'Enough is enough': Theresa May says there's been 'far too much tolerance' of 'evil' Islamist extremism in the UK

[spookyturtle 9,466]

19 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

The media is about making money.  They are a corporation as well.

And they push what sells. It's all about the ratings and enticing advertisers.

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24 minutes ago, Bill & Katya said:

The media is about making money.  They are a corporation as well.

Yes.

 

I'm not anti-corporation.

 

I'm against the level of monetary influence they currently have on Washington.

[IAMX 3,055]

2 hours ago, yuna628 said:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/live/2017/jun/03/london-bridge-closed-after-serious-police-incident-live

Police were warned about the main suspect radicalising children in a local park two years ago, a neighbour has revealed.

Erica Gasparri, an Italian mother of three who lives in the same complex, said she confronted the man, known locally as “Abs”, after her son came home and said: “Mummy, I want to be a Muslim.”

Gasparri then went to the park, where she said a “Pakistani man” had stated: “I’m ready to do whatever I need to do in the name of Allah. I am ready in the name of Allah to do what needs to be done, including killing my own mother.”

She said: “I took four photographs of him and gave them to the police. They rang Scotland Yard when I was there and said the information had been passed on to Scotland Yard. They were very concerned. They told me to delete the photos for my own safety which I did but then I heard nothing. That was two years ago. No-one came to me. If they did this could have been prevented and lives could have been saved.

“He would go down to the park and talk to them about Islam and he also came to the houses and gave the kids money and sweets during Ramadan.”
Gasparri said she told other neighbours including a Polish woman, who then tipped off the suspect that he had been reported to police.

Today that woman said she was sorry: “I didn’t know he was a bad guy. Maybe I was blind.”

In a stand-up row near the suspect’s flat on Sunday evening, Erica told the Polish woman: “My first impressions was he was a terrorist radicaliser.”

Met Police said they were aware of the claims, but had no comment at this stage, as they had not released any information about any of the suspects.

It seems nearly every time it's a situation that is foreseen and when something should have been done or followed up on, it wasn't. I can only wonder what the underlying reason is for not pursuing what's obvious radicalization. 

[Boiler 47,499]

7 minutes ago, IAMX said:

It seems nearly every time it's a situation that is foreseen and when something should have been done or followed up on, it wasn't. I can only wonder what the underlying reason is for not pursuing what's obvious radicalization. 

Islamophobia?

[IAMX 3,055]

2 minutes ago, Boiler said:

Islamophobia?

Apparently people need to hold candlelight vigils and put lights on landmarks I guess that's how to defeat terrorism. 

[IAMX 3,055]

26 minutes ago, IAMX said:

Apparently people need to hold candlelight vigils and put lights on landmarks I guess that's how to defeat terrorism. 

Also.. related:

 

[Boiler 47,499]

I Tweet, guaranteed winner so I am told.

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

Machete don't tweet 

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Fighting radical Islamic terrorism is an extremely difficult thing and not an exact science, and never will be.  We cannot just round up all Muslims living in the U.S. or western nations and ship them back or imprison them.  This would involve taking away the freedoms of ordinary peaceful U.S. citizens and legal green card holders just based on their ethnicity or religion.  Not all Muslims are radical Islamic terrorists, just as not all Christians are Westburo fundamentalists.  It will therefore always be a problem.  All we can do is do what we can to minimize it the best we can without curtailing these basic rights of citizens who do not practice terrorism and be vigilant in police and convict instances like we do all crime.

 

One thing that can be done by our leaders, in addition to the above, I think, that really hasn't been done well enough before by our leaders, including our President, is to go out of our way to befriend the Muslim leaders living in our country who do not agree with what the terrorists are doing.  This involves being proactive in reaching out to them, inviting them to the White House or Capital, meeting with them, what have you.  And, in meeting with them, really come to a mutual agreement that terrorism is not the answer to differences and that we must work together to fight it.  Then, in addition to this, go before the camera afterwards, with these Muslim leaders, and announce the solidarity and make clear that the U.S. is NOT against Muslims in general, that they are our friends, and that we stand side by side with them in denouncing radical Islamic terrorism, and plan on fighting TOGETHER against it.  And this message needs to be repeated many times every year, and especially upon the instance of every terrorist attack, as anti-Muslim passions tend to spark after such.

