Self Defense

[natty bumppo 289]

I guess thats not entirely true, you can hunt with them.

since you mentioned percussion cap ...

there are a number of revolvers; 1851 navy, 1858/ 1860/ 1862 army, walkers, derringer, and other percussion style firearms that can be used for more than hunting. rewind your thinking 100+ years on how these were used, prepped for use, and maintained. it wasn't unheard of to keep loaded, dry, and periodically emptied (loads pulled or shot) to keep the loads fresh and ready for use. note regarding these revolver types ... it is prudent to keep the hammer down on an empty chamber.

Edited January 28, 2011 by natty bumppo

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Said the actress to the archbishop.

lol

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

As for penetration, is it really necessary?

Sometimes. I was visiting a friend some years back, and we were comparing the 9mm NATO and the .45 ACP. After some discussion, he pulled out his pistol and shot at a 6" x 6" fence post 20 feet away, on the other side of the road in front his place. The post shook with the first round, so there was no doubt he hit it. Not to be outdone, I pulled my VP70Z, and fired at the post. Nothing. I fired again. Still nothing. Thinking I missed the post (not that hard to do with the stiff trigger pull on that particular autoloader), we walked across the road to check it out. Sure enough, there was the .45 caliber round stuck in the post, but no obvious sign of the 9mm rounds, until we looked at the back side, where we could see where my two rounds exited, two almost perfect 3/8" holes drilled through the post.

Edited January 28, 2011 by Some Old Guy

[slim 1,514]

i Sig handguns. i have a p229 & a sp2340. IMO-yes penetration is necessary.

Both nice handguns.

Why is penetration necessary?

Sometimes. I was visiting a friend some years back, and we were comparing the 9mm NATO and the .45 ACP. After some discussion, he pulled out his pistol and shot at a 6" x 6" fence post 20 feet away, on the other side of the road in front his place. The post shook with the first round, so there was no doubt he hit it. Not to be outdone, I pulled my VP70Z, and fired at the post. Nothing. I fired again. Still nothing. Thinking I missed the post (not that hard to do with the stiff trigger pull on that particular autoloader), we walked across the road to check it out. Sure enough, there was the .45 caliber round stuck in the post, but no obvious sign of the 9mm rounds, until we looked at the back side, where we could see where my two rounds exited, two almost perfect 3/8" holes drilled through the post.

Exactly why folks say the 9 doesn't have enough stopping power - it just doesn't transfer enough energy. It'll bore through but much of that energy continues right on out the other side.

The 45 may not have went all the way through, but it shook the post, meaning ALL of it's energy was transferred to the target. Translated - all that energy reverberated thorugh the inside of whatever was shot. In humans, that means vital organs and other soft tissues can explode upon impact, even if they're missed by the actual bullet or fragments.

This debate's been going on forever and no doubt, it'll continue. Same as the 7.62 vs. 5.56. Bigger, fatter, slower vs. smaller and quicker. Personally I prefer smaller and quicker for precision rifle work and bigger, slower, for handguns.

[LaL 418]

omg dude! use the spoiler for such images!

[^_^ 5,021]

spoiler tags work on images?

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

You could report your own image as inappropriate.

Edited January 28, 2011 by Some Old Guy

[Krikit 1,163]

Good Lord. Totally inappropriate image removed from thread. I am traumatized.

[Fandango 1,439]

Now I wanna know what that image is and who posted it! Damn work eating into VJ time! *shakes fist*

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

Now I wanna know what that image is and who posted it! Damn work eating into VJ time! *shakes fist*

It was a corpse.

[SMOKE 1,426]

Both nice handguns.

Why is penetration necessary?

ty. maximum effect. every handgun magazine in my house is loaded w/ pdx1's.

omg dude! use the spoiler for such images!

damn it! i hate when i miss stuff!

[Krikit 1,163]

Even more traumatizing..... a mutilated corpse. Not a vision I can unsee..... and my husband is out of town..... and we've not long relocated here so I don't know anyone to keep me company and take my mind off it.

[Ban Hammer 12,884]

Even more traumatizing..... a mutilated corpse. Not a vision I can unsee..... and my husband is out of town..... and we've not long relocated here so I don't know anyone to keep me company and take my mind off it.

i always recommend my friends remington and winchester.

Edited January 29, 2011 by charles!

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

See if this helps:

[The_Dude 1,142]

Even more traumatizing..... a mutilated corpse. Not a vision I can unsee..... and my husband is out of town..... and we've not long relocated here so I don't know anyone to keep me company and take my mind off it.

I heard that the Saw movies are quite soothing in situations like this.