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chonguaphilia

China Wife without birth cert, Hukou or parent's marriage cert

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Filed: K-3 Visa Country: China
Timeline

Greetings,

My wife, a citizen of China, has no birth certificate, because she was the third of three girls, in a row, born to parents bent on producing a male heir, so her birth took place in a private residence leaving no trace of documentation; therefore, her name is also absent from their family registration record (Hukou). Finally, her father and mother, who are together to this day, were never married and do not have a marriage certificate.

Her parents never paid any fines or other restitution to the state on account of scoffing at the one-child law. Therefore, in order to process a legitimate birth certificate for my wife, would obviate her parents to concede having multiple children and therefore cause them considerable hardship, as they are semi-destitute and on a fixed income.

My wife does have a Chinese ID Card - somewhat like our driver's licenses in the states. She also has a passport.

The USCIS webpage instructs the following regarding unobtainable birth records:

"Unobtainable birth certificates

If your birth record is not obtainable for any reason, a certified statement must be obtained from the appropriate government authority explaining why your birth record is unavailable. You must also submit secondary evidence such as:

  • A baptismal certificate that contains the date and place of birth, as well as both parents names (providing the baptism took place shortly after birth)
  • An adoption decree for an adopted child
  • An affidavit from a close relative, preferably your mother, stating the date and place of birth, both parents names, and your mother’s maiden name.

More specific information is available from the NVC, the nearest U.S. immigrant visa processing post, or online at Reciprocity by Country.

Note: An affidavit executed before an official authorized to take oaths or affirmations must also be provided. More specific information is available from the NVC."

However, these options obviate the family to turn themselves in for breaking the one-child policy, because the notaries in China are not like their counterparts here in the states - they are actual government officials sworn to report infractions.

My wife is a wonderful lady and she did not ask to be born into such an undocumented mess; I did know that she had multiple siblings, but I did not approach our courtship such as, "hey, let's go steady, but first let me see your papers..."; that's just not how it works.

Does anyone have or know of a similar situation in which the spouse of a US citizen had these challenges of absent documentation? Certainly this situation is not novel.

I appreciate any advice - please help out if you can.

Thank you in-advance and best regards to all,

JD

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I don't have an answer, but I am curious if you or anyone else can elaborate on how one gets an ID or passport without having a birth certificate, since as far as I understand the birth certificate is considered a primary document necessary to get any form of identification—and anything that doesn't require it (like a driver license in the fifty states in the U.S.) still requires other documents that you couldn't get without having a birth certificate in the first place (Social Security card, passport, et cetera).

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It's possible to get a passport and such with no birth certificate, but you need a bunch of other records and docs to prove your identity and place of birth. It can vary from place to place, but usually the first thing that you need is a letter of no record from the civil authority that issues birth certs.

Here in the US, to get a passport if you don't have birth cert for example, they also require as many public records from before you were 5 years old as possible such as school records, census records, baptism, affidavits of people who know about your birth such as an older relative.

There was even a class action suit, but this was about people who had birth certificates that were registered a year after they were born in border states and the DoS had denied them passports because they suspected the birth certs were fraudulent. Very discriminatory, all I know is that they won.

As for the OP: Here is info about the documents you can obtain in China

http://travel.state.gov/content/visas/english/fees/reciprocity-by-country/CH.html#docs


This does not constitute legal advice.

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Filed: K-3 Visa Country: China
Timeline

Please consider that, as described, my wife's birth was illegal due to the one-child policy in China. Therefore, any attempt to legitimize her birth documentation at this point would obviate the notary (who is an agent of the government of the PRC) to report the parents for multiple births, which would invoke legal action and considerable hardship against her parents, who are semi-destitute.

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Filed: IR-1/CR-1 Visa Country: China
Timeline

no hukuo at all ? even issued because of work or school ?

although she has china id card, does she have china passport ?

Edited by Darnell

Sometimes my language usage seems confusing - please feel free to 'read it twice', just in case !
Ya know, you can find the answer to your question with the advanced search tool, when using a PC? Ditch the handphone, come back later on a PC, and try again.