 

What this would do is make it clearer to everyone that we are not against Muslims, but are against a small radical segment of Muslims, and that the two are separate.  Westburo is not taken seriously for a reason.

 

Trump attacking Muslims is not the answer and is counterproductive in this regard.  Especially with a radical group that feeds off retaliation.

 

[The Nature Boy 7,659]

5 minutes ago, Leon & Mylen said:

Fighting radical Islamic terrorism is an extremely difficult thing and not an exact science, and never will be.  We cannot just round up all Muslims living in the U.S. or western nations and ship them back or imprison them.  This would involve taking away the freedoms of ordinary peaceful U.S. citizens and legal green card holders just based on their ethnicity or religion.  Not all Muslims are radical Islamic terrorists, just as not all Christians are Westburo fundamentalists.  It will therefore always be a problem.  All we can do is do what we can to minimize it the best we can without curtailing these basic rights of citizens who do not practice terrorism and be vigilant in police and convict instances like we do all crime.

 

One thing that can be done by our leaders, in addition to the above, I think, that really hasn't been done well enough before by our leaders, including our President, is to go out of our way to befriend the Muslim leaders living in our country who do not agree with what the terrorists are doing.  This involves being proactive in reaching out to them, inviting them to the White House or Capital, meeting with them, what have you.  And, in meeting with them, really come to a mutual agreement that terrorism is not the answer to differences and that we must work together to fight it.  Then, in addition to this, go before the camera afterwards, with these Muslim leaders, and announce the solidarity and make clear that the U.S. is NOT against Muslims in general, that they are our friends, and that we stand side by side with them in denouncing radical Islamic terrorism, and plan on fighting TOGETHER against it.  And this message needs to be repeated many times every year, and especially upon the instance of every terrorist attack, as anti-Muslim passions tend to spark after such.

 

What this would do is make it clearer to everyone that we are not against Muslims, but are against a small radical segment of Muslims, and that the two are separate.  Westburo is not taken seriously for a reason.

 

Trump attacking Muslims is not the answer and is counterproductive in this regard.  Especially with a radical group that feeds off retaliation.

 

There are less than 100 Westburo church members. Many millions of radical Islamist.  Not a valid analogy 

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Just now, Nature Boy Flair said:

There are less than 100 Westburo church members. Many millions of radical Islamist.  Not a valid analogy 

My analogy is simply that radical Islamic terrorism is a small segment of the Muslim religion in general, a total of 1.6 billion adherents.  Yet, you wouldn't know this based on publicity.  I think if our leaders went out of their way to help people realize this, it would help in this regard, and ultimately help minimize growth that comes from resulting racism and disenfranchisement.

[IAMX 3,055]

21 minutes ago, Nature Boy Flair said:

There are less than 100 Westburo church members. Many millions of radical Islamist.  Not a valid analogy 

They're also not killing people, just being annoying.

 

But I can see the liberal logic.

 

Murdering people = annoying people or being offensive.

Edited June 5, 2017 by IAMX

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Sigh.  

 

Yes, let's completely ignore the message I was trying to get out and instead focus on a technicality that it's usage or non-usage really would have had zero effect in changing the principles of the message itself either way.

 

Jesus Christ.

[yuna628 9,873]

Quote

A friend of one of the suspected attackers says he informed the anti-terror hotline of his fears, but no further action was taken by authorities.

The man, who asked not to be named, claimed that he was left horrified when his friend attempted to justify previous terror attacks.

