K-1 or F-1

[conny 0]

I just came back home to Australia after studying for 2 1/2 years on an F1 visa in the US. At the interview for the F1, they specifically ask - "Do you intend to marry a US citizen while you are studying." They also want to see that you plan to return to your home country once you complete you course. Because your intent is to stay there and marry, that is seen as visa fraud, and you can be denied. I have seen it happen to friends at mine from my school in the US. My advice to to wait for the K1, as the benefits of that visa far outweigh the F1.

Remember, F1 students cannot do very much on their visa except study. They cannot work, unless they are offered a job on campus, and even then, only 20 hours a week.

If you wait for the K1, which you say should be approved any day now, once you are in the US, you can have a life, get a social security number, and start working once you get approved. A couple months wait to start school in nothing, and you won't have to stress about doing change of status from F1 to K1, which can take AGES.

One last thing, when you go to an F1 interview, they will be able to see you have a K1 in process, as you need to tell them what visas you have been previously issued or applied for. They will probably know about it when they check your files. They may deny you the F1 based solely on that. It probably will have zero effect on your K1 petition, but after investing so much time and money, why run the risk?

Again, you're not considering all circumstances here and mixing everything together. We're not stupid, we won't get married while he's on F1 - he's going to come back once MY petition is approved and get a new visa and new status. How is that a fraud? Seems to be like perfectly valid scenario. I understand they might not believe it, but when he shows B1 in his passport valid for next few years and multiple trips to US with on-time come-back, what else is not to believe? If intent was to stay in US illegally he could have done that any time with his B1 visa, but no, he's going for F1 because he does want to follow the immigration law while studying here in a major university.

And please could someone explain where is the fraud on my part if he gets F1 or later K1 denied anyways? What would I do wrong in this entire process?

[conny 0]

Conny: As I think you have seen here, the plan you and your fiancee have in place is not only a plan that will almost certainly back-fire in the end, but also a plan that could end up with you being charged for visa fraud and getting either prison time or a large fine.

The fact is: They will not issue an F-1 visa to your fiance if he tells the truth. If he says that he intends to marry you (which is what he wrote down on the K-1 petition, letter of intent ring any bells?) then they will deny the F-1. I'm confused as to how you are misunderstanding this?

If you've already applied for a K-1 (which you can use to study, AFTER your marry your fiance int he US), why would you apply for an F-1 too??

Marina-Del, the truth is that he intends to marry me only if my K1 petition is approved and only AFTER coming back to Ukraine and getting a new immigrant visa (if issued). See the difference? That's not the same as getting to US on F1 and getting married here.

As I already mentioned, he got admitted to a university for Fall 09 semester. Our K1 has been pending in the initial phase for 6+ months, who knows how long it's going to be pending, hence F1 application - he just wants to come here and study, otherwise he'd need to get enrolled for another semester while doing nothing in Ukraine, it's just a horrifying thought...

[Nik+Heather 121]

No, I don't think it's fraud if you do what you propose. Of course, you have to convince the person issuing the visa of that. AND the officer at POE of that. We just don't think that they will believe that you will follow through if you tell the truth, and it's fraud not to tell the truth about your overall intent. If you feel it is worth your time and money to attempt your scheme, fine. We have only pointed out the pit falls so you can avoid them, and assessed your chances of success.

And you still haven't answered about what happens if a home residency requirement is imposed?

Can you tell us what your fiance's university adviser says about Deferred Enrollment? Many universities will wait for up to a year (sometimes TWO) after acceptance to let you enroll in classes. I believe that you are placing an artificial deadline on your K1 visa processing by not pursuing this option.

Every single one of us feels as though our life is on hold while we are waiting for our visa processing. We all understand the desire to be together again, and STILL we are recommending that you wait for the K1 visa.

