Pregnant at 11

[Veiled Princess 1]

I was in Scotland last week and this was all over the TV news. Its rather frightening really, that this girl's parents seem to be a bit lacsidaisical about it. Kinda like "oh well, she's 11, what are we to do?"

I'll tell ya what tho, I knew a young woman a few years ago who'd had a baby at age 12, and she nearly died during the birth. Her priest came in and gave last rights even. Being Catholic of course abortion was out of the question, but she was mentally and physically much too young to have that child. Thankfully she lived, and so did her son. Her son was adopted by her own parents, but he always knew who his natural birth mother was. AFAIK, she tried later to get custody, but I don't know what happened.

She was 12 and really didn't know what was happening. Her "boyfriend" at the time was a couple of years older (I can't remember exacts). When it was found out she was pregnant, her parents insisted that she birth the child. Scary thought really IMO.

Just because 7 or 8 generations ago it was "normal" for 12 year olds to be married and having babies, doesn't mean that today it should be "normal". Life expectancy back then was incredibly young, and women died all the time during birth. Which is why now children are supposed to be in school until 18 now, to protect them from things like this. Sex education these days leaves a lot to be desired just about anywhere in the world. Its not limited to one country, or one culture or or or...if there are pre-teens getting pregnant then someone's not teaching them properly.

We dont know the whole story here, and may never will. She may have been passed out and unable to push the boy away. It happens all the time (I know, BTDT). She may have been drunk enough she didn't know what was going on. She may have instigated it, we'll just never know.

The point is tho, that parents really need to get across that this just isn't cool, and could potentiall by life threatening. To both "parents". The mother because she could very well die, if she doesn't, she's saddled with this child the rest of her life because she never learned consequences. And to the father because now with a sex offence on his record, he'll have a helluva time doing anything worthwhile with his life now. He'll be labelled forever.

I think its a sad state of affairs, now, and even 20 or 100 or 200 years ago. Just because a girl is menstruating, doesn't make her ready to be a parent.

I know some women at the age of 30 who are not ready to be a parent... age is not the defining factor. One reason why young women today (in this society-- because in other societies it's not seen as anything unthinkable) are not emotionally stable enough to raise the children they are baring is because we don't teach them what they need to know to function in society, which should be apparent if they're out getting drunk and having sex without understanding that that's the way babies are made. If they are not ready to get married and have a family then they should not be doing the adult act of having sex that makes those poor babies.

My 8 year old son understands enough to know that babies are made from sex... sure he doesn't know the specifics but he's 8 not 12. He also knows that such an evil act as having sex with someone other than your spouse is strictly forbidden in our religion and that he will not only have to deal with whatever comes from it in this life but also before God in the hereafter.

I have seen girls like this in schools here and I can say they know, at that age, all about sex. They wear slutty clothes and act in inappropriate ways to get the attention of the boys in school. Then when they get pregnant they tell their parents that they didn't know what was happening and basically play the innocent act. I'm not saying all of them but I'm just saying it's not always the case that they didn't know what they were doing. I also think it's unfair that the boys/young men are always the ones to be blamed when something happens after those girls have been teasing them so hard and trying their best to get with them. It's sick really. Teach your kids not to have sex before they're married. Teach them about the reprocussions that come from it. Teach them that they are the ones who will have to take responsibility from their actions. If you follow any religion that forbids premarital sex (which I think most do), teach them about the spiritual laws that you are supposed to follow and the punishment that comes from disobedience. That's really what it comes down to.... TEACH THEM!!! Unfortunately, however, it's really hard to teach the kids something when the parents do the opposite of what they are teaching. I don't think it's the responsibility of the state to teach the kids about this. That's why they have parents and families.

It wasn't until recently when the first part (them getting married first) went out the window that the world has turned to $#*%.

the women libbers will be howling for your head soon for that........

They can bite me

[Fandango 1,440]

my comments are in red!

