A Plea to Long Time, Level-Headed Members Who Still Post Here

[Heracles 417]

I wasn't trying to offend you BY, just pointing out your nescience. You further prove my point I made before. You can't articulate your point without resorting to some sort of derogatory term. Whether you're making blatant, or latent racist statement or term is immaterial. If you can't see the racism, then you are far too myopic.

BY, this just shows how ignorant you are when it comes to research. One person's story is his own, but a single story does not equate to some sort of empirical evidence. Under that guise, I could go talk to a cop I know at a bar I frequent and get his drunken ramblings and pass it off as some sort of expert testimony. You're experiences in foreign countries are your own, and you should represent them as such, not as some sort of published evidence, or some sort of global consensus.

Come on Harry, quit buing so disingenuous. You're a troll too.

We have to agree to disagree.

Bill actually. Don't go all spook on me..

[Captain Ewok 1,858]

I would like to ask that given this is a site related discussion topic, especially, that we keep it on topic and also towards items that will benefit the site. Personal battles in this topic do not help much.

twice just be be sure people spot this . Any feedback on having a system to identify "habitual" TOS offenders. This would be in addition to clarifying and standardizing TOS enforcement guidelines (time for offenses, more specifics to guide moderators, requirement to cite provision used to suspend members (the time would be defined there).

[The_Dude 1,142]

We have to agree to disagree.

Bill actually. Don't go all spook on me..

Well, there was some discussion in here about citing references and properly contexting statistics. I think it misrepresents things if you state the story of one person as somehow representative of a larger group. I frequently have to distribute reports that I author to outside groups. I would be literally laughed out of my job onto the unemployment line if I tried to pass of anecdotal testimony as some sort of fact.

Edit: Not trying to make this a back and forth, trying to stear it back to the greater topic.

Edited May 26, 2010 by Rob and Mel

[one...two...tree 2,762]

steven, i'm not misrepresnting your intentions. i firmly believe what i posted. we have had private discussions countless times about the civility of the OT & what makes people that normally don't start out throwing flames come out throwing flames. its the hostility they recieve from you & like minded members. to which each time your responce has been 'its not me its everyone else'. posting a plea to tenured members isn't your style for achieving an honest goal, pm campaigns are your style.

Mike, you either haven't read what I've posted here or you're choosing to ignore what I've said. I don't want to get into a long drawn out argument now over what I've stated here because it's there for everyone to read, but I've admitted that I too have engaged in the antagonism that bleeds from one thread to another. Just about everyone who has hung out in OT for a long enough time have. I used to think that with less moderation, people would be freer to speak their minds, but instead what happens is that every conversation gets dumbed down to playground antics. While playground antics have always existed in OT, there used to be enough level-headed posters who kept the behavior in check, but most of them have left OT because it has gotten out of hand. I'm not just saying this. I've had many private conversations with people who don't post in OT for this very reason. I'm being sincere and honest here and if you can't give me the benefit of the doubt then I don't know what else to say to you about it.

Edited May 26, 2010 by El Buscador

[Susita 175]

I would honestly have more respect for the people who make these racist comments if they would just come out and admit their prejudices instead of making racist remarks and then denying them.

The people who post this nonsense are spineless. You're hiding behind a computer screen for god's sake. I wonder if they're cowards or just in denial.

[Captain Ewok 1,858]

I thought this was interesting given the comments here....

http://lifehacker.com/5547607/how-can-i-de+troll-my-internet

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I thought this was interesting given the comments here....

http://lifehacker.com/5547607/how-can-i-de+troll-my-internet

This comment puts it about right:

timgray

07:02 AM

Step 1 - Stop calling a different opinion a troll. Many people call "trolling" something that does not agree with them. That makes them the troll.

Step 2 - either log off or stop reading comments. there are some forums I simply don't read because they are troll infested, although spammers outnumber trolls 3 to 1 in those places. No one website has the only fountain of information. Go elsewhere for the same info where the out of control users are controlled better.

