Concerned about stupid people and their MOUTH

[JonasMichaels 0]

OK - I am very confused right now. People keep giving me wrong advice, opinions, and a lot of unnecessary worry! Please don't answer this question if you don't KNOW for SURE.

I know that if the consulate thinks you were MARRIED in the beneficiary's country, that is bad.

I also know that for the VIETNAM consulate specifically, engagemet partys are looked highly upon.

I did have an Engagement Party with Phuong in Vietnam. However, it didn't look like a traditional engagement party, it looked like a wedding. She wore a veil, she did not wear a red traditional dress, and the party was set up like a wedding.

That being said, there are also signs everywhere (including in the pix I sent the USCIS) that say LE DINH HON. Which means Engagement Party in vietnamese, NOT wedding. Our receipt for booking the party hall (also included in my petition) says LE DINH HON. Even included our invitations which say LE DINH HON party. Getting married in VN is not easy, you have to jump through quite a few hoops. It is not like other countries and there would be a record of it.

Do you think this will be a problem for me?

Thanks

Jonas

[wifetobe 2]

OK - I am very confused right now. People keep giving me wrong advice, opinions, and a lot of unnecessary worry! Please don't answer this question if you don't KNOW for SURE.

I know that if the consulate thinks you were MARRIED in the beneficiary's country, that is bad.

I also know that for the VIETNAM consulate specifically, engagemet partys are looked highly upon.

I did have an Engagement Party with Phuong in Vietnam. However, it didn't look like a traditional engagement party, it looked like a wedding. She wore a veil, she did not wear a red traditional dress, and the party was set up like a wedding.

That being said, there are also signs everywhere (including in the pix I sent the USCIS) that say LE DINH HON. Which means Engagement Party in vietnamese, NOT wedding. Our receipt for booking the party hall (also included in my petition) says LE DINH HON. Even included our invitations which say LE DINH HON party. Getting married in VN is not easy, you have to jump through quite a few hoops. It is not like other countries and there would be a record of it.

Do you think this will be a problem for me?

Thanks

Jonas

YES

[pushbrk 12,160]

OK - I am very confused right now. People keep giving me wrong advice, opinions, and a lot of unnecessary worry! Please don't answer this question if you don't KNOW for SURE.

I know that if the consulate thinks you were MARRIED in the beneficiary's country, that is bad.

I also know that for the VIETNAM consulate specifically, engagemet partys are looked highly upon.

I did have an Engagement Party with Phuong in Vietnam. However, it didn't look like a traditional engagement party, it looked like a wedding. She wore a veil, she did not wear a red traditional dress, and the party was set up like a wedding.

That being said, there are also signs everywhere (including in the pix I sent the USCIS) that say LE DINH HON. Which means Engagement Party in vietnamese, NOT wedding. Our receipt for booking the party hall (also included in my petition) says LE DINH HON. Even included our invitations which say LE DINH HON party. Getting married in VN is not easy, you have to jump through quite a few hoops. It is not like other countries and there would be a record of it.

Do you think this will be a problem for me?

Thanks

Jonas

YES

It could be a problem to speak of it or show pictures from it. The safe bet is to use other evidence. If asked about whether such a celebration took place and only if asked, tell the truth.

[bora bora 1]

OK - I am very confused right now. People keep giving me wrong advice, opinions, and a lot of unnecessary worry! Please don't answer this question if you don't KNOW for SURE.

I know that if the consulate thinks you were MARRIED in the beneficiary's country, that is bad.

I also know that for the VIETNAM consulate specifically, engagemet partys are looked highly upon.

I did have an Engagement Party with Phuong in Vietnam. However, it didn't look like a traditional engagement party, it looked like a wedding. She wore a veil, she did not wear a red traditional dress, and the party was set up like a wedding.

That being said, there are also signs everywhere (including in the pix I sent the USCIS) that say LE DINH HON. Which means Engagement Party in vietnamese, NOT wedding. Our receipt for booking the party hall (also included in my petition) says LE DINH HON. Even included our invitations which say LE DINH HON party. Getting married in VN is not easy, you have to jump through quite a few hoops. It is not like other countries and there would be a record of it.

Do you think this will be a problem for me?

Thanks

Jonas

YES

It could be a problem to speak of it or show pictures from it. The safe bet is to use other evidence. If asked about whether such a celebration took place and only if asked, tell the truth.

