How is having a baby when you're older?

[rika60607 215]

...and you are about to lose a son. A good one.

He came up with 11 pm estimate because he knew you would not let him go if he gave you a realistic estimate of the time when he would come home. He is not a small child nor an aging man who can not handle the day at school/work after a sleepless night, so that's no excuse. He is not stealing alcohol like you did. Yes, pot comes with territory and you were right to stop it, but let me tell you... as soon as he moves out of your house he'll do it again. Not because of music and people he hangs out with, but because it is easy to get these days, all cool people do it and just as soon as he does not have to follow your rules, he won't. Why? Because enforcing rules does nothing for a kid that old. Grounding a 15 yo is not effective and will lead to anguish, nothing more.

Late night practice comes with a territory when you play rock with older guys. You should have known it and you should have been realistic, you are the adult after all. Yet you still have to learn to treat your son as an adult, or you will not see adult behavior from him in a looong time. For now, you are teaching him that you can't be trusted (truth gets one grounded and desired things get forbidden) or respected (your behavior is not logical and/or consistent).

I specifically did not give him a time he had to be home. I simply asked him what time he would be home. The next day happened to be the first day of school.

If he would have said I plan to get home at 3 then I would have most likely said you can't go.

Really as a 15 year old he had no business going to the party in the first place. but he has been blessed/cursed with exceptional musical talent which I have

been very supportive of. This was a chance for him to play and get experience. If he was just going to a party the answer would have been no.

When I was his age I was busy stealing the vodka out of my dad's bottles and replacing it with water. And he drank enough that he didn't notice.

Drugs and sex go with rock and roll like white on rice. I already busted him for pot with a drug test about a year ago. I told him if tested positve again, he'd

loose his guitar and be grounded for two months. That hasn't happened again.

My letting him go to this party was me trusting him. Him lying to me is telling me the trust is not well founded.

In retrospect it was a mistake on my part to let him go. I don't know if he was trying to get them to give him a ride home and they refused or if he just went with the flow.

but it boils down to they have lost their lead guitar player.

[rika60607 215]

Good luck! Make sure she's the one for you before you make a baby -

In other words, I need to step up and do what needs to be done to keep her happy and the baby well cared for.

Wilfred

[rlogan 2,036]

Wow. Thanks everyone for all or your advice and experiences. So much to think about but she wants a baby and I want to one too cause some have told me it's a joy to have a baby. And I want to bless her as she has blessed me so much and she has turned over her whole life that she has in China to come to be with me. She makes me so happy and I am so lucky to have her with me. I know we all feel like that with our spouses. My thinking is that I need to find out about hiring a house cleaner to clean the house, perhaps do the laundry, perhaps cook and do all the things that needs to be done around the house. My job will be to make enough money to pay for all of this, which I think can happen, and also help her with our baby so that she can rest and do other things that she wants and or needs to do. In other words, I need to step up and do what needs to be done to keep her happy and the baby well cared for.

Wilfred

Yay! If she wants a baby, case closed.

I'm not sure how the housekeeper comes into play here. But you'll want a young one that's in really good shape and dresses professionally, like in one of those French Maid outfits.

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

I'm going to say some different things.

I don't think anybody in this thread (except Dan and Judy) is thinking about this child beyond his cradle days. All I see is people talking about whether the Baby will affect Mom or Dad's life.

Well guess what. It will. And guess what also? When you bring a child into the world, you bring a person into the world. Not just a tiny infant or a cute two year old. A kid needs parents. Both if possible.

While a child can help keep you young, they also have needs that an elderly parent will have trouble fulfilling.

Odds are probably about 75% that you won't see this child graduate from high school. Let alone university. That's reality and it's something you need to think about. Having a child at your age should be about a hell of a lot more than keeping the young wife happy.

My husband lost his parents when he was a young man, so I've seen the hurt. And oddly enough, when I was in high school I dated a boy with an elderly Father. There was a point where the guy really had no Dad for many years. We all go through that, but usually when we are more mature.

Sorry if this sounds cruel, but it's your potential reality. And your childs.

Edited August 28, 2011 by Rebecca Jo

[K and L 27]

And yet, having a child when you're thirty is also no guarantee that you'll live to see them graduate from high school either. Death is part of life. So is moving on. Both are important lessons for children to learn.

