Lying during naturalization interview - any consequences?

[Jacque67 7,328]

I don't think liars ever learn.

Only the lawyers will profit from this exercise unfortunately.

Best of luck, though .

[Rob L 3,811]

If I report her then this could support the picture of her dishonesty along with lying to me and my family where she was going and what she was doing with other men while we were married. As it stands she's not even being forthright with who she has taking care of our son while she is working. I want her to learn a lesson about lying and I want also not to have to worry about what she is doing with our son. As for spending $30-50k on lawyers i really dont care because i have nothing meaningful in my life except my son and money weighs little compared to my time with him. Twice this week my wife has told me that I am a better parent than her. I am. We both know it. I want her in my son's life but I also want what's best for him. She still wants physical custody. I see an all out war. Why would anyone hold back anything? I do not see her getting deported but i see accountability and perheps difficulty at a time when we're fighting for custody.

Also i often think of it from another perspective. I think about what if roles were reversed and i was trying to gain a better life in the philippines, married, had a child etc. what do you think the odds would be of her and her family completely winning full custody had i cheated on her while living there? I suspect i would be lucky even to visit him.

I am close to sending a letter to the uscis and reporting her.

I appreciate all the advice but anger coupled with acquiring any advantage possible is whats on my mind. I did speak to a lawyer about this. Interestingly i could use the threat of reporting her in other states but in CA it's bribery.

Was it a mistake to drop nukes on Japan during WW2? Perhaps. Did it serve to end the war with the desired outcome? Think a out what's most important to you in your life and what weapons you would use to secure it.

Your anger is a real thing, but I would hate to see it take things away from you. It sounds like reconciliation is not happening.

You have the goal of being the best parent possible and providing for your son in the best way possible. If you are like me it would be my number one goal. Part of what will influence a judges decision on custody arrangements will be the ability of the parents to prove that they can set other conflicts and competing interests aside to support the son. If I were in your position, I would be looking hard at any action I take that will be perceived as vindictive to others.

The "game" you need to win in family court is perception. Don't give her a weapon she can use against you. Be very careful about any verbal , written, facebook or email material that shows that you have or would threaten access to her son , her ability to earn and provide for her family. You have to assume that regardless of how much she can earn, what her education is or how much she has in assets, she will be perceived by the court to be more vulnerable as a woman , a mother and an immigrant. Remember she will have a lawyer representing her interests, assume they will exploit every thing you say or do that is perceived as a threat. This is not about what is fair or even factual. It is about you having a leading role in your sons life.

[ExPatty 502]

If I report her then this could support the picture of her dishonesty along with lying to me and my family where she was going and what she was doing with other men while we were married. As it stands she's not even being forthright with who she has taking care of our son while she is working. I want her to learn a lesson about lying and I want also not to have to worry about what she is doing with our son. As for spending $30-50k on lawyers i really dont care because i have nothing meaningful in my life except my son and money weighs little compared to my time with him. Twice this week my wife has told me that I am a better parent than her. I am. We both know it. I want her in my son's life but I also want what's best for him. She still wants physical custody. I see an all out war. Why would anyone hold back anything? I do not see her getting deported but i see accountability and perheps difficulty at a time when we're fighting for custody.

Also i often think of it from another perspective. I think about what if roles were reversed and i was trying to gain a better life in the philippines, married, had a child etc. what do you think the odds would be of her and her family completely winning full custody had i cheated on her while living there? I suspect i would be lucky even to visit him.

I am close to sending a letter to the uscis and reporting her.

I appreciate all the advice but anger coupled with acquiring any advantage possible is whats on my mind. I did speak to a lawyer about this. Interestingly i could use the threat of reporting her in other states but in CA it's bribery.

Was it a mistake to drop nukes on Japan during WW2? Perhaps. Did it serve to end the war with the desired outcome? Think a out what's most important to you in your life and what weapons you would use to secure it.

If you are in a one-party consent state, you need to start recording all conversations with her, whether on phone or in person. Particularly be sure to document examples of her saying things like you are a better parent. Those would be interesting data points if she's trying to fight for full custody to possibly spite you. Of course, don't let her know you're recording her, and yes if it's a one-party state it's totally legal to do this. Unfortunately, if you're in california it is a two-party

Edited January 28, 2015 by ExPatty

[rhein 451]

Personally, I'm with you 100%. I'd go for broke. You're not going to win this one by playing nice.