Step 3 - Understand that humans, by nature, are actually quite rude when they have no direct recourse to their behavior. You would not dare to walk to the front of a line and cut in front of someone, yet you are willing to drive like a maniac and force your way into traffic. In a line, the guy you cut in front of can easily smack you, and push you back out of the line. In the car they can't. It's why people are comfortable being completely rude on the highway and the internet.

okenny ...building bridges (to hide under) promoted this comment

timgray was starred

Either you have a free discussion, or you don't. As long as you are clear about what is acceptable behavior, and enforce it, then you get to keep the site the way you want it. Otherwise, folks will continue to push the boundaries in an interactive environment. The problem I see with the solution you and the rest of the moderation staff are considering, is that in essence, you are just feeding the problem by creating a challenge to few dozen VJ members to see how close they can get, without crossing the line, and another dozen members, that proudly flaunt suspensions as some sort of badge of honor, in some sort of warped martyrdom fantasy world.

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

What I find interesting is the "just log off" bit.

Maybe we should all do that!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I thought this was interesting given the comments here....

http://lifehacker.co...oll-my-internet

I think using filters would be great, especially in tandem with a "was this post helpful?" where a member could set the filter to show the posts by or of most helpful to least helpful. We'd need to change the multiquote settings though so that posts by themselves will make more sense.

[Peikko 1,575]

I brought up the gang thing because it is a perfect illustration of how a bigoted view is constantly promoted in OT without once any moderator attempting to clearly explain why it is that such a view is unacceptable on a web site that caters to such a diverse membership.

[SMOKE 1,426]

Mike,

i've read the halo-turning over a new leaf act before & no you're not going to convince me you're being genuine this time. as for more to the letter written TOS enforcement in the OT.. i'm all for it as long as it remain equal. which btw is why some VJ OT forum regulars have left. they couldn't handle the TOS enforcement or lack there of being administerd equally....just like the 'experiment' you referred too in making your points.

[Peikko 1,575]

i've read the halo-turning over a new leaf act before & no you're not going to convince me you're being genuine this time. as for more to the letter written TOS enforcement in the OT.. i'm all for it as long as it remain equal. which btw is why some VJ OT forum regulars have left. they couldn't handle the TOS enforcement or lack there of being administerd equally....just like the 'experiment' you referred too in making your points.

I do not think equality matters when it is down to name calling and general pissyness, but if this forum is meant to reflect a strict policy on racism, some opinions are simply not acceptable, period.

[Darnell 8,478]

I would like to ask that given this is a site related discussion topic, especially, that we keep it on topic and also towards items that will benefit the site. Personal battles in this topic do not help much.

I'm hoping you can see - that those with personal battles need to be 'gone', ya ? It's just another 'characteristic' of 'that demographic'.

Please - send them away? 1 month ban? Purty Please?

[Darnell 8,478]

twice just be be sure people spot this . Any feedback on having a system to identify "habitual" TOS offenders. This would be in addition to clarifying and standardizing TOS enforcement guidelines (time for offenses, more specifics to guide moderators, requirement to cite provision used to suspend members (the time would be defined there).

Happy to give FeedBack !

3 strikes, a 2 week ban each strike, then 4th strike, gone.

IMO, no need to 'cite provisions used to suspend members' when actually suspending a member - as the provisions should be posted somewhere for 'guest' viewing.

re: the system - come on - this site has mysql backend - a few tables here and there, with php/ajax interface for the moderators to 'do stuff', collect the data.

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

I'm hoping you can see - that those with personal battles need to be 'gone', ya ? It's just another 'characteristic' of 'that demographic'.

Please - send them away? 1 month ban? Purty Please?

A thirty day ban for everyone with 10,000 posts, or more? You betcha! I could go for a sabbatical, if only to give everybody else a chance to breath freely for a month.