I am honestly stunned that you chose this topic to go off on a rant about unwed adult mothers when an 11 year old is pregnant yet you say it's 'natural' that she's pregnant.

That's true... IMO, it's not the fact that these girls are getting pregnant so young, [to me it is...I'm not here to impose morality on grown adults, but a pregnant 11 year old is wrong wrong wrong!!!] it's natural for a woman to start a family after her body is ready for it (her menses begin) if that is what she chooses...[so technically an 11 has the power to choose?] it's the fact that all these girls are getting knocked up and they're NOT married!!! you see this as the real tragedy here? The MEN (I use that word lightly) who are getting these girls pregnant are not taking any responsibilty at all. [men are getting them preggers, but females who have the power to reproduce are girls???] They are not sticking around to help raise the kids or pay any expenses so now these children are growing up without fathers and as a drain on society.[there are many unwed families that include men who DO contribute] They need fathers. There is most likely a pretty good reason why God created us to need TWO people to make a baby and it's probably safe to assume that it wasn't so that one party could get his rocks off and then leave the other saddled with all the responsibilities. And it's become acceptable in our culture to be an unwed mother! [this you see as worse than a pregnant 11 year old???] 50 years ago if a girl "got herself into trouble" it was kept a secret as much as possible. [50 years ago, black people were second class citizens, women were dependant on men 50 years ago a husband could beat his wife and no one would say anything...hundreds of years ago we shat in buckets...does that mean it's better than plumbing cos it came first?] People were ashamed of it but now we're PROUD OF THEM???? [proud of grown women choosing what they want in life? it's not your job to impose your morals on another] Most of these girls do not stop this behavior after the first one either. By the time they're 30 they will have two, three or more children by different men. And those children are learning from their parents example that this type of behavior is OK!

Just noticed I missed highlighting that last comment of mine in your post.

I believe it was the mother of the 11 year old pregnant girl in the story who was "PROUD" of her daughter for getting knocked up! I also believe I started with "IMO" it was just my opinion and I do not have the power to impose my morals on others Yes I believe it is natural to start a family and have children when your body is ready for it. Starting her menses would be nature telling the girl/young woman that it is that time. And yes I do see the fact that they are unwed as being the "real tradgedy here". Societies got along just fine for thousands (millions?) of years with girls marrying and starting families at this age for all this time. It wasn't until recently when the first part (them getting married first) went out the window that the world has turned to $#*%. My religion forbids having pre marital sex and I wholeheartedly believe there is a great reason behind God's logic.

Right, so the Romans having orgies really was a modicum of decency then?

Eh, nevermind. As I said once before (which had JayLen spitting her drink) 30 years ago, I was pooping in a diaper...doesn't mean I do it now...also doesn't mean it's better than the method I use now

Opinions, eh? We're going to have to agree to seriously disagree

Actually, I do have one more question!

If you had a daughter who was 11 who had her menses and she asked to get married so she could have a child, what would you do?

[Veiled Princess 1]

my comments are in red!

I am honestly stunned that you chose this topic to go off on a rant about unwed adult mothers when an 11 year old is pregnant yet you say it's 'natural' that she's pregnant.

That's true... IMO, it's not the fact that these girls are getting pregnant so young, [to me it is...I'm not here to impose morality on grown adults, but a pregnant 11 year old is wrong wrong wrong!!!] it's natural for a woman to start a family after her body is ready for it (her menses begin) if that is what she chooses...[so technically an 11 has the power to choose?] it's the fact that all these girls are getting knocked up and they're NOT married!!! you see this as the real tragedy here? The MEN (I use that word lightly) who are getting these girls pregnant are not taking any responsibilty at all. [men are getting them preggers, but females who have the power to reproduce are girls???] They are not sticking around to help raise the kids or pay any expenses so now these children are growing up without fathers and as a drain on society.[there are many unwed families that include men who DO contribute] They need fathers. There is most likely a pretty good reason why God created us to need TWO people to make a baby and it's probably safe to assume that it wasn't so that one party could get his rocks off and then leave the other saddled with all the responsibilities. And it's become acceptable in our culture to be an unwed mother! [this you see as worse than a pregnant 11 year old???] 50 years ago if a girl "got herself into trouble" it was kept a secret as much as possible. [50 years ago, black people were second class citizens, women were dependant on men 50 years ago a husband could beat his wife and no one would say anything...hundreds of years ago we shat in buckets...does that mean it's better than plumbing cos it came first?] People were ashamed of it but now we're PROUD OF THEM???? [proud of grown women choosing what they want in life? it's not your job to impose your morals on another] Most of these girls do not stop this behavior after the first one either. By the time they're 30 they will have two, three or more children by different men. And those children are learning from their parents example that this type of behavior is OK!

