What does "family friendly" mean in the context of VJ?

[Flames9_RN 358]

@Flames, if it were just the Off Topic and Religion forums, I'd say you're right. Every board I have been on that has an off-topic section is usually a little wilder. And again, maybe because I'm new I don't "get" how the regional forums are supposed to operate here, but it was my understanding that it was a place for cultural topics that would be of most value to families with ties to that country, and also a place to discuss differences in the immigration process for that country or group of countries. I never expected to see a thread where the majority viewpoint about the illegal sex slavery trade in Ukraine is that it's the woman's fault and she should have known better.

The last thing I expected to see was the absolute most vile language and viewpoints towards women and the country overall. I saw the phrase "sperm bucket" used in one conversation. The phrase wasn't directed at anyone in particular, but the fact that somebody can get away with using it on (again, correct me if I'm wrong) a "family friendly" site just amazed me.

Captain Ewok, thanks for looking at my concern. (at least I think that's what you meant. )

I pretty much stay to the Canada forum, and its pretty civil there, can't say what happens to the other "country" sub forums. But I share your frustration on how one would think this site would be a family friendly, how how it could be civil! But thats not the case. been a downward spiral for awhile, not sure it can be saved, I guess the best thing one can do is just stay away from the areas that cause the most trouble.

At 1 time, yrs ago, there was a sense of "family" on VJ, but thats long gone, thats why many of the knowledgeable posters no longer post here.

[^_^ 5,021]

Years ago, OT was just a bunch of chicks giggling about lube and their husbands WMDs.

[Captain Ewok 1,857]

@Flames, if it were just the Off Topic and Religion forums, I'd say you're right. Every board I have been on that has an off-topic section is usually a little wilder. And again, maybe because I'm new I don't "get" how the regional forums are supposed to operate here, but it was my understanding that it was a place for cultural topics that would be of most value to families with ties to that country, and also a place to discuss differences in the immigration process for that country or group of countries. I never expected to see a thread where the majority viewpoint about the illegal sex slavery trade in Ukraine is that it's the woman's fault and she should have known better.

The last thing I expected to see was the absolute most vile language and viewpoints towards women and the country overall. I saw the phrase "sperm bucket" used in one conversation. The phrase wasn't directed at anyone in particular, but the fact that somebody can get away with using it on (again, correct me if I'm wrong) a "family friendly" site just amazed me.

Captain Ewok, thanks for looking at my concern. (at least I think that's what you meant. )

Anything for a fellow officer.

[Captain Hammer 113]

Anything for a fellow officer.

/gives secret salute

[TracyTN 237]

Newbie here, so pardon if it seems like I'm intruding, but the topic of this thread is one I've been asking myself for some time. I'm newly registered but I've been lurking one particular regional for some time. And instead of beating around the bush any more, I'll just come out and say it's the Russia/Ukraine/Belarus regional. Some...no...MUCH...of what I read in that forum is to put it mildly, disgusting. It's like some good old boy's club from the 1970s. Women are spoken about in the most awful terms, and when someone takes issue with it then they're just one of those awful Western feminazis, or they'll defend themselves by saying they're just joking and having good fun. I should caveat that I'm not talking about everyone in there. In fact, it's really only about 3-4 names that keep popping up this way. But there never seems to be any moderator who steps in to say this or that is inappropriate. I dunno, is this normal for this site?

I get the impression Visa Journey tries to label itself as "family friendly," and I think I've even read it somewhere. I also don't see quite this level of inappropriate locker room "humor" in the other regional forums. I'm too new here to offer up any reasons as to why that is--are there specific moderators who handle specific regions and this one is just being neglected? I don't know. But at least the forum I mentioned isn't even close to what I'd call "family friendly."

I've kept my mouth shut for these few months because we're coming up on our 10 year green card, Visa Journey seems like a great resource that I wish I'd known about in the beginning, and I didn't want to alienate possible resources in the specific regional forum that could be of the most help. But thanks to this thread, I just can't keep my mouth shut anymore so I'll take my chances. I tried using the "Contact us" link to voice my concerns, but I don't think anyone reads it because I've had no reply.

Anyway, my experience so far is that if this site is labeling itself as "family friendly," then it's got a long way to go. Ironic in a sad sort of a way for a family immigration web site.

I applaud you for pointing this out. As one of the supposed 'Western Feminazis', I haven't even bothered to reply to such drivel because I know I'd just be dismissed out of hand. But what goes on in there from a select few is quite disturbing - esp. since it is going on unchecked.

[^_^ 5,021]

I applaud you for pointing this out. As one of the supposed 'Western Feminazis', I haven't even bothered to reply to such drivel because I know I'd just be dismissed out of hand. But what goes on in there from a select few is quite disturbing - esp. since it is going on unchecked.

Tracy, Harper's Magazine did a great piece back in 2006 called "A Foreign Affair". It profiles the men you're talking about quite well. I've reposted it on VJ (the Harper's site has erratic performance) - enjoy!