-=-=-=-=-=R E A D ! ! !=-=-=-=-=-

Whoa Nelly ! Want NVC Info? see http://www.visajourney.com/wiki/index.php/NVC_Process

Congratulations on your approval ! We All Applaud your accomplishment with Most Wonderful Kissies !

 

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Filed: K-3 Visa Country: China
Timeline

Hey Wuhan - Much appreciated! She DOES have the standard ID card and a passport; as I understand the situation, these were ill-gotten by way of guang-xi (mums-the-word); the birth date on these records is not her actual birthday, you see.

She is not listed in her family's Hukou.

I'm truly grateful for your feedback!

Edited by chonguaphilia

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Filed: Lift. Cond. (apr) Country: China
Timeline

Please consider that, as described, my wife's birth was illegal due to the one-child policy in China. Therefore, any attempt to legitimize her birth documentation at this point would obviate the notary (who is an agent of the government of the PRC) to report the parents for multiple births, which would invoke legal action and considerable hardship against her parents, who are semi-destitute.

The problem is that what you NEED to do is "to legitimize her birth documentation at this point . . . (through) an agent of the government of the PRC ".

Time to get creative, perhaps like she did in getting the Chinese ID and passport. Perhaps the Chinese ID and passport will suffice, along with an explanation.

Edited by RandyW

玉林,桂 resident
Feb 23, 2005 ........ Mailed I-129F to TSC . . . . . . . . .March 8th ............. P1 from CSC
April 11 ................. P2 from CSC . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .April 25 ................ NVC sends packet to GUZ
June 22 ................ P3 received . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Nov 22 ................. PASSED Interview
Dec 2 ................... Made it! . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Dec 16 .................. Married
May 23, 2006 ..... TDL, EAD, AP received. . . . . . . . . June 16, 2006 ........ AOS interview - wait for FBI bkgrnd check
Apr 19, 2007 .... EAD # 2. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Oct 7, 2008 ......... 10-year green card
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - K2 (son) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Dec 2 ..................... AOS/EAD filed . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Dec 17 ................... 21st birthday
Jan 4, 2007 .......... transferred to CSC . . . . . . . . . . . Feb 6, 2007 ............ transferred to MSC
Feb 23 .................... EAD card . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .Apr 16 .................... AOS denied (over 21)
Jul 26 .................... Master Calendar hearing . . . . . . Nov 15 ...................... Removal hearing
Jan 29, 2008 ........ Voluntary departure

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Filed: K-3 Visa Country: China
Timeline

Update: She has a Hukou, listing only her and her younger brother; she is listed as the head of the household.

Her Hukou does not list either of her parents.

She has an orginal, one-page document with police stamps bearing her and her parent's names / IDs submitted by her parents requesting her Hukou to be transferred to the same hometown as the parent's Hukou (confused yet?). I suggest this is the most "valuable document" in terms of secondary evidence, as it bears all names. (their Hukou was not successfully transferred).

The leadership of the government in the town where her Hukou is registered (ZiYang) was popped by the anti-corruption movement. Her sister works for the government in that town and indicated that there is meticulous pressure at all levels of the town's administration to detect and report any irregularities and that she (her sister) could not help us to get a birth cert based upon my wife's Hukou / ID Card / Passport and that no one else would be willing to help us out either.

I think that we have no choice but to explain why the birth cert is not obtainable and that the conventional "unobtainable Birth Cert" process, involving the "appropriate government authority" cannot be submitted, in a memorandum that is appended to our K3 submission; this along with a sworn statement from her mother, describing the prescribed parental data as per the directions in the "unobtainable birth cert" procedure, would seem to be the most acceptable approach.

Anybody?

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Update: She has a Hukou, listing only her and her younger brother; she is listed as the head of the household.

Her Hukou does not list either of her parents.

She has an orginal, one-page document with police stamps bearing her and her parent's names / IDs submitted by her parents requesting her Hukou to be transferred to the same hometown as the parent's Hukou (confused yet?). I suggest this is the most "valuable document" in terms of secondary evidence, as it bears all names. (their Hukou was not successfully transferred).