Just noticed I missed highlighting that last comment of mine in your post.

I believe it was the mother of the 11 year old pregnant girl in the story who was "PROUD" of her daughter for getting knocked up! I also believe I started with "IMO" it was just my opinion and I do not have the power to impose my morals on others Yes I believe it is natural to start a family and have children when your body is ready for it. Starting her menses would be nature telling the girl/young woman that it is that time. And yes I do see the fact that they are unwed as being the "real tradgedy here". Societies got along just fine for thousands (millions?) of years with girls marrying and starting families at this age for all this time. It wasn't until recently when the first part (them getting married first) went out the window that the world has turned to $#*%. My religion forbids having pre marital sex and I wholeheartedly believe there is a great reason behind God's logic.

Right, so the Romans having orgies really was a modicum of decency then?

Eh, nevermind. As I said once before (which had JayLen spitting her drink) 30 years ago, I was pooping in a diaper...doesn't mean I do it now...also doesn't mean it's better than the method I use now

Opinions, eh? We're going to have to agree to seriously disagree

Actually, I do have one more question!

If you had a daughter who was 11 who had her menses and she asked to get married so she could have a child, what would you do?

Well, my daughter is only 5 at the moment so it's kind of hard to answer how I would react about something in the future. I think IF, at the age of eleven, she was mature and was seriously wanting to get married and have a mature, responsible marriage and begin a family, I would have to seriously consider her request. It would be something that would require me and my husband sitting down and discussing this with her as well as with her proposed husband and his family. Of course, one of the conditions to me agreeing to any of my daughters marrying any man at any age would be that he is capable of taking care of and maintaning her. Since this is not something that a young man of the same age would be able to do then it wouldn't happen There would also be the condition that she continues her education until such time as she obtains, at minimum, a bach degree. Personally, I would be happy that my daughter has the moral foundation to actually prefer marriage at the age of eleven to having premarital sex like most of the young people that age or not much older. It really depends on what my options are. If my only two options are to let her marry and start her family or to not allow it and her go behind my back and have sex with her boyfriend and probably end up pregnant, then I'd much rather she gets married. I'm not saying we should marry all our daughters off at the age of eleven ok? I'm just saying it would be better for them to be married at least. At least if they were married it would not be a sin and the father of the child would be there to support her and the child. I'm sorry, I don't look at things the same way as you I guess. I don't really care what the culture mandates is the norm or what the modern way of doing things is. Everything in my life is prescribed by my religion. It is my total way of life and I try my best to impliment it into every aspect of my life every day. I know of nothing prohibiting the marriage of a young woman after she reaches the age of puberty according to my religion. On the other hand, premarital sex AT ANY AGE is considered a major sin in my religion. So I have to think of that and not what I think is the way things should be done today. Also, as far as I know, God has not sent any revelation or any new set of laws after the book I go by, so why would I not trust God over what some men say is the right way to do things? I also don't see that things are working so well in this age so why would I force that on my children? I say if it aint broke don't fix it. It's worked well for all these years. You keep talking about how things have changed so much in the past ever how many years but what you're not realizing is that I, for one, don't think things have changed for the better. I look around at the world today, especially here in the US, and am sick to my stomach at the way things have turned out, at the lack of morals in most people today, at the lack of teaching morals to our children, and at the evils that have become acceptable in this age.