[rlogan 2,036]

I don't think anybody in this thread (except Dan and Judy) is thinking about this child beyond his cradle days. All I see is people talking about whether the Baby will affect Mom or Dad's life.

Well guess what. It will. And guess what also? When you bring a child into the world, you bring a person into the world. Not just a tiny infant or a cute two year old.

A more patronizing post would be hard to find. Children need parents that are not so full of themselves that they have fantasies about grown adults being little babies in comparison to themselves.

You are also dead wrong on this:

Odds are probably about 75% that you won't see this child graduate from high school.

According to actuarial tables, a 63 year old male has an average life expectancy of 19 years. It matters a great deal what kind of diet, exercise, alcohol, smoking, etc. that you are doing so a person taking care of themselves has a life expectancy significantly longer whereas an alcoholic chain smoker is going to die in short order.

Do you teach your children to just make things up to support your prejudices? For example, if you don't like blacks then just make up a statistic about 75% of blacks being criminals. No sense in actually knowing what you are talking about, is there?

[TBoneTX 43,058]

A more patronizing post would be hard to find. Children need parents that are not so full of themselves that they have fantasies about grown adults being little babies in comparison to themselves.

You are also dead wrong on this:

According to actuarial tables, a 63 year old male has an average life expectancy of 19 years. It matters a great deal what kind of diet, exercise, alcohol, smoking, etc. that you are doing so a person taking care of themselves has a life expectancy significantly longer whereas an alcoholic chain smoker is going to die in short order.

Do you teach your children to just make things up to support your prejudices? For example, if you don't like blacks then just make up a statistic about 75% of blacks being criminals. No sense in actually knowing what you are talking about, is there?

A +10 for this. A 30-year-old father, healthy as a horse, could be hit by a truck tomorrow. The crucial thing is to have loads of life insurance.

[Apple & Wil 0]

TBoneTX: I have financial plans that I plan to have in place in 2 years that will enable her to not need to work if I am gone. I agree with you about being financially stable and set.

Rebecca Jo: I know that I probably will not be around to see our child graduate high school or get married or throw football with him but if anyone would ask our child later if he/she would rather not be born because he/she did not have a father around when he/she was growing up, I would definitely think that he/she would still want to be on this earth, even without a father around. Also, I think my fiancee will be a very good mom from what I see of her and her 7 year old child and that's one of my positives in deciding with having a child with her. Of course my thinking of her might change since we are not married yet. :-) No, I'm only joking.

rlogan: I am thinking that I will want to hire a person to come a few days a week or more to clean house, do laundry, perhaps cook and perhaps do a little of babysitting when necessary to my fiancee will not need to do those things and she can take care of our child during the day so she won't be as tired as she would be if she didn't have that help.

Thanks for all of your wise advice and comments. I really appreciate them. I will show them to my fiance too.

Wilfred

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

A more patronizing post would be hard to find. Children need parents that are not so full of themselves that they have fantasies about grown adults being little babies in comparison to themselves.

You are also dead wrong on this:

According to actuarial tables, a 63 year old male has an average life expectancy of 19 years. It matters a great deal what kind of diet, exercise, alcohol, smoking, etc. that you are doing so a person taking care of themselves has a life expectancy significantly longer whereas an alcoholic chain smoker is going to die in short order.

Do you teach your children to just make things up to support your prejudices? For example, if you don't like blacks then just make up a statistic about 75% of blacks being criminals. No sense in actually knowing what you are talking about, is there?

I don't think I compared grown adults to babies. In case I was unclear, a baby grows up to be a person. So they shouldn't be had just because people want another one, or because they are cute, or anything on that parallel. They should be brought into the world with eyes wide open about raising a healthy, happy, responsible, fulfilled member of society.

Male life expectancy in the US is 75.6 years. It's true those odds can be beaten.

A +10 for this. A 30-year-old father, healthy as a horse, could be hit by a truck tomorrow. The crucial thing is to have loads of life insurance.

Money doesn't make up for Daddy.

And yet, having a child when you're thirty is also no guarantee that you'll live to see them graduate from high school either. Death is part of life. So is moving on. Both are important lessons for children to learn.

