Racism in America

[Susita 175]

I just wanted to make a personal post, after reading all these articles and all this anti-illegal immigration banter back and forth. I had some personal questions for the people who support the AZ immigration bill who claim they're not "racists" and that racism against latinos wasn't a motivator in the bill.

First and foremost, I will not deny that illegal immigration is a problem. It is a HUGE one. This bill however is also a HUGE problem and in my opinion it fixes nothing.

A lot of people seem to dehumanize illegal immigrants, and it's disheartening really. A few posts that I've read have actually gone to the point of actually scaring me. I think what it comes down to is - we are all human. We are all sons/daughters of God (or whatever higher being you believe in). How, I ask, can people be so heartless as to say something like "shoot them if they try to cross the border," etc. These are HUMAN BEINGS. Mothers, fathers, sons, daughters, grandchildren... just like you and I. Does it matter that their skin is a little darker than yours? Really? Does that make a difference? Does that make you more human than them? The answer is NO.

Does committing a crime give someone the right to kill you? Have you driven with a suspended license before? Blown a red light? Drank while underage? Were you shot on sight?

And another thing. How can we justify stereotyping and legalizing prejudice against latino-looking US citizens/legal aliens? This is a very personal topic for me. I don't understand how just because of someone's skin tone or ethnic background, they can be suspected of illegal immigration. Do you all see that picture in my signature? Those are my children, they are Americans. Born in this country, speak English, we are hard working parents, pay taxes... heck, I even work for the fed. gov't. So is the fact that their skin is darker than yours, or that we are bilingual and speak Spanish at home, or that their last name is Latino, or that we eat arroz con pollo for dinner, is that going to make them less of a human being to you? Are you somehow better than us?

I just wanted to say that. I feel it needed to be said. The coffee needs to be made so everyone can WAKE UP and smell it.

[Obama 2012 1,714]

The law doesn't call for cops to point out Latinos. It calls for them to work with Federal Authorities on illegal immigration.

It's simple: You're brown, white, black, red, yellow - you don't have proper ID, they'll try and look you up in the system. They can't find you in the system, they are going to detain you (as they do now anyway) to try and figure out who you are.

The only thing this law allows local autorities to do differently than what they already do. Well it actually demands it of them, is to work with federal authorities to check on immigration status of those that they cannot identify and to hand those who are illegal over to federal authorities.

The fact of the matter is, the vast overwhelmingly majority of illegal immigrants are Latinos. That's not going to change anytime soon. It's complete chaos to our south in most nations and people are looking for an escape. Unfortuantely, their escape into this country is criminal and is an invasion of a sovereign nation. If they are getting in, who else is getting in? Every person that crosses that border ilegally is a threat to our national security and should be treated as such. - Imagine one of the people crossing the border with a large backpack bomb and walking into the middle of downtown Tucson. It's be damn easy....

We have a right to protect our nation. Sure, these are people, but they are people who are violating the law of the land and not giving a damn about our nation by abusing the sytem we have in place. I have no sympathy personally, nor will I ever. - If these people REALLY AND TRULY want a better life, it is their responsibility to TAKE BACK THEIR NATION and not invade ours. If they want to come here, there's a legal and rightful way to do so. It's time that Mexican citizens took back Mexico. It's time the same thing happenened in central and south American countries as well. - Stop using us as an escape pod. We are not such. Nor can we afford to be any longer.

[Darnell 8,478]

I think a Venn Diagram starting with 'Racism in America' and ending up with 'American-born Latinos' would be a good thing to do, yes?

Somewhere in the mix, add in subsets of 'latino illegal aliens', 'illegal aliens', 'latino legal aliens', along with other things you'd like to add in there.

IMO, that first version of the AZ bill NEEDED Racial Profiling to 'work properly'. But that's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it. OTOH, good to see the wording was changed up!

I can understand, if yer having a personal reaction to all of this. No harm, no foul, no worries there. Unfortunately, illegal aliens in the USA, is a larger issue than your (or my ) personal reactions. That in itself is SAD, but I had to say it - tis HUGE problem, to be fixed. IMO, the AZ 'initiative' won't 'fix illegal alien presence in AZ', but it's a first step, right or wrong - an 'entity' has to start somewhere, ya?