A Foreign Affair

[Captain Hammer 113]

I applaud you for pointing this out. As one of the supposed 'Western Feminazis', I haven't even bothered to reply to such drivel because I know I'd just be dismissed out of hand. But what goes on in there from a select few is quite disturbing - esp. since it is going on unchecked.

Hehe, well you don't have to be a feminist or even a woman to suffer the wrath of the vocal minority. You just need to be relatively new to the site, and have an honest disagreement. For a small but vocal minority, being new and disagreeing means you are a troll from the Canadian or UK forums. But seriously, it's only a small handful.

Captain Ewok says help is coming, so I am hopeful. For the free exchange of ideas to work, there has to be more signal than noise.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

Captain Ewok says help is coming, so I am hopeful. For the free exchange of ideas to work, there has to be more signal than noise.

I see a modship in your future, if the past is any indicator.

[elmcitymaven 9,711]

Just popping back into this thread -- thanks, Captain (Ewok) for looking at this. (And thanks Captain Hammer for a note of reason!) Also good to hear from others that I'm not alone in thinking that things are a little out of hand in places.

[Captain Hammer 113]

I'd just like to add that it doesn't help when people from other regional forums come into RUB for the sole purpose of berating. I think there's an inherent desire to protect your "home turf," and it just winds up causing even more problems. Probably better to just press the "report" button rather than engaging.

Edited March 9, 2011 by Captain Hammer

[TracyTN 237]

I don't necessarily agree with that. This is an open forum and no matter if you're in the 'comfort' of your regional, you better be prepared to stand by what you say, as well as expect others to not always agree with you. Being in the regional forum doesn't give you a license to be a jerk, in my mind.

Now going to a regional for the sole purpose of causing trouble - which is trolling, basically - is another matter.

[Captain Hammer 113]

I don't necessarily agree with that. This is an open forum and no matter if you're in the 'comfort' of your regional, you better be prepared to stand by what you say, as well as expect others to not always agree with you. Being in the regional forum doesn't give you a license to be a jerk, in my mind.

Now going to a regional for the sole purpose of causing trouble - which is trolling, basically - is another matter.

I agree with you, that nobody should feel unwelcome in another regional forum. But in the current situation, it really depends on your goals. I don't mean this badly, but if your goal is to feel better that you challenged someone because (for example) they espouse terrible things about women, then that's one thing. Just understand that it's only going to feed the flames. It just feeds into it.

But if your goal is to keep that kind of discussion from polluting civil discourse, then I think reporting is the more productive way to go.

[TracyTN 237]

Well, I read it and I knew that it would go nowhere for me to try and make a rational point. (Sort of like the definition of insanity.) Nor did I really care because cheeseheads will be cheeseheads.

So it's a bit about knowing who the players are. If you don't know anything about the 'culture' in that forum, then you may try to jump in and make some headway only to be beaten down. No way for people to understand that unless and until they experience it themselves, unfortunately - which is why some mod intervention would be a help (bringing us back to the original point, as well as the suggestion of reporting).

[elmcitymaven 9,711]

Wish I could add a +1 to what you've said in here Tracy, but I've fulfilled my daily quota!

I think my own way of dealing with these issues has changed over the past couple of days -- I feel less like I want to be aggressive, and more like I want to actually engage in some real dialogue on particular issues that trouble me. I know I probably won't change most minds on things, but that doesn't give me carte blanche to be rude back. I know the UK forum has its own culture of trial by fire (cf the meltdown last year that resulted in the UK B!tches thread) which can be scary when you first start out. But I think we do a pretty good job of including people from other regions when they want to actively participate in discussions. I'd love to see that in all the regional fora, but it will take goodwill on both sides of the divide.

And I don't know how to engender that!

[Empress of Groovy 373]

This is a very interesting, and indeed tricky, topic. I've thought a fair bit about this over the years. One of the reasons I've been an active member (well, maybe not all that active--after 5 1/2 years I only have three hearts!) for so long is that VJ is a really interesting and fun site because of its exceptionally diverse membership.

I don't think "family friendly" is an apt term to describe its ideal tone, though. As someone mentioned, users are nearly all adults, and I don't think someone should be reprimanded for typing something racy. Boasting about one's wife's BJ prowess, for example, while cringe-inducing and uncouth in the extreme, shouldn't be off limits, I don't think. Fortunately, most posters have the good manners not to post detailed descriptions of their encounters, which brings up another question about what might constitute obscenity.

As for the out and out insults toward entire groups--all men or women from a certain country or region, for example--that's a trickier matter because it may contribute to the site appearing to be less than hospitable. Cultivating a welcoming atmosphere, which I think VJ does quite well on the whole, is paramount. Personally, I couldn't give a sh!t less what certain posters think about "American women." As Tracy said, cheeseheads will be cheeseheads. And given that a good number of VJ members are either American women or foreign men married or engaged to American women, these guys end up looking like a Grade A assmonkeys. Maybe the question is whether people should be free to be Grade A assmonkeys? I think so, for the most part, but some members might be driven away by this sort of thing.

With so many users from so many different places going through a stressful process, you're going to have some--er--colorful language and exchanges.

I'm not sure if I'm even making a point here, except to note that this is an interesting discussion!