If I report her then this could support the picture of her dishonesty along with lying to me and my family where she was going and what she was doing with other men while we were married. As it stands she's not even being forthright with who she has taking care of our son while she is working. I want her to learn a lesson about lying and I want also not to have to worry about what she is doing with our son. As for spending $30-50k on lawyers i really dont care because i have nothing meaningful in my life except my son and money weighs little compared to my time with him. Twice this week my wife has told me that I am a better parent than her. I am. We both know it. I want her in my son's life but I also want what's best for him. She still wants physical custody. I see an all out war. Why would anyone hold back anything? I do not see her getting deported but i see accountability and perheps difficulty at a time when we're fighting for custody.

Also i often think of it from another perspective. I think about what if roles were reversed and i was trying to gain a better life in the philippines, married, had a child etc. what do you think the odds would be of her and her family completely winning full custody had i cheated on her while living there? I suspect i would be lucky even to visit him.

I am close to sending a letter to the uscis and reporting her.

I appreciate all the advice but anger coupled with acquiring any advantage possible is whats on my mind. I did speak to a lawyer about this. Interestingly i could use the threat of reporting her in other states but in CA it's bribery.

Was it a mistake to drop nukes on Japan during WW2? Perhaps. Did it serve to end the war with the desired outcome? Think a out what's most important to you in your life and what weapons you would use to secure it.

[Mountain Climber 186]

Personally, I'm with you 100%. I'd go for broke. You're not going to win this one by playing nice.

I agree. The best defense is a good offense.

[Darnell 8,478]

Well, there's immigration stuff to do,

and divorce stuff to do.

seems the immigration stuff needed to be handled last week - so were you (the OP) able to get stuff lobbed over the security fence into the building? at each local USCIS office, there's a drop box, the security guard will let you in to use the drop box without an appointment letter from infopass.

You'll need to address the packet to the human that interviewed her.

Divorce stuff can come later. Handle the immigration stuff now, and be certain to bifurcate the two, or it'll drive you nuts for a while. I know being in an emotional state usually affects people and their ability to be productive, daily, so I suggest you do something that rebalances yer emotional state, daily.

You need a clear head to get stuff done, really.

[novedsac 355]

Your anger is a real thing, but I would hate to see it take things away from you. It sounds like reconciliation is not happening.

You have the goal of being the best parent possible and providing for your son in the best way possible. If you are like me it would be my number one goal. Part of what will influence a judges decision on custody arrangements will be the ability of the parents to prove that they can set other conflicts and competing interests aside to support the son. If I were in your position, I would be looking hard at any action I take that will be perceived as vindictive to others.

The "game" you need to win in family court is perception. Don't give her a weapon she can use against you. Be very careful about any verbal , written, facebook or email material that shows that you have or would threaten access to her son , her ability to earn and provide for her family. You have to assume that regardless of how much she can earn, what her education is or how much she has in assets, she will be perceived by the court to be more vulnerable as a woman , a mother and an immigrant. Remember she will have a lawyer representing her interests, assume they will exploit every thing you say or do that is perceived as a threat. This is not about what is fair or even factual. It is about you having a leading role in your sons life.

This is excellent advice.

You will need as clear head going into this. Determine where you want to be when your through and then a strategy to get there. Execute the strategy methodically and don't let your emotions get in your way.

Find a good counselor if you must ... be a lot cheaper than ranting to your lawyer all the time. And you certainly NEVER want to rant to your wife during this process. Your laywer is for legal advice and the rules of the courtroom/evidence.

Not sure if they use guardian ad litems in CA, but if they do, then I would highly recommend one. Do your homework first so you can get your wife to agree on one whom you think will be a good fit for you and what you are seeking.

Being perceived as reasonable, fair and putting the interests of your son above your own is parament, especially if the mother is seen as unfair, unreasonable and selfish.

Good luck.

Edited January 29, 2015 by novedsac

[novedsac 355]

Some of these points are 'ok,' some are wide of the mark.

It is not altogether likely she's be allowed to take the child abroad to live. See In re Marriage of La Musga 88 P3d 81, 12 Cal Rptr 3d 356, 32 Cal 4th 1072 (Ca 2004). It's very case by case, per that decision, and this guy lives in California, so that's the correct case law. If he can get primary physical custody, which he needs to step up and fight for, then it definitely won't happen.

