Iraqi reporter throws shoes at Bush, calls him a dog

[mox 298]

So perhaps it will be the Iraqi people throwing roses at Obama after all. He is withdrawing the troops intelligently, or so we are told.

We'll see. I (obviously) voted for Obama, but I'll be watching him with just as critical an eye. I don't expect (or necessarily want) the Iraqis to throw roses to Obama, I'll be happy if he's just able to get us the hell out of there and maintain some level of stability while doing it.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Oh its quite a symbolic act to be honest. Not that many US Presidents get to remember that one time some dude threw a shoe at him. Future generations will likely remember Bush as having gone to Baghdad at the end of his disastrous administration and getting shoes thrown at him.

This is what's so delicious about the whole thing to me. In Bush's mind, he was there to grace a "liberated" Iraq with his presence one final time, so that history could see him finally project his "peacemaker" image. Instead history will forever remember this visit as the time some Iraqi journalist threw shoes at him. I would say that it sums up this administration perfectly, but for it to be perfect there would have had to be clowns (and I don't mean Dana Perino), a kazoo orchestra, an army of cymbal-banging monkey toys, and these guys to even begin to capture the ridiculousness of the last 8 years.

That sounds about right.

So perhaps it will be the Iraqi people throwing roses at Obama after all. He is withdrawing the troops intelligently, or so we are told.

We'll see. I (obviously) voted for Obama, but I'll be watching him with just as critical an eye. I don't expect (or necessarily want) the Iraqis to throw roses to Obama, I'll be happy if he's just able to get us the hell out of there and maintain some level of stability while doing it.

Yep.

[HAL 9000 96]

So perhaps it will be the Iraqi people throwing roses at Obama after all. He is withdrawing the troops intelligently, or so we are told.

We'll see. I (obviously) voted for Obama, but I'll be watching him with just as critical an eye. I don't expect (or necessarily want) the Iraqis to throw roses to Obama, I'll be happy if he's just able to get us the hell out of there and maintain some level of stability while doing it.

Not that it really matters since its more stupidity... but you can bet that the sore losers will still consider it being a blind follower to still be critical of an Obama administration. Then they b!tch about accountability in government. With some people you just can't please.

All I could really care to see in Iraq is that we get our troops out and we retain some kind of ability to work with the Iraqis as international equals so as to help them if they ever ask for our help.

[mox 298]

Not that it really matters since its more stupidity... but you can bet that the sore losers will still consider it being a blind follower to still be critical of an Obama administration. Then they b!tch about accountability in government. With some people you just can't please.

I welcome that argument. Because my first reply to anyone criticizing how open an Obama administration is, is going to be "where was your concern about accountability during the Bush administration? Why all of a sudden did it become so important to you?

Not that I would dismiss any criticisms outright. I expect the Obama administration to be 100% accountable for their actions. If he falls back on this promise, I'll be right there with all the wing nuts demanding answers. (unlike the wing nuts, however, I'll hopefully be asking more intelligent questions than demanding his **real** birth certificate, etc)

All I could really care to see in Iraq is that we get our troops out and we retain some kind of ability to work with the Iraqis as international equals so as to help them if they ever ask for our help.

Word. Honestly the best we can hope for is that it doesn't completely collapse into tribal warfare. Anything above and beyond that should be considered a success.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Not that it really matters since its more stupidity... but you can bet that the sore losers will still consider it being a blind follower to still be critical of an Obama administration. Then they b!tch about accountability in government. With some people you just can't please.

I welcome that argument. Because my first reply to anyone criticizing how open an Obama administration is, is going to be "where was your concern about accountability during the Bush administration? Why all of a sudden did it become so important to you?

Not that I would dismiss any criticisms outright. I expect the Obama administration to be 100% accountable for their actions. If he falls back on this promise, I'll be right there with all the wing nuts demanding answers. (unlike the wing nuts, however, I'll hopefully be asking more intelligent questions than demanding his **real** birth certificate, etc)

I agree with you there - though I'm more disgusted with Tony Blair than I am with Bush, as Blair insisted on staying in the job while the best of his cabinet resigned around him.

[mox 298]

I agree with you there - though I'm more disgusted with Tony Blair than I am with Bush, as Blair insisted on staying in the job while the best of his cabinet resigned around him.

I'm disgusted with Blair because there were so many opportunities where he could have stepped up and said "enough is enough." But he continued to stay in lock-step with Bush, even after it had become clear that he'd been duped. (and quite frankly, I'm only giving him the benefit of the doubt that he'd been duped, because I honestly don't believe British intelligence were that stupid.) It's really a shame because I think Blair could have made a huge difference in how things turned out. He certainly could have kept Britain and Europe's hands a lot cleaner.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I agree with you there - though I'm more disgusted with Tony Blair than I am with Bush, as Blair insisted on staying in the job while the best of his cabinet resigned around him.