BUT - again, IMO -

to label 'this' as 'racist', is not fair, regardless of who you are. Illegal Alien Presence in the USA is illegal, no matter the country of origin.

[Susita 175]

I'm labeling it as racist because it was drafted by racists, who are very proud and outspoken about their involvement in the bill. I didn't say it, they did. Since when can someone's biases not filter through in their work?

"Reasonable suspicion"... like Jon Stewart says... what's reasonable suspicion? doing yardwork? burping a white person's baby?

[Obama 2012 1,714]

I'm labeling it as racist because it was drafted by racists, who are very proud and outspoken about their involvement in the bill. I didn't say it, they did. Since when can someone's biases not filter through in their work?

"Reasonable suspicion"... like Jon Stewart says... what's reasonable suspicion? doing yardwork? burping a white person's baby?

The law said that to go with a 'lawful' encounter. they changed it to 'lawful' stop. The key word both times is 'lawful.'

An officer can't just question you without other legal reasoning. No matter who you are.

[Darnell 8,478]

I dunno - I have to seek for balance in there, somehow. If 10 illegal aliens are yanked out of Arizona, that's 10 less that will use any medical facility for free. 10 less 'freebies' decreases my costs for medical procedures, always.

I can understand yer POV about this, but I don't share it. Does that make me racist? Oh I hope not !!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Suzy, I've been ostracized by showing the evidence that it is in fact racist groups that are behind such initiatives as English only, ending birthright citizenship and the recent passage of the Arizona Law. There has always been a nativist bigotry behind the anti-immigration rhetoric and I think most people have prejudices, but the climate has been just right for white supremest groups under the guise of more legitimately named groups like FAIR and NumbersUSA to galvanize people's anger and frustration and focus those misplace emotions on the undocumented workers who happen to clean their offices at night, hand wash their cars, or prepare their food.

Why should we be letting racist groups like FAIR write our immigration policies? Why are people supporting their agenda?

[Susita 175]

If they are getting in, who else is getting in? Every person that crosses that border ilegally is a threat to our national security and should be treated as such. - Imagine one of the people crossing the border with a large backpack bomb and walking into the middle of downtown Tucson. It's be damn easy....

If I remember correctly, you're the one who said to shoot illegal immigrants on site if they were caught crossing the border. I can't really respect anything you say when you're wishing death upon other human beings...

And if I also remember correctly, the terrorists didn't get in through our southern border

[sachinky 464]

Just a few random thoughts.

--I support this bill.

--I'm not a racist. I don't think so. [but could very well be. Most of us inherently are, I think, even though we pretend to be good liberals.]

--I'm not an illegal alien cheerleader, frankly, if this bill gets even one illegal immigrant deported, then more power to it. I'm brown-skinned, Indian, soon-to-be-a LEGAL-immigrant. Hopefully. And illegal immigrants MAKE MY BLOOD BOIL. I'm also aware that many of the overstayers are Indians on tourist visas. (I've personally heard someone declare that all they want "is a U.S. tourist visa--once I'm in, I'm never coming back.) What does that make me? Hater of brown-people and all Indians?

--Is it true, someone like your husband may be inconvenienced due to his skin color? Possibly. But he's legal, yea? He'll produce his documentation and be on his way. What's that? 5 seconds of his time?

--Anyway, I don't think this bill is racist. Or is racist against a certain group of people. It is a piece of legislature. It makes no distinctions between races, simply enforces federal law on the books. Laws are interpreted and applied by human beings, who may or may not be racist.

--Just this morning I got a real chuckle. I was wondering what would happen to me if I tried to sneak across the Indo-Pak border into Pakistan. What do you think would happen? I'd be welcomed with open arms?

--I have NO sympathy for illegal immigrants. None. I don't care if they were only trying to feed their family or better their future. Just as I wouldn't be sympathetic if there was an armed robbery and the perp said that they did it to feed their family.