I have a question for you.... first of all, do you ascribe to any religion? if so, what is your religious stance on premarital sex? and finally, which would you prefer for your 11 year old daughter to get married at that age and have a husband to help and support her in raising their child so that she can continue her education and not be breaking spiritual laws OR for her to go behind your back, have premarital sex in the back of a car or in a hotel room someplace, end up pregnant by accident and then get stuck raising the baby by herself when the deadbeat sperm donor leaves because all he wanted was a little bit of young @$$? OK that was more than one question but you get my point.

And what in the world does Romans having orgies have to do with anything I have said?

Edited May 21, 2006 by veiledprincesslayla

[maria_b84 0]

OH MY GOD

maria

[Ban Hammer 14,569]

it's official now

[Veiled Princess 1]

it's official now

[Ban Hammer 14,569]

this one better?

[Veiled Princess 1]

this one better?

I still don't get it

[Ban Hammer 14,569]

it's a train wreck

[Veiled Princess 1]

it's a train wreck

This topic?

[tmma 467]

my comments are in red!

I am honestly stunned that you chose this topic to go off on a rant about unwed adult mothers when an 11 year old is pregnant yet you say it's 'natural' that she's pregnant.

That's true... IMO, it's not the fact that these girls are getting pregnant so young, [to me it is...I'm not here to impose morality on grown adults, but a pregnant 11 year old is wrong wrong wrong!!!] it's natural for a woman to start a family after her body is ready for it (her menses begin) if that is what she chooses...[so technically an 11 has the power to choose?] it's the fact that all these girls are getting knocked up and they're NOT married!!! you see this as the real tragedy here? The MEN (I use that word lightly) who are getting these girls pregnant are not taking any responsibilty at all. [men are getting them preggers, but females who have the power to reproduce are girls???] They are not sticking around to help raise the kids or pay any expenses so now these children are growing up without fathers and as a drain on society.[there are many unwed families that include men who DO contribute] They need fathers. There is most likely a pretty good reason why God created us to need TWO people to make a baby and it's probably safe to assume that it wasn't so that one party could get his rocks off and then leave the other saddled with all the responsibilities. And it's become acceptable in our culture to be an unwed mother! [this you see as worse than a pregnant 11 year old???] 50 years ago if a girl "got herself into trouble" it was kept a secret as much as possible. [50 years ago, black people were second class citizens, women were dependant on men 50 years ago a husband could beat his wife and no one would say anything...hundreds of years ago we shat in buckets...does that mean it's better than plumbing cos it came first?] People were ashamed of it but now we're PROUD OF THEM???? [proud of grown women choosing what they want in life? it's not your job to impose your morals on another] Most of these girls do not stop this behavior after the first one either. By the time they're 30 they will have two, three or more children by different men. And those children are learning from their parents example that this type of behavior is OK!

Just noticed I missed highlighting that last comment of mine in your post.

I believe it was the mother of the 11 year old pregnant girl in the story who was "PROUD" of her daughter for getting knocked up! I also believe I started with "IMO" it was just my opinion and I do not have the power to impose my morals on others Yes I believe it is natural to start a family and have children when your body is ready for it. Starting her menses would be nature telling the girl/young woman that it is that time. And yes I do see the fact that they are unwed as being the "real tradgedy here". Societies got along just fine for thousands (millions?) of years with girls marrying and starting families at this age for all this time. It wasn't until recently when the first part (them getting married first) went out the window that the world has turned to $#*%. My religion forbids having pre marital sex and I wholeheartedly believe there is a great reason behind God's logic.

Right, so the Romans having orgies really was a modicum of decency then?