I'm disgusted with Blair because there were so many opportunities where he could have stepped up and said "enough is enough." But he continued to stay in lock-step with Bush, even after it had become clear that he'd been duped. (and quite frankly, I'm only giving him the benefit of the doubt that he'd been duped, because I honestly don't believe British intelligence were that stupid.) It's really a shame because I think Blair could have made a huge difference in how things turned out. He certainly could have kept Britain and Europe's hands a lot cleaner.

Well they weren't stupid - the Downing St. Memo is quite clear on that.

A lot was expected from Blair, certainly given the high idealism with which he went into the job after years of Tory misrule, only for him to end up as corrupt as the rest. My gut reaction is that Obama will turn out much the same, though on the basis of the campaigns - he was miles better than the opposition.

Edited December 15, 2008 by Paul Daniels

[HAL 9000 96]

Not that it really matters since its more stupidity... but you can bet that the sore losers will still consider it being a blind follower to still be critical of an Obama administration. Then they b!tch about accountability in government. With some people you just can't please.

I welcome that argument. Because my first reply to anyone criticizing how open an Obama administration is, is going to be "where was your concern about accountability during the Bush administration? Why all of a sudden did it become so important to you?

Not that I would dismiss any criticisms outright. I expect the Obama administration to be 100% accountable for their actions. If he falls back on this promise, I'll be right there with all the wing nuts demanding answers. (unlike the wing nuts, however, I'll hopefully be asking more intelligent questions than demanding his **real** birth certificate, etc)

All I could really care to see in Iraq is that we get our troops out and we retain some kind of ability to work with the Iraqis as international equals so as to help them if they ever ask for our help.

Word. Honestly the best we can hope for is that it doesn't completely collapse into tribal warfare. Anything above and beyond that should be considered a success.

Ditto on both accounts.

On the irrelevant part it really is more of the same sore-loser-itis. If it came to that... I'm sure we'd be asking based on logical things to base accusations instead of lame whining based on being unequivocally misled as to what is an issue based on reality.

[HAL 9000 96]

I agree with you there - though I'm more disgusted with Tony Blair than I am with Bush, as Blair insisted on staying in the job while the best of his cabinet resigned around him.

I'm disgusted with Blair because there were so many opportunities where he could have stepped up and said "enough is enough." But he continued to stay in lock-step with Bush, even after it had become clear that he'd been duped. (and quite frankly, I'm only giving him the benefit of the doubt that he'd been duped, because I honestly don't believe British intelligence were that stupid.) It's really a shame because I think Blair could have made a huge difference in how things turned out. He certainly could have kept Britain and Europe's hands a lot cleaner.

Well they weren't stupid - the Downing St. Memo is quite clear on that.

A lot was expected from Blair, certainly given the high idealism with which he went into the job after years of Tory misrule, only for him to end up as corrupt as the rest. My gut reaction is that Obama will turn out much the same, though on the basis of the campaigns - he was miles better than the opposition.

Yeah I wouldn't condemn intelligence gathering on either side of the pond on those issues.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I agree with you there - though I'm more disgusted with Tony Blair than I am with Bush, as Blair insisted on staying in the job while the best of his cabinet resigned around him.

I'm disgusted with Blair because there were so many opportunities where he could have stepped up and said "enough is enough." But he continued to stay in lock-step with Bush, even after it had become clear that he'd been duped. (and quite frankly, I'm only giving him the benefit of the doubt that he'd been duped, because I honestly don't believe British intelligence were that stupid.) It's really a shame because I think Blair could have made a huge difference in how things turned out. He certainly could have kept Britain and Europe's hands a lot cleaner.

Well they weren't stupid - the Downing St. Memo is quite clear on that.

A lot was expected from Blair, certainly given the high idealism with which he went into the job after years of Tory misrule, only for him to end up as corrupt as the rest. My gut reaction is that Obama will turn out much the same, though on the basis of the campaigns - he was miles better than the opposition.

Yeah I wouldn't condemn intelligence gathering on either side of the pond on those issues.

I think its pretty clear that Bush et al used the available intelligence as a menu to choose the best justification for a pre-determined war.

[Nagishkaw 510]

I think so, too.

[mox 298]

I think its pretty clear that Bush et al used the available intelligence as a menu to choose the best justification for a pre-determined war.

Exactly. It's really the other side of the "Bush Doctrine" coin.

[Caladan 19]

If Bush is as evil as some people like pretending, he would have had the man "accidentally" shot outside or something. You think someone like Saddam would just have joked and waved off his guards like it was no big deal? Puh-lease.

Of course, if the defense of the man is "This proves he isn't as bad as Saddam Hussein".... what's the phrase? Damning with faint praise?

[Ling Ling 22]

Wonder if there will be new laws here on when you can wear shoes.

You already have to take them off at the airport, maybe now we'll have to check them in, or put them in a 1 gallon plastic bag.

That's our typical response to threats, right?

That said, fear not...I believe we're still only at threat level orange...continue to be afraid as usual.

[merijan 0]

The Iraq War was the single most vile act of criminality committed by the Bush administration.

If he deserves to be hit by a shoe for anything, this was it.

AGREE..