the west's suicidal tolerance

[ual777 0]

[Maybe you have not had issues like this hit home for you, I hope you don't have to live through that in your lifetime, because dealing with numskulls like you is one of life's biggest obstacles. This thread and your comments are by far a complete waste of time.... I am reporting this thread.

25 years ago, I spent over 4 months in prison in an Islamic country. My crime was that I was not Muslim.

WTFU! This thread was not meant for you.

Well I am sorry that happened to you, but it doesn't give you a free ticket to spread hate!!!!! Who is this thread for???? You never quite answered that question. Or maybe, just maybe? Someone other than a muslim would take offense to your post!

You just agreed with Shannon that there are good and bad in all people!!! You entire post contradicts that.

He is not spreading hate, he is saying what most of us think.

What the hell, Ill just go ahead and say it....sometimes I get the impression that some members on this forum take huge offense to ANY criticism of the region from which their husbands reside. Love can be blinding I suppose.

Identity is right. Islam has proven itself to be a hostile and violent religion that cannot tolerate others. The conflict is not one of religions, not one of cultures, not one of civilizations, but one of CENTURIES. The 21st vs. that of the middle ages.

Decapitations, honor killings, honor rapes, beating of women, defacing other religions, riots over BS, where does it stop? Soon the world will put their foot down and say enough is ENOUGH!

The ONLY reason that it is tolerated is because they happen to have something that everyone wants. Our governments are selling their souls for oil.

[Identity 0]

I can only begin to imagine the reaction I'd get if I went home and said, "Mom, Dad, I've converted to islam." That would be on a par with, "Mom, Dad, I'm gay!" LOL.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Islam has proven itself to be a hostile and violent religion that cannot tolerate others.

I dare you to 'prove' your assertion above and I'm not even Muslim. That same assertion could be said about Christianity - however, that would also be false.

Come on. I dare you to prove to me the Islamic religion is hostile and violent and doesn't tolerate others.

[Risto 0]

[Maybe you have not had issues like this hit home for you, I hope you don't have to live through that in your lifetime, because dealing with numskulls like you is one of life's biggest obstacles. This thread and your comments are by far a complete waste of time.... I am reporting this thread.

25 years ago, I spent over 4 months in prison in an Islamic country. My crime was that I was not Muslim.

WTFU! This thread was not meant for you.

Well I am sorry that happened to you, but it doesn't give you a free ticket to spread hate!!!!! Who is this thread for???? You never quite answered that question. Or maybe, just maybe? Someone other than a muslim would take offense to your post!

You just agreed with Shannon that there are good and bad in all people!!! You entire post contradicts that.

He is not spreading hate, he is saying what most of us think.

What the hell, Ill just go ahead and say it....sometimes I get the impression that some members on this forum take huge offense to ANY criticism of the region from which their husbands reside. Love can be blinding I suppose.

Identity is right. Islam has proven itself to be a hostile and violent religion that cannot tolerate others. The conflict is not one of religions, not one of cultures, not one of civilizations, but one of CENTURIES. The 21st vs. that of the middle ages.

Decapitations, honor killings, honor rapes, beating of women, defacing other religions, riots over BS, where does it stop? Soon the world will put their foot down and say enough is ENOUGH!

The ONLY reason that it is tolerated is because they happen to have something that everyone wants. Our governments are selling their souls for oil.

well said

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

[Maybe you have not had issues like this hit home for you, I hope you don't have to live through that in your lifetime, because dealing with numskulls like you is one of life's biggest obstacles. This thread and your comments are by far a complete waste of time.... I am reporting this thread.

25 years ago, I spent over 4 months in prison in an Islamic country. My crime was that I was not Muslim.

WTFU! This thread was not meant for you.

Well I am sorry that happened to you, but it doesn't give you a free ticket to spread hate!!!!! Who is this thread for???? You never quite answered that question. Or maybe, just maybe? Someone other than a muslim would take offense to your post!

You just agreed with Shannon that there are good and bad in all people!!! You entire post contradicts that.

He is not spreading hate, he is saying what most of us think.

What the hell, Ill just go ahead and say it....sometimes I get the impression that some members on this forum take huge offense to ANY criticism of the region from which their husbands reside. Love can be blinding I suppose.

Identity is right. Islam has proven itself to be a hostile and violent religion that cannot tolerate others. The conflict is not one of religions, not one of cultures, not one of civilizations, but one of CENTURIES. The 21st vs. that of the middle ages.

Decapitations, honor killings, honor rapes, beating of women, defacing other religions, riots over BS, where does it stop? Soon the world will put their foot down and say enough is ENOUGH!

The ONLY reason that it is tolerated is because they happen to have something that everyone wants. Our governments are selling their souls for oil.

well said

Except its an opinion, not fact.

[Aymerlu 3]

I'm not even going to go there this morning. I spent months in Indonesia with MILLIONS of muslims and I was only showed love. Maybe an ignorant attitude caused your problems in Pak. DUNNO.

[Ban Hammer 15,186]

I can only begin to imagine the reaction I'd get if I went home and said, "Mom, Dad, I've converted to islam." That would be on a par with, "Mom, Dad, I'm gay!" LOL.

really scare them and tell them you are a gay muslim

[mrc 0]

deleted.

Edited July 27, 2006 by mrc

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I think the original post puts a lot of things into perspective. You don't hear of many Extremist Christian groups kidnapping and killing people in the name of Jesus. It just doesn't happen. These people are hateful and hate breeds hate. I'm not of any religious faith, so I can objectively say this.