[conny 0]

I don't think he has consulted on deferred enrollment yet, this would probably be needed if he gets denied F1 now, but still, don't you think that K1 process is not guaranteed? If we waited for 6+ months already while everyone else seems to get NOA2 in 3-4 months, there's probably something wrong - either they've lost it or don't care to process one way or another or simply found something worth extra scrutiny. I just don't see why not try other ways especially when they don't hurt K1 process (which, again, I don't see how F1 denial would).

What else can he do to convince everyone there at consulate and POE of this plan? Any proofs recommended specifically?

Edited July 1, 2009 by conny

[milimelo 4,205]

If he applies for F-1 there won't be any deferred enrollment - the university has to issue a I-20 with which your boyfriend then needs to pay the SEVIS fee and then go to the US embassy and try to get the F-1 visa.

I'd ask about deferred enrollment even before attempting the F-1 visa. Didn't you consult the international student office and the head of the department at the university?

[conny 0]

If he applies for F-1 there won't be any deferred enrollment - the university has to issue a I-20 with which your boyfriend then needs to pay the SEVIS fee and then go to the US embassy and try to get the F-1 visa.

I'd ask about deferred enrollment even before attempting the F-1 visa. Didn't you consult the international student office and the head of the department at the university?

No we didn't because we fully intend to get F1, I'm still not convinced it will be denied with pending K1 and B1 in passport. But then again - if it gets denied then I guess we would have no choice but to consult with university and defer the enrollment.

[SCFsnoopy 0]

If he applies for F-1 there won't be any deferred enrollment - the university has to issue a I-20 with which your boyfriend then needs to pay the SEVIS fee and then go to the US embassy and try to get the F-1 visa.

I'd ask about deferred enrollment even before attempting the F-1 visa. Didn't you consult the international student office and the head of the department at the university?

No we didn't because we fully intend to get F1, I'm still not convinced it will be denied with pending K1 and B1 in passport. But then again - if it gets denied then I guess we would have no choice but to consult with university and defer the enrollment.

I think it would be wise to consult with the school before you try for the F-1, if only for the sake of not putting all your eggs into one basket. If I've learned anything from this whole visa process, it's that nothing is guaranteed >_< Who knows, the international student office there may have even heard of a situation similar to yours and could advise you one way or the other. Also, I've seen in Gary and Alla's posts that once your I-129F gets approved and through NVC, Kiev is an extremely quick consulate with almost no time to wait for an interview.

I agree that in both yours and the OP's case, however, that the smartest thing to do would be to wait for the K-1 to go through. I'd like to study in the US when I get there too, but I'm willing to wait for the sake of my impending marriage (SO > school) rather than risk anything by trying to rush and do it all at once. So what if I have to wait and maybe work for an extra year? Waiting is something this relationship has made me very good at

[NArocks 13]

If he applies for F-1 there won't be any deferred enrollment - the university has to issue a I-20 with which your boyfriend then needs to pay the SEVIS fee and then go to the US embassy and try to get the F-1 visa.

I'd ask about deferred enrollment even before attempting the F-1 visa. Didn't you consult the international student office and the head of the department at the university?

No we didn't because we fully intend to get F1, I'm still not convinced it will be denied with pending K1 and B1 in passport. But then again - if it gets denied then I guess we would have no choice but to consult with university and defer the enrollment.

Well as has been mentioned here dear nothing is a given. You can plan or not plan but the fact is visas are hard to get period whether he has been invited by a university or not. Defer the enrollment you are on the last stages of getting the K-1 why would you want to jeopardize this trying for an F-1? No one knows what the jerk at the consulate behind the window is going to do any given day. Why take that chance? But if you so chose it is your lives. Oh and the B1 Visa he has, he may not even be allowed in with that since there is a petition pending.

[jcg303 1]

thanks to all who responded - i just wanted to clarify a little. we are expecting the NOA2 any day now (according to the timeline trends). since we have the I-20 in hand, we're assuming that it would be a shorter process than the K-1. since it's so hard to tell what goes on down in the depths of the USCIS, we can only make assumptions.