It's good advice not to offer any information to the CO - only answer what you are asked.

I'd avoid sending the pictures if I were afraid that your party could be misinterpreted (which it could). My now husband and I have been wearing wedding rings for years - even before we got married. However, at the time of the K1 interview he took his off. It's better to CYA.

[CraigCam 0]

I find it ironic that the OP specifically asked for no replies from anyone who isn't sure of their answers and the first reply posted is incorrect. Not only incorrect but from a country with much different cultural practices than Vietnam. The fact is that a one word answer without any explanation doesn't help much anyway. So, why add to the OP's stress with a negative reply if you aren't going to give any explanation?

The correct answer is, NO, this should not be a problem. First of all, the Consulate in HCM is aware of how important the engagement party is to VN people. They will not be confused about the difference between an engagement party and a wedding. In fact, it is expected that there will be an engagement party for the family and friends, especially if the wedding will be in the US.

To take this a step further, I have sent an email to the Consulate asking about this topic. The Consulate states that it is aware that couples wish to celebrate with the family in VN before leaving for the US. The only thing that the Consulate is concerned with is that there is no legal marriage. So, you can actually have a wedding ceremony as long as there is no marriage certificate involved. No marriage certificate=Not married.

Now I have read of couples in other countries having non-legal weddings and being denied visas. This is because in some countries, India for example, a religious ceremony is considered legally binding with or without a marriage license. But, Vietnam is different. Remember, you are dealing with a communist government and religious ceremonies are viewed differently by the government.

I don't have a link to the post handy, but someone on VJ recently(about 4 or 5 months ago) was approved in HCM and they had had a full blown wedding(not engagement party) without a marriage certificate. They sent an email to the Consulate to be sure this was not a problem. The Consulate stated exactly as I have and they took the email to the interview as evidence but it was not necessary, pink slip, first try.

I'm sure that people are just trying to be helpful but have no idea what the visa process is really like in VN. That is why this post should be in the Asian forum where people who are familiar with the specifics of how the HCM Consulate works will be more likely to respond. Sure, you will find stories of couples that have had problems in similar situations, but I seriously doubt any of them will be from the HCM Consulate.

Besides, what is done is done, so, why stress out about it now? You have made it clear that the party was an engagement not a wedding. In my opinion, this is a good thing for you. The engagement party will be excellent evidence to bolster your case of a bona fide relationship. Trust me, you will have plenty of other things to worry about without adding this to the pile.

One last thing, according to the K1 guru, ME, the Consulate cannot deny your petition based on any information already approved by USCIS in your I-129F petition. Since, you included info about the engagement party in your petition and USCIS has approved it, then technically HCM cannot deny you based on that info.

Good luck!

[JonasMichaels 0]

I find it ironic that the OP specifically asked for no replies from anyone who isn't sure of their answers and the first reply posted is incorrect. Not only incorrect but from a country with much different cultural practices than Vietnam. The fact is that a one word answer without any explanation doesn't help much anyway. So, why add to the OP's stress with a negative reply if you aren't going to give any explanation?

The correct answer is, NO, this should not be a problem. First of all, the Consulate in HCM is aware of how important the engagement party is to VN people. They will not be confused about the difference between an engagement party and a wedding. In fact, it is expected that there will be an engagement party for the family and friends, especially if the wedding will be in the US.

To take this a step further, I have sent an email to the Consulate asking about this topic. The Consulate states that it is aware that couples wish to celebrate with the family in VN before leaving for the US. The only thing that the Consulate is concerned with is that there is no legal marriage. So, you can actually have a wedding ceremony as long as there is no marriage certificate involved. No marriage certificate=Not married.

Now I have read of couples in other countries having non-legal weddings and being denied visas. This is because in some countries, India for example, a religious ceremony is considered legally binding with or without a marriage license. But, Vietnam is different. Remember, you are dealing with a communist government and religious ceremonies are viewed differently by the government.

I don't have a link to the post handy, but someone on VJ recently(about 4 or 5 months ago) was approved in HCM and they had had a full blown wedding(not engagement party) without a marriage certificate. They sent an email to the Consulate to be sure this was not a problem. The Consulate stated exactly as I have and they took the email to the interview as evidence but it was not necessary, pink slip, first try.