This is what puppies and kittens are for.

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

Rebecca Jo: I know that I probably will not be around to see our child graduate high school or get married or throw football with him but if anyone would ask our child later if he/she would rather not be born because he/she did not have a father around when he/she was growing up, I would definitely think that he/she would still want to be on this earth, even without a father around. Also, I think my fiancee will be a very good mom from what I see of her and her 7 year old child and that's one of my positives in deciding with having a child with her. Of course my thinking of her might change since we are not married yet. :-) No, I'm only joking.

Wilfred

What matters most is that you are a loving Father and raise a loving son. My husband can barely think of his Father without his eyes tearing up. As long as you are responsible for putting a loving and caring human being on this earth, even if your time here with him is shorter than some, then you will have succeeded.

[DeeDee&Sam 68]

doesnt matter how old you are. if you and your partener are ready then go for it!!! anything bad can happen today or tomorrow, but you dont have to live with that thought. enjoy every moment an do whatever makes you happy without thiking at the future. good luck!!

[rlogan 2,036]

I don't think I compared grown adults to babies. In case I was unclear, a baby grows up to be a person.

You have no idea how condescending you are being. Really? Babies grow up? *gasp*. And here every other person posting thinks babies remain babies forever. This is simply delusional on your part to think grown adults need to have it pointed out that babies grow up.

So they shouldn't be had just because people want another one, or because they are cute, or anything on that parallel. They should be brought into the world with eyes wide open about raising a healthy, happy, responsible, fulfilled member of society.

Dripping with condescension. You should look at yourself in the mirror.

Male life expectancy in the US is 75.6 years. It's true those odds can be beaten.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about here, and it's the same thing - just assuming everyone else is stupid when the person who lacks knowledge is YOU. I went through all of the statistics classes in actuarial science at the University of Iowa. But ignorance is bulletproof on the internet so even when you are told by someone practicing professionally in the field, you just go right on pretending you know more than they do. Because her highness is the only one who knows anything of the world in her own mind.

Life expectancy from BIRTH is not even remotely the same thing as life expectancy given that you are 63. There are ACTUARIAL TABLES that are built from all of the data on deaths in the USA. I use these in professional consulting to calculate damages in court cases for wrongful death or whatever the lawsuit is over. I have to know how long people are expected to live given that they are already twenty or fifty or a hundred years old.

If you were just born, your life expectancy is 75 years as a male. If you are already 75 years old, your life expectancy is 11 more years. If you are 119 years old, your life expectancy is under a year. This is not beating the odds. This IS the odds. I already told you about actuarial tables, but with the invincibility of ignorance and the self-image of being so wise and everyone else so stupid you just keep insisting the same completely wrong things.

Better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

Apple & Wil already pointed out the utter hypocrisy of your position: you are pretending to speak for people that have older parents. You are insinuating they would rather not have lived. The arrogance too of dictating to others who can or cannot have children - hard to believe someone can be so full of themselves. But then again, it is the same person who even after being told of actuarial tables goes right on spouting off ignorant piffle.

[rlogan 2,036]

doesnt matter how old you are. if you and your partener are ready then go for it!!! anything bad can happen today or tomorrow, but you dont have to live with that thought. enjoy every moment an do whatever makes you happy without thiking at the future. good luck!!

Tha arrogance of youth thinking they know more than their elders. When you've grown up you will understand a lot better how the elders you are insulting have far more maturity than you do.

The OP came here asking for input precisely because he was thinking not for the moment, but for the long run. Despite that demonstration, yes - we'll have people, especially the young and immature, that are too wrapped up in their self-image as wiser than their elders that they will make comments like these.

One major difference between your elder in the OP and you is that he's capable of listening to other people with experience whereas his junior thinks he already knows everything.

[Apple & Wil 0]

What matters most is that you are a loving Father and raise a loving son. My husband can barely think of his Father without his eyes tearing up. As long as you are responsible for putting a loving and caring human being on this earth, even if your time here with him is shorter than some, then you will have succeeded.