The leadership of the government in the town where her Hukou is registered (ZiYang) was popped by the anti-corruption movement. Her sister works for the government in that town and indicated that there is meticulous pressure at all levels of the town's administration to detect and report any irregularities and that she (her sister) could not help us to get a birth cert based upon my wife's Hukou / ID Card / Passport and that no one else would be willing to help us out either.

I think that we have no choice but to explain why the birth cert is not obtainable and that the conventional "unobtainable Birth Cert" process, involving the "appropriate government authority" cannot be submitted, in a memorandum that is appended to our K3 submission; this along with a sworn statement from her mother, describing the prescribed parental data as per the directions in the "unobtainable birth cert" procedure, would seem to be the most acceptable approach.

Anybody?

I'd enlist the help of your Congress representative to help work the DOS/USCIS side with support on the explanation of lack of documents and acceptance of what you have presented.

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Filed: IR-1/CR-1 Visa Country: China
Timeline

OK - IMO, you want to pay for a consult with Eunice Wang, she's the office staffer for Marc Ellis' office in Guangzhou,

and she can give you some directions on what to do.

not posting stuff here - but if you google Marc Ellis Immigration

then look at contact info - the china number is usually answered by Eunice.

Be prepared to pay for a consult, unsure about the fee amount.


Sometimes my language usage seems confusing - please feel free to 'read it twice', just in case !
Ya know, you can find the answer to your question with the advanced search tool, when using a PC? Ditch the handphone, come back later on a PC, and try again.

-=-=-=-=-=R E A D ! ! !=-=-=-=-=-

Whoa Nelly ! Want NVC Info? see http://www.visajourney.com/wiki/index.php/NVC_Process

Congratulations on your approval ! We All Applaud your accomplishment with Most Wonderful Kissies !

 

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Filed: Lift. Cond. (apr) Country: China
Timeline

Moved from K3 Progress Reports to China regional forum; topic is country specific issue.


Our journey:

Spoiler

September 2007: Met online via social networking site (MySpace); began exchanging messages.
March 26, 2009: We become a couple!
September 10, 2009: Arrived for first meeting in-person!
June 17, 2010: Arrived for second in-person meeting and start of travel together to other areas of China!
June 21, 2010: Engaged!!!
September 1, 2010: Switched course from K1 to CR-1
December 8, 2010: Wedding date set; it will be on February 18, 2011!
February 9, 2011: Depart for China
February 11, 2011: Registered for marriage in Wuhan, officially married!!!
February 18, 2011: Wedding ceremony in Shiyan!!!
April 22, 2011: Mailed I-130 to Chicago
April 28, 2011: Received NOA1 via text/email, file routed to CSC (priority date April 25th)
April 29, 2011: Updated
May 3, 2011: Received NOA1 hardcopy in mail
July 26, 2011: Received NOA2 via text/email!!!
July 30, 2011: Received NOA2 hardcopy in mail
August 8, 2011: NVC received file
September 1, 2011: NVC case number assigned
September 2, 2011: AOS invoice received, OPTIN email for EP sent
September 7, 2011: Paid AOS bill (payment portal showed PAID on September 9, 2011)
September 8, 2011: OPTIN email accepted, GZO number assigned
September 10, 2011: Emailed AOS package
September 12, 2011: IV bill invoiced
September 13, 2011: Paid IV bill (payment portal showed PAID on September 14, 2011)
September 14, 2011: Emailed IV package
October 3, 2011: Emailed checklist response (checklist generated due to typo on Form DS-230)
October 6, 2011: Case complete at NVC
November 10, 2011: Interview - APPROVED!!!
December 7, 2011: POE - Sea-Tac Airport

September 17, 2013: Mailed I-751 to CSC

September 23, 2013: Received NOA1 in mail (receipt date September 19th)

October 16, 2013: Biometrics Appointment

January 28, 2014: Production of new Green Card ordered

February 3, 2014: New Green Card received; done with USCIS until fall of 2023*

 

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