I'm sure that people are just trying to be helpful but have no idea what the visa process is really like in VN. That is why this post should be in the Asian forum where people who are familiar with the specifics of how the HCM Consulate works will be more likely to respond. Sure, you will find stories of couples that have had problems in similar situations, but I seriously doubt any of them will be from the HCM Consulate.

Besides, what is done is done, so, why stress out about it now? You have made it clear that the party was an engagement not a wedding. In my opinion, this is a good thing for you. The engagement party will be excellent evidence to bolster your case of a bona fide relationship. Trust me, you will have plenty of other things to worry about without adding this to the pile.

One last thing, according to the K1 guru, ME, the Consulate cannot deny your petition based on any information already approved by USCIS in your I-129F petition. Since, you included info about the engagement party in your petition and USCIS has approved it, then technically HCM cannot deny you based on that info.

Good luck!

CraigCam ... GOD BLESS YOU! :-) I knew I should've posted in the Asia forum but didn't want to double post the same thing after I had already posted this. Yes, I know Melrose, he helped me a lot with this process, and he too had an engagement party that was like a full blown wedding and got pink on the first time. After I posted this "stress post" I realized that I was being ridiculous and paranoid as I was my divorce in the states was not even final when I got engaged to Phuong - so I couldn't legally marry her then, regardless. DUH. This whole process has me up in arms. I am sure everyone feels like that. Did you have an engagement party?

Good luck to you on the interview, PLEASE try to post the same day if you can because I, and I am sure other Vietnam members, will be waiting to hear your outcome. Will you be in Vietnam for it?

Jonas

[pushbrk 12,160]

I find it ironic that the OP specifically asked for no replies from anyone who isn't sure of their answers and the first reply posted is incorrect. Not only incorrect but from a country with much different cultural practices than Vietnam. The fact is that a one word answer without any explanation doesn't help much anyway. So, why add to the OP's stress with a negative reply if you aren't going to give any explanation?

The correct answer is, NO, this should not be a problem. First of all, the Consulate in HCM is aware of how important the engagement party is to VN people. They will not be confused about the difference between an engagement party and a wedding. In fact, it is expected that there will be an engagement party for the family and friends, especially if the wedding will be in the US.

To take this a step further, I have sent an email to the Consulate asking about this topic. The Consulate states that it is aware that couples wish to celebrate with the family in VN before leaving for the US. The only thing that the Consulate is concerned with is that there is no legal marriage. So, you can actually have a wedding ceremony as long as there is no marriage certificate involved. No marriage certificate=Not married.

Now I have read of couples in other countries having non-legal weddings and being denied visas. This is because in some countries, India for example, a religious ceremony is considered legally binding with or without a marriage license. But, Vietnam is different. Remember, you are dealing with a communist government and religious ceremonies are viewed differently by the government.

I don't have a link to the post handy, but someone on VJ recently(about 4 or 5 months ago) was approved in HCM and they had had a full blown wedding(not engagement party) without a marriage certificate. They sent an email to the Consulate to be sure this was not a problem. The Consulate stated exactly as I have and they took the email to the interview as evidence but it was not necessary, pink slip, first try.

I'm sure that people are just trying to be helpful but have no idea what the visa process is really like in VN. That is why this post should be in the Asian forum where people who are familiar with the specifics of how the HCM Consulate works will be more likely to respond. Sure, you will find stories of couples that have had problems in similar situations, but I seriously doubt any of them will be from the HCM Consulate.

Besides, what is done is done, so, why stress out about it now? You have made it clear that the party was an engagement not a wedding. In my opinion, this is a good thing for you. The engagement party will be excellent evidence to bolster your case of a bona fide relationship. Trust me, you will have plenty of other things to worry about without adding this to the pile.

One last thing, according to the K1 guru, ME, the Consulate cannot deny your petition based on any information already approved by USCIS in your I-129F petition. Since, you included info about the engagement party in your petition and USCIS has approved it, then technically HCM cannot deny you based on that info.

Good luck!

I'm quite sure of my answer but it doesn't conflict with your. Mention it only if asked.

[Anh map 2,098]

Ditto to what you've heard about HCMC. The dam hoi is a huge thing for all the obvious reasons. And, when the fiance is not having the normal wedding party in VN it does tend to take on the look of a wedding. Relax, you did the right thing as far as proving your relationship. And I would imagine that it was a great time. I know mine was!

[sj5 4]

You should have nothing to worry about then if it was engagement party.

