Trudeau talks "diveristy" at sexist mosque

[OriZ 3,157]

are you saying that western ideals are white ideals? minorities should get on board or else those ideals are racist? there's so much spinning going on in this thread. specifically what ideals are you speaking of and how exactly are those ideals white to begin with?

No, I'm saying precisely the opposite.

[smilesammich 10,727]

No, I'm saying precisely the opposite.

you're saying the opposite of all three of my questions? i mean, if you're not going to actually discuss or answer - tell me to make a sandwich or something so i know to stop wasting my time.

[OriZ 3,157]

you're saying the opposite of all three of my questions? i mean, if you're not going to actually discuss or answer - tell me to make a sandwich or something so i know to stop wasting my time.

Well gee Val excuse me for thinking it was clear as day the first time around. I was basically just agreeing with this from JayJay:

The Alt Right, contrary to your belief is not a white supremacy movement. I'd argue perhaps that it's a western supremacy movement, as it focuses heavily on western ideals like free speech and traditional western values. There is nothing exclusively "white" in the term western however. Unless of course you believe that black, Asian and Hispanic Americans somehow aren't American.

And added that the only time they are "white" or "racist", is when minorities don't want to share those ideals. But in reality it has nothing to do with being white, black, muslim, hispanic...a white person would be just as incompatible with these ideals as a black person or a muslim if they didn't want to share them.

[smilesammich 10,727]

Well gee Val excuse me for thinking it was clear as day the first time around. I was basically just agreeing with this from JayJay:

The Alt Right, contrary to your belief is not a white supremacy movement. I'd argue perhaps that it's a western supremacy movement, as it focuses heavily on western ideals like free speech and traditional western values. There is nothing exclusively "white" in the term western however. Unless of course you believe that black, Asian and Hispanic Americans somehow aren't American.

And added that the only time they are "white" or "racist", is when minorities don't want to share those ideals. But in reality it has nothing to do with being white, black, muslim, hispanic...a white person would be just as incompatible with these ideals as a black person or a muslim if they didn't want to share them.

and i'm questioning this bit in bold..

if it's all about western ideals, then how exactly are you determining minorities declare western ideals 'racist' when they don't want to share them? they can't separate themselves from shared 'western' ideals as we're all from the west.

maybe this doesn't add up because you're attempting to spin a weakly spun web into something more conducive to considering the 'alt right' as a product of the pursuit of liberty and justice for all those who uphold western ideals instead of how many americans perceive the 'alt right' - as angry white american males (and sometimes women) who feel slighted and ignored by their once so proud/majorly white/male democracy. it's ####### honestly. nonwhites and nonchristians are not doing any sort of injustice to western ideals by standing up for their own pursuit of liberty and justice. quite the opposite, they're keeping those ideals alive.

[OriZ 3,157]

Well Val you can't deny that some minorities and immigrants consider certain aspects of western ideals, or at the very least the expectation that they be compatible with those ideals, to be racist(well I mean you can deny it of course if you wish but then we will simply have to agree to disagree). It's not like assimilation hasn't been an issue for a long time now...same with other issues that are ridiculously considered "racist" these days even though they have to do neither with race nor religion, but everything to do with the culture of the place, like I said white people are no exception. Your last paragraph is really a tantrum that has absolutely nothing to do with anything I've said in this thread

[Ban Hammer 12,839]

tell me to make a sandwich or something so i know to stop wasting my time.

breaktime is over, now get back to work. almost lunchtime!

[smilesammich 10,727]

Well Val you can't deny that some minorities and immigrants consider certain aspects of western ideals, or at the very least the expectation that they be compatible with those ideals, to be racist(well I mean you can deny it of course if you wish but then we will simply have to agree to disagree). It's not like assimilation hasn't been an issue for a long time now...same with other issues that are ridiculously considered "racist" these days even though they have to do neither with race nor religion, but everything to do with the culture of the place, like I said white people are no exception.

minorities have absolutely no reason to be assimilated. they are, as you said, a part of western ideals from the get go.

Your last paragraph is really a tantrum that has absolutely nothing to do with anything I've said in this thread

really? let's look at my tantrum again then..

maybe this doesn't add up because you're attempting to spin a weakly spun web into something more conducive to considering the 'alt right' as a product of the pursuit of liberty and justice for all those who uphold western ideals instead of how many americans perceive the 'alt right' - as angry white american males (and sometimes women) who feel slighted and ignored by their once so proud/majorly white/male democracy. it's ####### honestly. nonwhites and nonchristians are not doing any sort of injustice to western ideals by standing up for their own pursuit of liberty and justice. quite the opposite, they're keeping those ideals alive.

nope, you were agreeing what jay said about the alt right, and i was talking about the alt right. you were talking about western ideals, yep..looks like i was talking about western ideals too.

this is so typical of you and others here. you can't discuss a topic with me toe to toe. like i said, you've got nothing? do what everybody else does and tell me to make you a sandwich. that a way i know what binder to put you in.

