gun ownership vs zero guns. I understand that you are not that black and white on this issue, others seem to though. Personally I don't feel that the availability of guns is the root cause of the problem. Something over the past twenty or so years seems to have happened to force people into camps on so many issues, and compromise now seems to be a dirty word these days. Clearly allowing people with with serious mental illnesses to own or keep guns is a bad idea. The same goes for people with histories of violence. What is not so clear is, why does it seem that more people deciding to go on murder rampages. I am not sure if having great  a to mental health professionals is going to have do much, because it might just create extra strain on health insurance premiums that will cause premiums to rise, and ironically more people to go without coverage.  Perhaps instead America as a society could do more to prevent people from developing mental illnesses. What I am not sure. I feel that an end to at will employment contracts would be a good place to start. If it takes someone at least three days to clear preemployment background checks, before they can take up another job, then why would it be unreasonable to require employers to give three days notice?  I mention this because I can't say I have heard of too many disgruntled ex employees in other countries going on rampages because they were fired without any kind of warning, which seems to happen quite a lot in America.

Liberals have convinced gun owners they want to take away their guns.  The Republican party and the NRA are acknowledging that intent and are fighting back against it.  Gun owners don't need to compromise on gun rights, because the Constitution says those rights "shall not be infringed".  I'm not going to compromise on my rights to free speech or any of the other rights given to me by my creator or the Constitution, so why would I compromise on my gun rights, given to me by the 2nd Amendment?  

 

We have a process in America for amending the Constitution.  When the Constitution is amended to remove my gun ownership rights, then I'll willingly turn in my guns.  If the Constitution isn't amended, I don't need to compromise on my gun rights, it isn't a second class right, just like I don't need to compromise any of me other rights.

[Boiler 43,754]

[Boiler 43,754]

Man who opened fire on Texas church shooter hailed as 'good Samaritan'

Stephen Willeford says he ran barefoot across street to find gunman before jumping into another man’s car and giving chase

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/nov/06/stephen-willeford-johnnie-langendorff-texas-church-shooting

 

This is the guy we should be talking about, not the mentally deranged loser.

 

 

[Steeleballz 7,550]

2 hours ago, jayjayj said:

I didn't try to do anything.  You are projecting.  I simply stated we have a mental health problem and a criminal behavior problem in America.  We do not have a law abiding gun owner problem in America.  All three of those statements are facts and all are rather easy to understand.  

 

Any attempt to restrict lawful gun ownership is a direct attack on lawful gun owners.  You can spin as much as you want, but when you say gun control, you are talking about limiting a person's rights to lawfully own guns and eventually removing all guns from law abiding gun owners.  Criminals don't care about your laws, they never have and they never will.

 

We need to properly enforce the gun laws that are currently on the books.  Start prosecuting every single person who lies on purchase forms when they attempt to purchase a gun and lock them up.  Fix the mental health care system.  Create and enforce harsher sentences for violent crimes, especially those involving weapons of any kind.  Stop letting violent criminals out of prison early.  There are many things that should be done to fix the actual problems we have, but limiting lawful gun ownership isn't one of them.

 

In the end it doesn't matter, because our gun ownership rights are enshrined in the Constitution and you won't be changing that in my lifetime.  Luckily, we also have the NRA to push back on cooky gun control schemes, like a gun ownership registry with yearly inspections.  Gun owners know what happens after nationwide gun registries are created, nationwide gun confiscation.  

 

     We don't have a law abiding mental health problem or a law abiding criminal problem either. You are using a loaded phrase. We have a criminal behavior problem. We have an inadequate mental health system. We have a problem with irresponsible gun owners. Sometimes two or three of those issues cross paths. We need to evaluate how to minimize that.

[bcking 3,157]

1 minute ago, Boiler said:

 

(Forgive me if this doesn't work, I'm new to the whole "posting pictures" thing here)

 

I seriously laughed out loud when I read the part about "No one left to speak for [poor little old me with a shotgun]". Cry me a river.

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

55 minutes ago, smilesammich said:

unless i'm your wife, which i'm certain i am not, that is not a threat. i'm sorry if i made you feel threatened.

You   make several of us feel as though you are our wife 

[Boiler 43,754]

1 minute ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

You   make several of us feel as though you are our wife 

Probably makes better sandwiches.

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

47 minutes ago, IDWAF said:

I understand.  Not everyone gets to be as lucky as my wife.

 

But I've heard tales of your sandwiches.   I know a little of what lurks under each and every slice of bread...

Your wife is indeed blessed and spoiled daily  

[CaliCat 3,957]

3 minutes ago, Boiler said:

Man who opened fire on Texas church shooter hailed as 'good Samaritan'

Stephen Willeford says he ran barefoot across street to find gunman before jumping into another man’s car and giving chase

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/nov/06/stephen-willeford-johnnie-langendorff-texas-church-shooting

 

This is the guy we should be talking about, not the mentally deranged loser.

 

 

 

Don't want to talk about Trump? LOL.

 

Edited November 8, 2017 by CaliCat