Marriage in Vietnam

DISCLAIMER: THE INFORMATION IN THIS CIRCULAR RELATING TO THE LEGAL REQUIREMENTS OF SPECIFIC FOREIGN COUNTRIES IS PROVIDED FOR GENERAL INFORMATION ONLY AND MAY NOT BE TOTALLY ACCURATE IN A PARTICULAR CASE. QUESTIONS INVOLVING INTERPRETATIONS OF SPECIFIC FOREIGN LAWS SHOULD BE ADDRESSED TO FOREIGN ATTORNEYS OR FOREIGN GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS.

General:

Marriages performed abroad are conducted in accordance with the laws of the foreign country. U.S. Foreign Service officers are not permitted to perform marriages (Title 22, Code of Federal Regulations 52.1). The validity of marriages abroad is not dependent upon the presence of a U.S. diplomatic or consular officer, but upon adherence to the laws of the country where the marriage is performed. Marriages abroad are subject to the residency and documentation requirements of the country in which the marriage is performed. In general, marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the United States. Inquiries regarding the validity of a marriage abroad should be directed to the attorney general of the state in the United States where the parties to the marriage live.

Vietnamese Marriage Requirements:

Any application for marriage between a citizen of a foreign country and a Vietnamese citizen residing in Ho Chi Minh City should be filed in persons at the Principal Registrar's Office (Justice Department, Ho Chi Minh City). If the Vietnamese citizen is residing elsewhere, we suggest that you contact that person to inquire where an application for marriage may be filed. It is our understanding that non-Vietnamese citizens are required to present the following documents.

An application for marriage legally registered (the form is available at the Principal Registrar's Office);

A notarized, authenticated photocopy of your passport;

An authenticated copy of your birth certificate;

A notarized, photocopy of your visa registered at the city policy headquarters in Vietnam (exit/entry control office);

Medical certificates for marriage;

An authenticated statement from the local registrar of marriage documents from your state of residence attesting to the fact that there is no record of a previous marriage in your state of residence for two years.

An authenticated copy of a death certificate or divorce decree terminating any previous marriage.

A certificate of no impediment to marriage.

Certificate of No Impediment to Marriage:

Many countries require persons who wish to marry to provide proof issued by a governmental authority that there is no legal impediment to the marriage. There is no such authority in the United States. The Department of States does not issue any statement or authorization regarding whether a person living in the United States is free to marry abroad. No such document exists in the United States. In the United States, marriage laws are enacted by the governments of the individual states, and there is no federal (national) marriage law or federal record of marriages. The laws of the several states with regard to marriage differ, and the stipulations for, or impediments to marriage vary widely. Marriage licenses in the United States are granted upon written application by the individuals concerned who declare themselves free to marry and are required to present evidence of the termination of any previous marriage. Thus the individuals concerned are held responsible for and accountable for their statements. Since 1888, U.S. regulations have reflected that U.S. consular officers are not competent to certify officially as to the civil status of persons domiciled in the United States and proposing to be married abroad. Moreover, 22 C.F.R. 52.3 provides that although a consular officer may have knowledge respecting the laws of marriage, the consular officer shall not issue any official certificate with respect to such laws.

Affidavit of Eligibility/Freedom to Marry:

Generally, Americans who wish to marry abroad execute a sworn statement regarding their civil status in the form of an "Affidavit of Eligibility/Freedom to Marry" before a consular officer at the U.S. Embassy or Consulate in the Foreign Country. In the absence of a state or national certificate of no impediment to marry, this sworn statement seems to satisfy foreign local requirements.

Completing the Affidavit of Eligibility/Freedom to Marry for Use in Vietnam:

The following information is drawn from experiences provided by persons who have been married in Vietnam. Essentially, a U.S. citizen wishing to marry in Vietnam must execute an affidavit of eligibility to marry. This may be accomplished before a U.S. consular officer in Hanoi or before a notary public in the United States.

1. Sworn Statement before a U.S. consular officer: The U.S. citizen may appear before any consular officer at the U.S. Embassy in Hanoi located at 7 Lang Ha, Ba Dinh District, Hanoi, Vietnam, and execute an Affidavit of Eligibility to Marry. The signature and the notarizing consular officer and the U.S. Embassy seal must then be authenticated by the Consular Department of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs located at 6 Chu Van An Street, Hanoi, open on Tuesdays and Thursdays from 8:00 to 11:30 am.

