Assets

[Nibake 4]

Well, I got the answer to that question figured out, but I can't find, is it 100% or 125% that is needed?

[Audy_Rob 26]

Well, I got the answer to that question figured out, but I can't find, is it 100% or 125% that is needed?

As a non-immigrant visa (to begin with) the K-1 requires use of the I-134. The I-134 instructions specify absolutely nothing in terms of income level required, how to calculate household size, how to convert asstes to an income (DOS uses 5 to 1 for I-134), etc... So many people, I believe most at VJ refer to the instructions that accompany the I-864.

Anyone can be a joint sponsor as long as they are; a) US Citizen, US National or Legal Permanent Resident; b) Domiciled in the US or otherwise at the discretion of the CO and c) qualify in terms of income or income and assets.

I researched online DOS documents only and there is numerous sources citing the use of assets with the restrictions mentioned (can be liquidated within one year with out harm to the individuals) but not a single mention of throwing out a house for consideration but there is two or three lines on the I-134 and I-864 specifically allocated to documenting home equity.

[Audy_Rob 26]

Well, how about this... If my fiance goes to the interview and we have no co-sponsor, just the I-134 from me and proof of my assets, and the consular doesn't think this is enough, what will he or she do? Will we be denied or will he or she give us more time to find a co-sponsor and then let us have a second interview?

You will likely be issued a 221(g) which is a request for additional documentation. The CO will specifically state that he wants additional proof or evidence of income/assets or tell you to ge a joint sponsor.

You will not be denied outright if everything else seems in order.

I do not disagree with your decision as I believe you have a strong case on your side. I searched the web today and found numerous references to a) 125% required by DOS and b) 5 to 1 ratio of assets to income. I think you should declare your mother as a dependent on the I-134 and document the house with an appraisal that will cost $300 - $400.

Your income can only be calculated based on current performance. Take January through April and multiply by 3, or take March, April and May and multiply by 4 because you said business is slow at the beginning of the year.

Use pay stubs to document your claim. Include prior years taxes, preferably three years.

Good luck.

[pushbrk 12,202]

When it comes to Consular officers evaluating public charge concerns, the absence of "you can't" does not mean "you can". At best it means "it may be considered" and "how it MAY be considered will be determined on a case by case basis". Only actual observation will provide insight into what is likely to work. When using equity in the family home as an asset, it is my experience that Consular officers do not consider the equity as something that can be liquidated to provide support without undue harm to the sponsor or sponsor's family.

Perhaps somebody will take me up on the question asked earlier. I'll pose it differently. If faced with a choice between enduring a lawsuit from the government and liquidating your substantial equity in the family home, would you sell the home and use the cash or tell the government to take their best shot? After all these decades of dealing with public charge concerns and their real life aftermath, I can assure you, the Consular Service knows what the answer to that question turns out to be, far more often than not. That you can't find a confirming reference on the internet will be of little consolation to anybody whose visa is delayed or denied because they couldn't find anything that said they couldn't...

No money, (get a cosponsor or) no honey.

[Nibake 4]

Are there any threads that have specific pointers on how to proceed with a cosponsor? For example, would it be necessary or helpful to provide anything beyond the minimal required documentation? It seems like the CO would want more than a form signed by any old USC who makes enough many to do so. But I don't want to act on a "seems like."

[BirdyGirl85 23]

Not a second interview, just an opportunity to present a qualified cosponsor's affidavit.

First, actually carefully study the I-134 and its instructions. Just what would you state as your current income where asked on the form?

I'm not sure yet, but I asked my boss to write a letter for me, and I copied a page out of the Nolo's "Fiance and Marriage Visas" book with the sample letter from your employer to give to him. I explained the situation to him and he was happy to write a letter for me, and I'm going to see what he writes on the letter for my annual salary. I won't hear back from him in a few days since he has the weekend off, but it's nice to know he was happy to write a letter for me.

Edited May 29, 2010 by BirdyGirl85

[Audy_Rob 26]

I'm not sure yet, but I asked my boss to write a letter for me, and I copied a page out of the Nolo's "Fiance and Marriage Visas" book with the sample letter from your employer to give to him. I explained the situation to him and he was happy to write a letter for me, and I'm going to see what he writes on the letter for my annual salary. I won't hear back from him in a few days since he has the weekend off, but it's nice to know he was happy to write a letter for me.

Hi BirdyGirl. While I do not know if it will be any reassurance at all, I did find a post on the BritishExPats Forum which is also another widely used and read immigration forum. There is a posting from a member that qualified with NO income using the house equity ONLY.

Good luck.

http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=568968

"No.

We met the financial requirement solely on the equity in our house, which is owned in my name only. I had to fill in an I-864a for this to be allowable for my visa application.

To the OP, I wouldn't worry too much about it, just fill in the I-864 and if an I-864a is needed, they will tell you at the interview. You won't need one though, as your property is jointly owned, unlike mine."

[payxibka 10,044]

Moving thread to:

US Embassy and Consulate Discussion

You are almost there and now you have to deal with the embassy. This is the place to post your experiences or questions related to this last step before moving to the US. Topics relating to I-134's, packets sent from consulate and medical & police certificates should be posted here.

[pushbrk 12,202]

Hi BirdyGirl. While I do not know if it will be any reassurance at all, I did find a post on the BritishExPats Forum which is also another widely used and read immigration forum. There is a posting from a member that qualified with NO income using the house equity ONLY.