[Darnell 8,478]

The 'bill originators' were labelled as Racists? OK - was it a 'self-imposed' label or a label by some other entity? If other entity, which one? I note anything put out by La Raza on this, totally misses the point of 'being legal in USA'.

[Danno 1,228]

I just wanted to make a personal post, after reading all these articles and all this anti-illegal immigration banter back and forth. I had some personal questions for the people who support the AZ immigration bill who claim they're not "racists" and that racism against latinos wasn't a motivator in the bill.

First and foremost, I will not deny that illegal immigration is a problem. It is a HUGE one. This bill however is also a HUGE problem and in my opinion it fixes nothing.

A lot of people seem to dehumanize illegal immigrants, and it's disheartening really. A few posts that I've read have actually gone to the point of actually scaring me. I think what it comes down to is - we are all human. We are all sons/daughters of God (or whatever higher being you believe in). How, I ask, can people be so heartless as to say something like "shoot them if they try to cross the border," etc. These are HUMAN BEINGS. Mothers, fathers, sons, daughters, grandchildren... just like you and I. Does it matter that their skin is a little darker than yours? Really? Does that make a difference? Does that make you more human than them? The answer is NO.

Does committing a crime give someone the right to kill you? Have you driven with a suspended license before? Blown a red light? Drank while underage? Were you shot on sight?

And another thing. How can we justify stereotyping and legalizing prejudice against latino-looking US citizens/legal aliens? This is a very personal topic for me. I don't understand how just because of someone's skin tone or ethnic background, they can be suspected of illegal immigration. Do you all see that picture in my signature? Those are my children, they are Americans. Born in this country, speak English, we are hard working parents, pay taxes... heck, I even work for the fed. gov't. So is the fact that their skin is darker than yours, or that we are bilingual and speak Spanish at home, or that their last name is Latino, or that we eat arroz con pollo for dinner, is that going to make them less of a human being to you? Are you somehow better than us?

I just wanted to say that. I feel it needed to be said. The coffee needs to be made so everyone can WAKE UP and smell it.

WHen you take the blinders off you will see the only reason you feel it has to do with race is because the offenders are by huge margins of a darker color.

I am I think I speak for some others don't care what color the person is, all I know is they are coming here in droves and 1. need to be stopped and 2. those who butted in front of legal immigrants need to go the hell home and come through the front door like many do.... by waiting and paying.

You can flatter yourself that you are on the right side of some moral racial issue but you are only kidding yourself.

Every country has the right to decide and control who enters their country, no one should be permitted to by-pass that system...... I don't care who they are or how "human" they are, as you put it.

I have never endorsed -shoot to kill- methods to stop people and I even like Hispanics but this Bull-###### has to stop.

[Susita 175]

I dunno - I have to seek for balance in there, somehow. If 10 illegal aliens are yanked out of Arizona, that's 10 less that will use any medical facility for free. 10 less 'freebies' decreases my costs for medical procedures, always.

I can understand yer POV about this, but I don't share it. Does that make me racist? Oh I hope not !!

I AGREE something does need to be done about illegal immigration. We even have a problem with it up here in NY (though nothing compared to what they have to deal with in Arizona). Racial profiling is undoubtedly going to happen... hey, it even happens here... but the point is, it's unacceptable. When it's already a problem, why create a law that will ultimately facilitate it?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I dunno - I have to seek for balance in there, somehow. If 10 illegal aliens are yanked out of Arizona, that's 10 less that will use any medical facility for free. 10 less 'freebies' decreases my costs for medical procedures, always.

I can understand yer POV about this, but I don't share it. Does that make me racist? Oh I hope not !!

They pay taxes just like you and me. What makes you think they don't?

We lose more tax revenue from corporations moving their offices to offshore tax havens than probably any other loss - does that bother you?

[sachinky 464]

I'm not anti-immigration. I'm anti-ILLEGAL-immigration. BIG difference.

[Ban Hammer 12,839]

Does committing a crime give someone the right to kill you?

depends on the crime.