Hi Rebecca Jo,

Yes, if we do have a child I will do my very best, of course, to be a good father and good example of a good person for my child to follow. I agree money is not a substitute for a daddy but if we do have a child, everyone tells me make sure you can afford your baby cause it tremendously. I have a friend who is retired from the Army with a colonel rank (just below a General, I bleieve) and is I think 65, so financially , no problem, in good physical shape and so he stays home and helps his wife take care of their one year old and she is pregnant with another. He says it's not a problem since he's home helping her so there's two people taking care of the family. His wife is Chinese , 36 years old. I am financially able to afford a baby so in that department I am good. So that is a good thing.

I agree with your comment, "They should be brought into the world with eyes wide open about raising a healthy, happy, responsible, fulfilled member of society.". That is why I want to draw from a lot of people's experiences to learn and decide from so we are prepared , mostly me. I want she and I to hear what everyone is saying in case she and I have not thought of what kind of problems others have already experienced . No sense "reinventing the wheel."

Thanks to you all.

Wilfred

[Rebecca Jo 1,962]

You have no idea how condescending you are being. Really? Babies grow up? *gasp*. And here every other person posting thinks babies remain babies forever. This is simply delusional on your part to think grown adults need to have it pointed out that babies grow up.

Dripping with condescension. You should look at yourself in the mirror.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about here, and it's the same thing - just assuming everyone else is stupid when the person who lacks knowledge is YOU. I went through all of the statistics classes in actuarial science at the University of Iowa. But ignorance is bulletproof on the internet so even when you are told by someone practicing professionally in the field, you just go right on pretending you know more than they do. Because her highness is the only one who knows anything of the world in her own mind.

Life expectancy from BIRTH is not even remotely the same thing as life expectancy given that you are 63. There are ACTUARIAL TABLES that are built from all of the data on deaths in the USA. I use these in professional consulting to calculate damages in court cases for wrongful death or whatever the lawsuit is over. I have to know how long people are expected to live given that they are already twenty or fifty or a hundred years old.

If you were just born, your life expectancy is 75 years as a male. If you are already 75 years old, your life expectancy is 11 more years. If you are 119 years old, your life expectancy is under a year. This is not beating the odds. This IS the odds. I already told you about actuarial tables, but with the invincibility of ignorance and the self-image of being so wise and everyone else so stupid you just keep insisting the same completely wrong things.

Better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.

Apple & Wil already pointed out the utter hypocrisy of your position: you are pretending to speak for people that have older parents. You are insinuating they would rather not have lived. The arrogance too of dictating to others who can or cannot have children - hard to believe someone can be so full of themselves. But then again, it is the same person who even after being told of actuarial tables goes right on spouting off ignorant piffle.

All right already. We get the fact that you are pi$$ed off at what I had to say!

*shrugs*

I never insinuated children born to older parents would rather not have lived. I never dictated who can or cannot have children. You may be a mathematical genius, but your reading comprehension skills are poor indeed. Yes, I admit to talking about children growing up to be adults. Maybe you haven't met some of the dingy females I have known who have more babies because they like the way babies smell. Or because you should always have more than one child because what if you only have one and it dies - you need a spare you know. Or the woman nearing the end of her fertility trying to get pregnant in order to preserve her youth - kind of like a guy in mid life crisis who buys a convertible, but with bigger implications. There are lots of these types out there having babies every day, which is why we have truant officers, therapists, and DHHR.

You mentioned you had children in your 50's correct? I don't know if you had any when you were younger. Children that are grown now. If so, have you had acquaintance with their parents and families? If you don't know already, you'll find out soon that lots of kids have crack pot parents. Maybe these parents didn't think it through before they brought these children into the world? Who knows? I know without a doubt that your heart will break for these throw-away kids.

If you've given as much thought to having your children as you have with arguing at me, then you're probably a good Father. And Wilfred will probably make a good Dad too. All I am saying is anyone contemplating parenthood should look with their eyes wide open. If you choose to start a family in your later years, then you are foolish if you don't consider that fact. And I don't mean any of this with condescension. I am speaking from the experience of having raised my own son to adulthood. I saw neglected kids in in his class rooms, and in my home. Kids whose parents did not care where they were, or what time they got home. Kids of parents of all ages. Kids of parents who didn't think it through.

Peace.

Edited August 30, 2011 by Rebecca Jo