- if we apply for the K-1 and F-1 simultaneously, it could raise some eyebrows as to our actual intention and possibly lead to trouble. some of you don't think that that could happen, but it's up to the CO and POE officer.

- if we cancel the K-1 and go for the F-1 and get denied, we are left with nothing (aka - worst case scenario) - this would suck. plus, we're assuming that the USCIS hangs on to records for a while, and a cancelled K-1 petition would show up in any future visa apps.

- if we forget the F-1, the K-1 will most likely force my fiancee to miss this coming fall semester - not a big deal in the long run, but not our first choice either. deferment is also an option , but i'm sure that all of us would choose to be with our SO's sooner if another option opened up.

- btw, if you are coming to study on an F-1 and have NOT yet filed for the K-1, it's perfectly legal to wait a couple of months (or years) after arriving for school on the F-1, then get married and file for an AOS. after all, many singles come to study in the States and meet their future SO while they are here. my fiancee legitimately wants to study here, but since we already filed for the K-1, we're thinking that our best option is to follow through on what we've started

[NArocks 13]

thanks to all who responded - i just wanted to clarify a little. we are expecting the NOA2 any day now (according to the timeline trends). since we have the I-20 in hand, we're assuming that it would be a shorter process than the K-1. since it's so hard to tell what goes on down in the depths of the USCIS, we can only make assumptions.

- if we apply for the K-1 and F-1 simultaneously, it could raise some eyebrows as to our actual intention and possibly lead to trouble. some of you don't think that that could happen, but it's up to the CO and POE officer.

- if we cancel the K-1 and go for the F-1 and get denied, we are left with nothing (aka - worst case scenario) - this would suck. plus, we're assuming that the USCIS hangs on to records for a while, and a cancelled K-1 petition would show up in any future visa apps.

- if we forget the F-1, the K-1 will most likely force my fiancee to miss this coming fall semester - not a big deal in the long run, but not our first choice either. deferment is also an option , but i'm sure that all of us would choose to be with our SO's sooner if another option opened up.

- btw, if you are coming to study on an F-1 and have NOT yet filed for the K-1, it's perfectly legal to wait a couple of months (or years) after arriving for school on the F-1, then get married and file for an AOS. after all, many singles come to study in the States and meet their future SO while they are here. my fiancee legitimately wants to study here, but since we already filed for the K-1, we're thinking that our best option is to follow through on what we've started

That is a great way of thinking and very sorry your thread got highjacked by other people I am sure all will turn out good for your guys in the end

[Nik+Heather 121]

thanks to all who responded - i just wanted to clarify a little. we are expecting the NOA2 any day now (according to the timeline trends). since we have the I-20 in hand, we're assuming that it would be a shorter process than the K-1. since it's so hard to tell what goes on down in the depths of the USCIS, we can only make assumptions.

- if we apply for the K-1 and F-1 simultaneously, it could raise some eyebrows as to our actual intention and possibly lead to trouble. some of you don't think that that could happen, but it's up to the CO and POE officer.

- if we cancel the K-1 and go for the F-1 and get denied, we are left with nothing (aka - worst case scenario) - this would suck. plus, we're assuming that the USCIS hangs on to records for a while, and a cancelled K-1 petition would show up in any future visa apps.

- if we forget the F-1, the K-1 will most likely force my fiancee to miss this coming fall semester - not a big deal in the long run, but not our first choice either. deferment is also an option , but i'm sure that all of us would choose to be with our SO's sooner if another option opened up.

- btw, if you are coming to study on an F-1 and have NOT yet filed for the K-1, it's perfectly legal to wait a couple of months (or years) after arriving for school on the F-1, then get married and file for an AOS. after all, many singles come to study in the States and meet their future SO while they are here. my fiancee legitimately wants to study here, but since we already filed for the K-1, we're thinking that our best option is to follow through on what we've started

Sounds to me like you have understood most of the main points of all the arguments. Good summary.