2. Notarized Statement Executed in the United States: The U.S. citizen may prepare a statement of eligibility to marry and have it notarized before a notary public in the United States. That person would then follow the procedures outlined in "Authentication (or Legalization) of Documents for Use Abroad" in obtaining further certification from his state's Secretary of State, the Authentications Office of the U.S. Department of State (515 23 rd Street, NW SA-1, Washington, DC 20520), and the Vietnamese Embassy (1233 20 th Street, NW - Suite 501, Washington, DC 20036, tel. (202) 861-0737.)

3. Authenticated Statement from Local Registrar in Your State of Residence: As noted in item 6, above, Vietnamese authorities apparently also require that foreigners wishing to marry present a statement issued by the local office responsible for marriage records in their state of residence in the United States. This statement should reflect the absence of any marriage record for that individual for the past two years. The state or local registrar's statement must be authenticated in accordance with the procedures set forth in the enclosed information flyer regarding authentication of documents. This means that the document must be authenticated by the state Secretary of State's office, by the U.S. Department of State's Authentications Office and by the Vietnamese Embassy (addresses provided in item 2). Please note the original registrar's statement will not be accepted by the Vietnamese marriage authorities more than three months old.

SOURCE: http://travel.state.gov/law/citizenship/citizenship_766.html

PAY ATTENTION TO THIS SITE NOT TO ME BECAUSE I DIDN'T MAKE THIS WEBSITE.

[Badgerella 5]

I would not, ever, rely on what a consulate anywhere in the world should, or should not know. Otherwise, having an engagement party really should not be a problem.

[wifetobe 2]

I find it ironic that the OP specifically asked for no replies from anyone who isn't sure of their answers and the first reply posted is incorrect. Not only incorrect but from a country with much different cultural practices than Vietnam. The fact is that a one word answer without any explanation doesn't help much anyway. So, why add to the OP's stress with a negative reply if you aren't going to give any explanation?

The correct answer is, NO, this should not be a problem. First of all, the Consulate in HCM is aware of how important the engagement party is to VN people. They will not be confused about the difference between an engagement party and a wedding. In fact, it is expected that there will be an engagement party for the family and friends, especially if the wedding will be in the US.

To take this a step further, I have sent an email to the Consulate asking about this topic. The Consulate states that it is aware that couples wish to celebrate with the family in VN before leaving for the US. The only thing that the Consulate is concerned with is that there is no legal marriage. So, you can actually have a wedding ceremony as long as there is no marriage certificate involved. No marriage certificate=Not married.

Now I have read of couples in other countries having non-legal weddings and being denied visas. This is because in some countries, India for example, a religious ceremony is considered legally binding with or without a marriage license. But, Vietnam is different. Remember, you are dealing with a communist government and religious ceremonies are viewed differently by the government.

I don't have a link to the post handy, but someone on VJ recently(about 4 or 5 months ago) was approved in HCM and they had had a full blown wedding(not engagement party) without a marriage certificate. They sent an email to the Consulate to be sure this was not a problem. The Consulate stated exactly as I have and they took the email to the interview as evidence but it was not necessary, pink slip, first try.

I'm sure that people are just trying to be helpful but have no idea what the visa process is really like in VN. That is why this post should be in the Asian forum where people who are familiar with the specifics of how the HCM Consulate works will be more likely to respond. Sure, you will find stories of couples that have had problems in similar situations, but I seriously doubt any of them will be from the HCM Consulate.

Besides, what is done is done, so, why stress out about it now? You have made it clear that the party was an engagement not a wedding. In my opinion, this is a good thing for you. The engagement party will be excellent evidence to bolster your case of a bona fide relationship. Trust me, you will have plenty of other things to worry about without adding this to the pile.

One last thing, according to the K1 guru, ME, the Consulate cannot deny your petition based on any information already approved by USCIS in your I-129F petition. Since, you included info about the engagement party in your petition and USCIS has approved it, then technically HCM cannot deny you based on that info.

Good luck!

First of all I was replying to the question itself, definition: ("singularly", "alone"). And, generally, the answer is YES. When you bring everything else in to the equation i.e. Vietnam consulate ETC that's a whole 'nother story so you would be correct in that case. It is infact a BIG problem where ppl DO get DENIED because of the Consul being suspicious by engagement 'wedding looking' pics tied to a 'K1' application. It happens ALOT - read up in other forums first before judging my answer.