Good luck.

http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=568968

"No.

We met the financial requirement solely on the equity in our house, which is owned in my name only. I had to fill in an I-864a for this to be allowable for my visa application.

To the OP, I wouldn't worry too much about it, just fill in the I-864 and if an I-864a is needed, they will tell you at the interview. You won't need one though, as your property is jointly owned, unlike mine."

Context is King in these discussion. The thread in the link is a case where the foreign spouse's home equity was used. That's not going to be the family home of the couple after the visa is issued, so liquidating the home is not only reasonable but common. London also tends to allow self-sponsorship frequently.

[Audy_Rob 26]

Context is King in these discussion. ...

It absolutely does not say BritishGuy36 is selling his house. It absolutlely does not say whose house it is. You are assuming... which is more like a deuce than a king. Youy are also assuming self-sponsorship.

[pushbrk 12,202]

It absolutely does not say BritishGuy36 is selling his house. It absolutlely does not say whose house it is. You are assuming... which is more like a deuce than a king. Youy are also assuming self-sponsorship.

I read and concluded carefully. If you have reason to believe my conclusions are incorrect, please state them. My comment about self-sponsorship was a comment, not an assumption. In a spouse case, assets can be considered to be joint but since an I-864a was filed and no other "household member" was mentioned....

See section 28 in the step by step instructions for I-864.

Edited May 29, 2010 by pushbrk

[garmar 0]

The call is definitely made by a Consular officer. In my experience Consular officers use the following guideline from the I-864 instructions even when an I-134 is used.

Assets may supplement income if the consular or immigration officer is convinced that the monetary value of the asset could reasonably be made available to support the sponsored immigrant and converted to cash within one year without undue harm to the sponsor or his or her family members. You may not include an automobile unless you show that you ownat least one working automobile that you have not included.

Also, in my experience, Consular officers do not consider liquidation of the family home to be something done "without undue harm...". Is your experience contradictory?

[garmar 0]

I am very much interested in knowing just how certain it is that a car can be considered an asset for the purpose of I-864 or I-134. I have a valuable car which is paid for and I'd like to use it as an asset. I intend to buy a second car soon to replace my second car recently lost in an accident. Can I be certain that the value of my first car will be considered an asset to offset my small $50 deficit in income for 2010? I would assume that the $250 cash would cover it as I have over $6000 in cash deposits but I am concerned because my 2008 & 2009 income were below the 2011 requirement by 2500 and $3000 respectively and my 2011 income is on track to be over the requirement but of course I have only business checks to prove it. Not tax returns or transcripts as they would prefer.

If I can use the car I'm in good shape but the instructions on the I-134 indicate that cash assets are what they are asking about. The form does require me to tell the value of my deposits and personal property but personal property is certainly not included in the assets needed to qualify. Only Cash. At least that's how it seems but maybe you know something I don't. Your help would be appreciated.

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

I am very much interested in knowing just how certain it is that a car can be considered an asset for the purpose of I-864 or I-134. I have a valuable car which is paid for and I'd like to use it as an asset. I intend to buy a second car soon to replace my second car recently lost in an accident. Can I be certain that the value of my first car will be considered an asset to offset my small $50 deficit in income for 2010? I would assume that the $250 cash would cover it as I have over $6000 in cash deposits but I am concerned because my 2008 & 2009 income were below the 2011 requirement by 2500 and $3000 respectively and my 2011 income is on track to be over the requirement but of course I have only business checks to prove it. Not tax returns or transcripts as they would prefer.

If I can use the car I'm in good shape but the instructions on the I-134 indicate that cash assets are what they are asking about. The form does require me to tell the value of my deposits and personal property but personal property is certainly not included in the assets needed to qualify. Only Cash. At least that's how it seems but maybe you know something I don't. Your help would be appreciated.

There's a line that says "I have other personal property, the reasonable value of which is:". That's where you'd declare your car or any other tangible non-cash assets. You'll also need to provide evidence you own the asset, and evidence of it's current value. Both need to be credible, such as a copy of the title and a professional appraisal or KBB valuation. You can't just write your own statements.

You can't be absolutely certain of anything with the I-134. The consular officer has discretion. The general rule of thumb is that if you're comfortably qualified by the I-864 standards then the consular officer will usually accept your I-134 as being sufficient. This is based on the experience of people who've submitted I-134's, and not on any formal policy with Department of State. In fact, there is no formal policy with the I-134. The Foreign Affairs Manual says only that a consular officer can accept an I-134 with a K1 visa application, but it should be afforded less weight than an I-864 (which they are not permitted to require with a K1 visa application) because it's not legally enforceable.

According to the I-864 rules, your car wouldn't be accepted as an asset unless you can demonstrate you own another car. They won't accept an asset unless it can be sold within 12 months without undue hardship or financial loss. Selling your only car would be an undue hardship. Cash in the bank is usually acceptable, but they may ask for bank statements going back a year or more to verify that it's not a temporary addition to your bank account.

They will usually overlook a shortage in prior years if you can demonstrate that your income qualifies now, and is likely to continue to qualify into the foreseeable future. For example, if you started a new job three years ago, and your income has steadily increased each year, and your income will be sufficient this year, then they may accept your affidavit as sufficient. On the other hand, if your income fluctuates with an average that's below the minimum then they are less likely to accept the affidavit as sufficient.