Eh, nevermind. As I said once before (which had JayLen spitting her drink) 30 years ago, I was pooping in a diaper...doesn't mean I do it now...also doesn't mean it's better than the method I use now

Opinions, eh? We're going to have to agree to seriously disagree

Actually, I do have one more question!

If you had a daughter who was 11 who had her menses and she asked to get married so she could have a child, what would you do?

Well, my daughter is only 5 at the moment so it's kind of hard to answer how I would react about something in the future. I think IF, at the age of eleven, she was mature and was seriously wanting to get married and have a mature, responsible marriage and begin a family, I would have to seriously consider her request. It would be something that would require me and my husband sitting down and discussing this with her as well as with her proposed husband and his family. Of course, one of the conditions to me agreeing to any of my daughters marrying any man at any age would be that he is capable of taking care of and maintaning her. Since this is not something that a young man of the same age would be able to do then it wouldn't happen There would also be the condition that she continues her education until such time as she obtains, at minimum, a bach degree. Personally, I would be happy that my daughter has the moral foundation to actually prefer marriage at the age of eleven to having premarital sex like most of the young people that age or not much older. It really depends on what my options are. If my only two options are to let her marry and start her family or to not allow it and her go behind my back and have sex with her boyfriend and probably end up pregnant, then I'd much rather she gets married. I'm not saying we should marry all our daughters off at the age of eleven ok? I'm just saying it would be better for them to be married at least. At least if they were married it would not be a sin and the father of the child would be there to support her and the child. I'm sorry, I don't look at things the same way as you I guess. I don't really care what the culture mandates is the norm or what the modern way of doing things is. Everything in my life is prescribed by my religion. It is my total way of life and I try my best to impliment it into every aspect of my life every day. I know of nothing prohibiting the marriage of a young woman after she reaches the age of puberty according to my religion. On the other hand, premarital sex AT ANY AGE is considered a major sin in my religion. So I have to think of that and not what I think is the way things should be done today. Also, as far as I know, God has not sent any revelation or any new set of laws after the book I go by, so why would I not trust God over what some men say is the right way to do things? I also don't see that things are working so well in this age so why would I force that on my children? I say if it aint broke don't fix it. It's worked well for all these years. You keep talking about how things have changed so much in the past ever how many years but what you're not realizing is that I, for one, don't think things have changed for the better. I look around at the world today, especially here in the US, and am sick to my stomach at the way things have turned out, at the lack of morals in most people today, at the lack of teaching morals to our children, and at the evils that have become acceptable in this age.

I have a question for you.... first of all, do you ascribe to any religion? if so, what is your religious stance on premarital sex? and finally, which would you prefer for your 11 year old daughter to get married at that age and have a husband to help and support her in raising their child so that she can continue her education and not be breaking spiritual laws OR for her to go behind your back, have premarital sex in the back of a car or in a hotel room someplace, end up pregnant by accident and then get stuck raising the baby by herself when the deadbeat sperm donor leaves because all he wanted was a little bit of young @$$? OK that was more than one question but you get my point.

And what in the world does Romans having orgies have to do with anything I have said?

Veiledprincesslayla-with all due respect-

-Are you serious?

If some guy wanted to marry my 11 year old ( even if he was capeable of supporting her financially, which would make him an adult-therefore LEGALLY some sort of pedophile...) I would be calling the cops!

Just my thought.

Edited May 22, 2006 by tmma

[Fandango 1,440]

[Sharon 1]

Veiledprincesslayla-with all due respect-

-Are you serious?

If some guy wanted to marry my 11 year old ( even if he was capeable of supporting her financially, which would make him an adult-therefore LEGALLY some sort of pedophile...) I would be calling the cops!

Just my thought.

FUCKIN' A!! I'm right there with ya!

(and I HAVE a daughter who is 10 and a half at the moment so I know from where I speak!)

Edited May 22, 2006 by Sharon

[Ban Hammer 14,569]

[Fuzzness 2]

Jay, popcorn please. I'm expecting poo to hit an industrial sized fan any second now.