[*JG* 2]

I find it ironic that the OP specifically asked for no replies from anyone who isn't sure of their answers and the first reply posted is incorrect. Not only incorrect but from a country with much different cultural practices than Vietnam. The fact is that a one word answer without any explanation doesn't help much anyway. So, why add to the OP's stress with a negative reply if you aren't going to give any explanation?

The correct answer is, NO, this should not be a problem. First of all, the Consulate in HCM is aware of how important the engagement party is to VN people. They will not be confused about the difference between an engagement party and a wedding. In fact, it is expected that there will be an engagement party for the family and friends, especially if the wedding will be in the US.

To take this a step further, I have sent an email to the Consulate asking about this topic. The Consulate states that it is aware that couples wish to celebrate with the family in VN before leaving for the US. The only thing that the Consulate is concerned with is that there is no legal marriage. So, you can actually have a wedding ceremony as long as there is no marriage certificate involved. No marriage certificate=Not married.

Now I have read of couples in other countries having non-legal weddings and being denied visas. This is because in some countries, India for example, a religious ceremony is considered legally binding with or without a marriage license. But, Vietnam is different. Remember, you are dealing with a communist government and religious ceremonies are viewed differently by the government.

I don't have a link to the post handy, but someone on VJ recently(about 4 or 5 months ago) was approved in HCM and they had had a full blown wedding(not engagement party) without a marriage certificate. They sent an email to the Consulate to be sure this was not a problem. The Consulate stated exactly as I have and they took the email to the interview as evidence but it was not necessary, pink slip, first try.

I'm sure that people are just trying to be helpful but have no idea what the visa process is really like in VN. That is why this post should be in the Asian forum where people who are familiar with the specifics of how the HCM Consulate works will be more likely to respond. Sure, you will find stories of couples that have had problems in similar situations, but I seriously doubt any of them will be from the HCM Consulate.

Besides, what is done is done, so, why stress out about it now? You have made it clear that the party was an engagement not a wedding. In my opinion, this is a good thing for you. The engagement party will be excellent evidence to bolster your case of a bona fide relationship. Trust me, you will have plenty of other things to worry about without adding this to the pile.

One last thing, according to the K1 guru, ME, the Consulate cannot deny your petition based on any information already approved by USCIS in your I-129F petition. Since, you included info about the engagement party in your petition and USCIS has approved it, then technically HCM cannot deny you based on that info.

Good luck!

I'm quite sure of my answer but it doesn't conflict with your. Mention it only if asked.

I agree.

[Otto 83]

One last thing, according to the K1 guru, ME, the Consulate cannot deny your petition based on any information already approved by USCIS in your I-129F petition. Since, you included info about the engagement party in your petition and USCIS has approved it, then technically HCM cannot deny you based on that info.

Not to cast doubt on anyone's 'Guruism' but this statement is troublesome - USCIS is not evaluating a petition in the same manner an Embassy/Consulate would and they do in fact use all evidence submitted in their decision.

[Carlawarla 1]

I'm not going to reply to your question OP, because frankly I really don't know. What I do know however is that the title of your thread is very deameaning and disrespectful! This is a community of people who help others. No one gives information that they know is false. You are required to filter information from this site, from other sources and come to your own conclusions. To suggest that people are "stupid", and their mouths? How horrible. You mentioned you should have posted this question at first in the VN section of VJ, and perhaps you should have. There are no experts here, if you require precise "legal" advise, hire an attorney.

[pushbrk 12,160]

One last thing, according to the K1 guru, ME, the Consulate cannot deny your petition based on any information already approved by USCIS in your I-129F petition. Since, you included info about the engagement party in your petition and USCIS has approved it, then technically HCM cannot deny you based on that info.

Not to cast doubt on anyone's 'Guruism' but this statement is troublesome - USCIS is not evaluating a petition in the same manner an Embassy/Consulate would and they do in fact use all evidence submitted in their decision.

CraigCam probably learned this from Marc Ellis' article(s) but has misinterpreted "should not" as "cannot". Mr. Ellis wouldn't have needed to write the article at all if the CO's in HCMC were consistently following what he says is technically correct.

Don't mention an engagement party unless asked directly. Instead, provide other evidence of a bona fide relationship. Scam relationships have engagement parties too.