Agreed. That was what I was getting it ... Judge will determine what's in the best interest of the child. A USC child living outside the US isn't, on its own merit, against the best interest of the child. The risk here is that if the guy succeeds in having the wife deported, there is the risk that a family court judge would decide that it is in the child's interest to be with the mother regardless of where she lives. Of course, many other things come into play here and the OP needs to get on the ball and stay on the ball; primary custody for the Dad seems to be more effort than for the Mom, all other things being equal.

With her making 90K, she would be the one to pay HIM spousal support (for a limited duration, given the short marriage) and if he can get primary physical custody, SHE would be the one paying child support. (IIRC, OP mentioned in another thread she is making more than he is now).

I didn't ready any other thread involving the OP, so I wasn't aware of his income relative to hers. Regardless, child support is most often awarded based on a percentage of each parent's income to the total family income, multiplied into the support algorithm used by the jurisdiction. Even if he had no income, he could still be liable for a portion of the child support. I have custody of my children and my ex-wife had never worked during our marriage and was not working at the time of divorce. I never asked the Court for child support from her. However, the Judge awarded child support to me by imputing income to her based on the prevailing minimum wage. It amounts to about 2% of the total child support determined by the county algorithm.

Alimony, in most states, is all over the place and highly dependent on the whim of the Judge. I'd be more concerned with minimizing risk than looking for a windfall.

Getting her deported isn't necessarily the bad idea some seem to think it is. If she's half the snake you say she is, I'd try it, and simultaneously fight for primary physical custody. Make sure you have that child's passport secured, so she can't take off with the kid. You can also get a court order preventing her from taking the child out of the country while all this is being resolved.

Temporary Court Order to keep the child within the US, indeed within the County of residence, without consent of the other parent, is an excellent idea and highly recommended. My Temporary Court Order stipulated that the children had to remain in their current school districts; travel outside the county for more than 14 days and any international travel needed consent from the other parent. Kept the kids where they needed to be.

I still think deportation is a bad idea. Unless the mom is a danger to the children and their well-being (for the Court to decide), having her deported deprives the children of quality time with her (assuming the Dad gains primary custody). Over the years this will be detrimental to the child's development and potentially even backfare on the relationship the son has with the Dad. An unsuccessful attempt may even backfire if her attorney is sharp and paying attention - Judge's don't like it when one spouse is engaging in vindictive behavior. It's childish. It's in the OPs interest to consider what's best for his son prior to what's best for him. The only 'win' with a deportation is that the OP feels a bit like he got one up on her ... that pales in comparison to the potential long-term negative effects.

As to the 30K cost, it depends. If she lawyers up, you'd better do the same, so it could come to that. Do you think she's willing to spend that kind of cash? If not, you can both proceed pro se.

If it is going to be contested, only a fool would proceed without legal representation. If OP wants custody of his son, then there is too much at stake to be messing around with DIY legal forums, Google research and the such. Sure, do your own homework, but you'll never match the legal expertise of someone who has done this hundreds of times in the very jurisdiction that you are proceeding in.

Edited January 29, 2015 by novedsac

[Ugly_American 11]

The funny game she's now playing is to say that we never agreed to seperate. I still have evidence of her cheating prior to seperation, not that it matters, but there's no wayt I'm letting her tell me we didn't seperate. She's very nervous about her lie. I think what I will do is report her after the divorce paperwork is filed. Her life is so ###### easy compared to mine. Even now I'm taking care of our son 80% of the time, while she spends nights with guys in hotels. At the very least I want her to begin to be accountable for her lies. Also, after the divorse is completed I will send a complete summary of what she did to her parents. They will be very upset with her and she will be disgraced. I'm on the fence about reporting her cheating during her job interview. It may not get her fired, but the nursing board would probably be interested. All of her family and pinay friends who think I must be such a monster, will see who she really is and think twice about screwing up their own families.

[frody 14]

I understand you can be upset but what you are really showing is you care more how she spend her nights than the privilege you have to take care of your son 80 % of the time.

You trying to alienate her with her family , friends and work that says a lot about your character.

personal problems are PERSONAL and not to be shared in the job of nobody placing in risk a job post just because you are upset.

Telling the family of her only will make them upset but at the end of the day ..they are HER family and you will be the one that shows lack of common sense about to be discrete.

Did you ever hear about the dirty clothes must be washed at home?

[rhein 451]

I understand you can be upset but what you are really showing is you care more how she spend her nights than the privilege you have to take care of your son 80 % of the time.

You trying to alienate her with her family , friends and work that says a lot about your character.

personal problems are PERSONAL and not to be shared in the job of nobody placing in risk a job post just because you are upset.