[OriZ 3,157]

I don't believe it has much if anything at all to do with "proud/majorly white/male democracy", that's where we disagree and that's why you're going on a completely separate tantrum from what we were saying. I can't discuss a topic with you toe to toe? Umm do it with all of ya only all the time but ok...honestly I'm not even sure what you want me to discuss here...maybe you can point me in the right direction?

[We Keep Receipts 9,238]

I don't believe it has much if anything at all to do with "proud/majorly white/male democracy", that's where we disagree and that's why you're going on a completely separate tantrum from what we were saying. I can't discuss a topic with you toe to toe? Umm do it with all of ya only all the time but ok...honestly I'm not even sure what you want me to discuss here...maybe you can point me in the right direction?

I'll be your huckleberry.

That's exactly what it's about. How do I know? Because members of their group have told me so. Like I said, I engaged with them before. To see if they are truly a white hate group. And they are. Why? Because the second they found out I was black(I had to disclose it when the suggestion of removing all black, brown, and Muslims came up), it was an issue.

Here are some messages from the actual Alt Right Twitter Account:

Africans destroy everything we build. Time to separate whites from blacks

It's time to deport all Muslims

Refugees in Germany. F****** stay there!

Whites need to understand the NFL is degenerate garbage, and take back their Sundays.

And this is coming from a white woman...

[smilesammich 10,727]

I don't believe it has much if anything at all to do with "proud/majorly white/male democracy", that's where we disagree and that's why you're going on a completely separate tantrum from what we were saying. I can't discuss a topic with you toe to toe? Umm do it with all of ya only all the time but ok...honestly I'm not even sure what you want me to discuss here...maybe you can point me in the right direction?

you don't think the alt-right has anything to do with 'proud/majorly white/male democracy" ? what demographic is the alt right made of then?

toe to toe. i don't want you to discuss anything you don't want to discuss. but if you're responding to a post with three questions in it, maybe respond to those questions or not at all. i can't friggin even figure out what you're argument is, let alone point you in the right direction as to what to discuss further..

[elmcitymaven 9,711]

Article's main source of commentary and purported info is Daniel Pipes, who is a vile and contemptible toad whose writings and website have at various times on VJ been verboten as inflammatory, riddled with falsehoods and racist as hell.

Therefore this is of no interest to me, as I strictly abide by the TOS.

[Teddy B 17,251]

Article's main source of commentary and purported info is Daniel Pipes, who is a vile and contemptible toad whose writings and website have at various times on VJ been verboten as inflammatory, riddled with falsehoods and racist as hell.

Therefore this is of no interest to me, as I strictly abide by the TOS.

The VJ TOS is a living document that changes in the blink of an eye.

[elmcitymaven 9,711]

The VJ TOS is a living document that changes in the blink of an eye.

No strict constructionists here!

[OriZ 3,157]

you don't think the alt-right has anything to do with 'proud/majorly white/male democracy" ? what demographic is the alt right made of then?

toe to toe. i don't want you to discuss anything you don't want to discuss. but if you're responding to a post with three questions in it, maybe respond to those questions or not at all. i can't friggin even figure out what you're argument is, let alone point you in the right direction as to what to discuss further..

Well now we're starting to get on the same page Because I also don't think there is a whole lot to debate here, it was merely a subjective opinion. The point I was trying to make is that minorities, immigrants and people on the left tend to deem things as racist even when, in my opinion, it has nothing to do with racism. That's all I was trying to say...I wasn't referring in particular to any one group, just replying to what Jay said, but I did not mention the alt right in my comment as I was talking about the bigger picture of ideals, not one particular group.

Now go make me a sammich damnit, make sure it has extra cheese, and don't forget the green peppers! thanks!

[smilesammich 10,727]

Well now we're starting to get on the same page Because I also don't think there is a whole lot to debate here, it was merely a subjective opinion. The point I was trying to make is that minorities, immigrants and people on the left tend to deem things as racist even when, in my opinion, it has nothing to do with racism. That's all I was trying to say...I wasn't referring in particular to any one group, just replying to what Jay said, but I did not mention the alt right in my comment as I was talking about the bigger picture of ideals, not one particular group.

Now go make me a sammich damnit, make sure it has extra cheese, and don't forget the green peppers! thanks!

totally not on the same page, but i'll accept you're lunch order as an apology and drop a hint as to where you can put your sammich