Speaking to the BBC’s Asian Network, he said: “We spoke about a particular attack that had happened and, like most radicals, he had a justification for anything, everything and anything.

“That day I realised that I need to contact the authorities.”

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3722670/pal-of-london-bridge-terrorist-reported-him-to-anti-terror-hotline-but-claims-no-action-was-taken/

 

 

[OriZ 3,165]

10 hours ago, spookyturtle said:

The problem is real. How can it be stopped? 

I love that you always ask that question

 

9 hours ago, yuna628 said:

And yet Muslims of the community, even family members, did come forward, for years in fact, regarding the Manchester bomber, and the government did nothing. I suspect, we're going to find a similar pattern emerge... and it's disgustingly predictable. As often happens in such attacks, the government knows about these individuals... and do not act. Police forces have been severely cut across the country, the government is supposedly aware of many dangerous individuals but have not as of yet removed or prosecuted them, the government specifically gained power to invade every facet of British private life in the interest of stopping terrorism but has yet to really use such power (and it hasn't worked out well for them), their community outreach has been poor, in particular they have utilized and paid some 'community leaders' who other moderate Muslims have accused of being self-serving and only in it for money and votes and not solving problems (this is actually no different than the corrupt community leaders in our inner cities today). The government has also done hypocritical deals with sponsors of terrorism in the goal of protecting interests at the expense of their citizens. London government is tone-deaf to the issues facing the rest of the UK.

 

There are people that say this is the new normal.. horrific violence I mean. My husband points out to me that there is horrific violence that goes on in our American cities every single day. And no they aren't people wanting to kill others for some religious ideology, but they are people murdering others for any reason or no reason at all. As a person who grew up in the city of daily violence it was the normal then. And it is the normal now. Can hatred in all it's forms be cured? Unlikely... but it is the real problem that is rarely addressed. People in the UK are not as vigilant as they can be. My husband will admit this, because violence is not the same problem there as it is here. When armed officers patrol the streets, people often react fearfully instead of feeling more confident or safe. Look online right now and you'll see the hatred spewed as the new knee-jerk reaction. What they don't realize is that they are doing exactly what the murderers want. Their hatred is contributing to part of the problem. The UK having bombers with religious and political ideology isn't new and they shouldn't kid themselves about that. They've been there before. Where did hatred get them then?

 

As I mentioned before, a British ex of mine whom I still talk to has a Muslim Iranian side on her mom's(or mum's) side and a British dad. Classic example of a family that integrated very well. I would never think of any of them as people who can support terrorism so I almost take personal offense when the whole religion gets blamed for those attacks. That said I also realize that while there's a ton of good muslims, there's also a ton of not so good ones. She acknowledges that as well. However there really isn't much more than what's being done that can be done. Israel has a 25% muslim population that's very sympathetic to the Palestinian cause as they are basically Palestinians themselves. Yet attacks by an Israeli muslim citizen are very rare. They happen, but not often. It's usually the Palestinians outside of Israel, who don't have as much to lose that commit these attacks. So I think they key is twofold: to make sure they are provided with the tools to have a good life, as well as good intelligence to thwrart the attacks that are planned.

 

6 hours ago, ccneat said:

Here is my problem with headlines: the goal of terrorist is : Terror.  I know I will win no points by pointing out the disproportionate attention we give by acknowledging this event or it's signifigance compared to other death or injury.  

 

I have no intention of being naive about the threats but I think as a group it is better that we double down on the living life in spite of these threats. Bravo To Ms Grande taking the stage tonight in the same place her performance was marred by needless death and violence.  That is the best response to death, double down on the living as a way of telling terrorists effu. Jacques has it right : cheers at the Winchester to celebrate the living.  

As per my comment in the other thread I found it utterly ridiculous this was reported all night long. That does contribute unnecessarily to the hysteria, and also points to hypocrisy of not reporting much on attacks in many other countries, as if British/French blood is more valuable or something.