I think one of the problems is the lack of education. I've seen statistics for some of these muslim states and the illiteracy rate is off the charts. Now, if I'm of the muslim faith and I can't read, can I really, truly interpret my holy book when it's being conveyed to me by someone else that can't read? My beliefs are at the mercy and interpretation of another. Not to mention, all those extremists that raise their children to believe if you aren't muslim, you are evil. This is even taught in schools in some regions.

Agreed - lack of education is a major determining factor for many fundamentalists. If you have no education, literacy (and therefore no job prospects outside the most menial manual labour) you invariably turn to religion - especially if the only prospect of a (free) education is an "islamic school" funded by rather shady characters.

The likes of Osama Bin Laden, for example are a far different breed than the poor deluded chump who thinks that strapping explosives to himself and blowing up a cafe is going to make a difference in the world. As I said before, you don't see the leaders of Al Qaeda martyring themselves in this way - they leave that to gullible and weak-minded individuals.

That said, neither of these sorts of people are broadly representative of the billion or so muslims in the world. That's really what we are talking about here. Noone's saying that we should protect the sensibilities of fundamentalists and terrorists - but is it really that unreasonable to give some benefit of the doubt to the vary many people (who I suspect outnumber the terrorists by a significant degree) who don't fit that pattern?

[incanada1234 0]

I can only begin to imagine the reaction I'd get if I went home and said, "Mom, Dad, I've converted to islam." That would be on a par with, "Mom, Dad, I'm gay!" LOL.

really scare them and tell them you are a gay muslim

I can honestly say I've never met a gay muslim. I highly doubt any of them are brave enough to come out (and I can't blame them).

[mrc 0]

I think the original post puts a lot of things into perspective. You don't hear of many Extremist Christian groups kidnapping and killing people in the name of Jesus. It just doesn't happen. These people are hateful and hate breeds hate. I'm not of any religious faith, so I can objectively say this.

I think one of the problems is the lack of education. I've seen statistics for some of these muslim states and the illiteracy rate is off the charts. Now, if I'm of the muslim faith and I can't read, can I really, truly interpret my holy book when it's being conveyed to me by someone else that can't read? My beliefs are at the mercy and interpretation of another. Not to mention, all those extremists that raise their children to believe if you aren't muslim, you are evil. This is even taught in schools in some regions.

Agreed - lack of education is a major determining factor for many fundamentalists. If you have no education, literacy (and therefore no job prospects outside the most menial manual labour) you invariably turn to religion - especially if the only prospect of a (free) education is an "islamic school" funded by rather shady characters.

The likes of Osama Bin Laden, for example are a far different breed than the poor deluded chump who thinks that strapping explosives to himself and blowing up a cafe is going to make a difference in the world. As I said before, you don't see the leaders of Al Qaeda martyring themselves in this way - they leave that to gullible and weak-minded individuals.

That said, neither of these sorts of people are broadly representative of the billion or so muslims in the world. That's really what we are talking about here. Noone's saying that we should protect the sensibilities of fundamentalists and terrorists - but is it really that unreasonable to give some benefit of the doubt to the vary many people (who I suspect outnumber the terrorists by a significant degree) who don't fit that pattern?

Point taken. Though, it is alarming and it really makes you think how can one religion spark such extremism. There are many underlying factors and if I was a muslim fundamentalist, I would certainly want to make my voice heard a little more. It just appears that the fundamentalists (the ones that don't blow themselves up in the name of Allah for 40 virgins in heaven) are truly scared of the repurcussions and the actions of the extremist faction of their religion. It truly is a shame that people still have the need to act violently towards others just for their differing beliefs in a superior being and place (heaven or hell) that no one has any proof that even exists.

I suppose it's the zealots that really turn me off where religion is concerned.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I can only begin to imagine the reaction I'd get if I went home and said, "Mom, Dad, I've converted to islam." That would be on a par with, "Mom, Dad, I'm gay!" LOL.

really scare them and tell them you are a gay muslim

I can honestly say I've never met a gay muslim. I highly doubt any of them are brave enough to come out (and I can't blame them).

What about gay Catholics?

A lot of those aren't too willing to come out of the closet. Each time there is a gay priest in the catholic church it causes a massive furore. To be honest, I think some people have a tendency to hold others to unreasonably high moral expectations. Noone's perfect - as you know.

Its not specifically about religion but how society views homosexuality in general. That's not to say that religion doesn't inform the social views in certain communities.

I suppose it's the zealots that really turn me off where religion is concerned.

Agreed. And in an increasingly secular world - its the fundamentalists and zealots who define the discourse on many issues, and are increasingly intolerant in their views.

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

Why is this supposed to be refreshing to the VJers?

I dunno... perhaps you're not in the majority?

it's refreshing to the 'honest' people.

[mrc 0]

A lot of those aren't too willing to come out of the closet. Each time there is a gay priest in the catholic church it causes a massive furore. To be honest, I think some people have a tendency to hold others to unreasonably high moral expectations. Noone's perfect - as you know.

Its not specifically about religion but how society views homosexuality in general. That's not to say that religion doesn't inform the social views in certain communities.

I suppose it's the zealots that really turn me off where religion is concerned.

Agreed. And in an increasingly secular world - its the fundamentalists and zealots who define the discourse on many issues, and are increasingly intolerant in their views.

Wow, a religious discussion that doesn't turn into a hate-filled tirade against each other. I suppose it's a lot easier when you are able to look at things objectively when you're not associated with any religion.

[ual777 0]

Islam has proven itself to be a hostile and violent religion that cannot tolerate others.

I dare you to 'prove' your assertion above and I'm not even Muslim. That same assertion could be said about Christianity - however, that would also be false.

Come on. I dare you to prove to me the Islamic religion is hostile and violent and doesn't tolerate others.

Just look at www.thereligionofpeace.com and scroll down to the most recent statistics...... Over 700 people died last month because of Islamic terror attacks.