I understand your desire to be together as soon as possible, but I don't think that's any argument for not carefully weighing and possibly rejecting "any and all means" to get here just a few months early. We are spending additional months apart for practical reasons as well - don't mistake that for a lack of devotion on our parts.

[Marina-Del 10]

Marina-Del, the truth is that he intends to marry me only if my K1 petition is approved and only AFTER coming back to Ukraine and getting a new immigrant visa (if issued). See the difference? That's not the same as getting to US on F1 and getting married here.

As I already mentioned, he got admitted to a university for Fall 09 semester. Our K1 has been pending in the initial phase for 6+ months, who knows how long it's going to be pending, hence F1 application - he just wants to come here and study, otherwise he'd need to get enrolled for another semester while doing nothing in Ukraine, it's just a horrifying thought...

I understand your point, I truly do, I but don't think you are listening to what any of the other posters are saying and are only choosing to think that the plan you have made up for yourself is the best (maybe it is, maybe it's not). None of us here are professionals but a lot of us have been around a long time (myself since 2006 for example and others a LOT longer) so we've read a lot of posts and seen a lot of stuff happen. We are only giving you our advice, which you can take our not.

And our advice seems to be that, sure, you can try your plan. But the majority doesn't think that it will work. Like Heather/Nick (I never know which one is posting!!) said, we all feel like we're stuck in the bottom of the barrel at some point. There are LOTS of K-1 visas on this site that are waiting for NOA2 at 6+ months now (if you haven't found the thread for that, it's in the K-1 processing times forum). If you've been waiting over 6 months than you're almost there!!! In my opinion, it would be very silly to risk doing the F-1 visa. Personally, I think it will be denied...and even if it's not, why would you want to do that? If you wait probably 2-3 more months than you'd have to wait for the F-1 visa your fiancee could be in the US, MARRIED TO YOU, and study! I'm sure the University would allow him to begin Spring semester, especially if you explain to them why you need to wait. Or, you can TRY for the F-1 (maybe get denied, maybe not, but remember NEVER LIE!) and you'll see your fiance a couple months later, then they'll have to go home in a year or so, then you'll have to apply for the K-1 or CR-1 visa ALL OVER AGAIN! I just really don't understand why someone would want to do that? And the F-1 is not even guaranteed. If you want to go ahead and try, that's up to you.

[conny 0]

Right, let's just call the ones who disagree the thread highjackers and go on with your "be on the safe side" comments. Could anyone suggesting that please comment on the 100,000 question that can potentially negate OP's nice summary altogether? WHAT HARM CAN POSSIBLY DENIAL OF F1 DO TO K1 APPLICATION???

I also think OP is missing one point here based on this last post. We have almost identical situations, so I kinda see it in different light than everyone responding here. Not sure what you meant by "if you are coming to study on an F-1 and have NOT yet filed for the K-1", I presume you meant applying for visa after NOA2 - but you definitely missed the most obvious scenario - apply for F1 BEFORE NOA2 is received, get it if lucky convincing consul of non-immigrant intentions for the period of study (if let's say it's MBA it could as little as 18 months) and if not, just continue to wait for K1 without suffering any consequences.

[conny 0]

Or, you can TRY for the F-1 (maybe get denied, maybe not, but remember NEVER LIE!) and you'll see your fiance a couple months later, then they'll have to go home in a year or so, then you'll have to apply for the K-1 or CR-1 visa ALL OVER AGAIN!

This is where I think we disagree. Why all over again? He would need to come back whenever the Kiev consulate receives a packet and he schedules an interview there, yes, but why all over again? it's a continuation of the same K1 process and I don't see why they would deny us to continue it if he receives F1 (or gets a denial for that matter)...

[Chica Yeyé 41]

One second there --- you hijacked jcg's thread. He asked a question, was given pertinent advise based on law and possibilities (not capricious points of view or beliefs), summarized it a page back or so (quite accurately I must say ) yet you continue to argue.

Now, how on earth would you convince an IO that there is no "no intent to immigrate" when you have a K-1 petition pending???????????