Telling the family of her only will make them upset but at the end of the day ..they are HER family and you will be the one that shows lack of common sense about to be discrete.

Did you ever hear about the dirty clothes must be washed at home?

Completely disagree on most points here. Sure, tell her family and screw her any way you can, but I wouldn't try to get her fired. Dude, you can get custody and get child support from her. The more she makes, the more money you can get from her to take care of/put into savings for your kid's future.

[frody 14]

Seems nobody think WHY this happens...why she cheat on him (if thats true)

Why he is not willing to go counseling and get a good relationship back.

Its not important if you are with her or not ...but you have a child in common that was made with love.

You will be in contact with her and dealing with her for the rest of your life. So please: breathe and go counseling to get this angry/bitterness/revenge attitude sort.

Nothing good can came from someone thats not thinking rationally and only guided by Jealousy.

[rhein 451]

Seems nobody think WHY this happens...why she cheat on him (if thats true)

Why he is not willing to go counseling and get a good relationship back.

Its not important if you are with her or not ...but you have a child in common that was made with love.

You will be in contact with her and dealing with her for the rest of your life. So please: breathe and go counseling to get this angry/bitterness/revenge attitude sort.

Nothing good can came from someone thats not thinking rationally and only guided by Jealousy.

Why? People cheat for any number of reasons. Why do you assume that he, the victim, must have done something wrong? Some people just don't care, and cheat; some people discover they do not wish to be monogamous, and don't have the guts/tools/framework for asking their partner if they would be willing to open up the relationship, so just cheat instead; some people come from a country and a background where it was impossible for them to be their fully-actuated sexual selves, and when given the freedom without consequence, go wild and shtup everything in sight; etc.

What would be the point in going to counseling? She's the one who would need to ask for his forgiveness, and ask to go to counseling, instead she seems to have opened a mobile open-legs sandwich shop at any number of locations.

Get real, and quit making excuses for the wrong-doer here. He has every right to be pissed off, and there's no reason their relationship over their child has to be any more than coolly civil, nor, IMO, should it be.

Edited February 4, 2015 by Jon and Sol

[Ugly_American 11]

Completely disagree on most points here. Sure, tell her family and screw her any way you can, but I wouldn't try to get her fired. Dude, you can get custody and get child support from her. The more she makes, the more money you can get from her to take care of/put into savings for your kid's future.

Because i don't care about her money or getting alimony. I want her to really feel what its like to struggle. I want her to realize what a huge mistake she made. My son will be well taken care of regardless of her income.

[Ugly_American 11]

Why? People cheat for any number of reasons. Why do you assume that he, the victim, must have done something wrong? Some people just don't care, and cheat; some people discover they do not wish to be monogamous, and don't have the guts/tools/framework for asking their partner if they would be willing to open up the relationship, so just cheat instead; some people come from a country and a background where it was impossible for them to be their fully-actuated sexual selves, and when given the freedom without consequence, go wild and shtup everything in sight; etc.

What would be the point in going to counseling? She's the one who would need to ask for his forgiveness, and ask to go to counseling, instead she seems to have opened a mobile open-legs sandwich shop at any number of locations.

Get real, and quit making excuses for the wrong-doer here. He has every right to be pissed off, and there's no reason their relationship over their child has to be any more than coolly civil, nor, IMO, should it be.

I've tried to get her to counseling. There's nothing more I could have done and I went way out on a limb trying to get her to realize how important this is. Frankly I cannot understand her at all because I cant understand anyone that selfish. Her goal is to find a very wealthy man so that she never has to work. That's what she wants and so she doesn't even need a job for that.

I can tell you that at this very moment she is working a second shift but only after asking me to care for our son during the time she was supposed to be caring for him. Why is she working a double shift? Because she's trying to save up for an attorney retainer....on my time.

I think i mentioned it, but yesterday she had me watch our son during her time so that she could see a doctor, but the doctor was actually a family law attorney. She is the most selfish person I have ever met.

Just now on Facebook she made a post thanking everyone for support and understanding her situation. It was so hard for me not to post something like, "yes we all feel bad about how you abandoned your husband and son to secretly meet a stranger, then how you met another guy, and another guy. And how you placed one of these guys as a beneficiary on your life insurance, and how you're so in tune with your own pain but never seem to consider how all of this was brought on by you."

All i can do is bite my tongue now, but in time i will be informing folks of that facts of "her situation"