Ban hands and feet

[Ban Hammer 12,882]

I went to school in the state of Brandenburg, Germany. List here at the link. There were 2 school shootings in all of Germany (Cologne and Epstein) in that same 50 year time frame between 1950 and 2000.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_shooting#Europe

nice arbitary cutoff range - naturally it excludes some significant ones that occurred recently.

- The Erfurt massacre was a school shooting that occurred on April 26, 2002, at the Johann Gutenberg Gymnasium in Erfurt, Germany. Sixteen people were killed before the perpetrator committed suicide.

- July 3 2003 - 16-year-old student shoots two of his teachers before taking his own life.

- November 20 2006 - Geschwister Scholl School attack, Emsdetten, Germany.

- March 11 2009 - Former 17-year-old student kills 16, injuring nine others..

Edited December 29, 2012 by charles!

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

That's the issue that nobody wants to really talk about: The biggest threat that Americans face is, well, Americans. More Americans are killed by Americans with guns every year than there are people killed by terrorists all across the """"Censored """" globe. It's that bad. And yet we have morons running around saying all we need are more guns out there on our streets. That's just incomprehensible stupidity.

And we have morons who want to ban a gun because of the way it looks, which is only a small percentage of the problem. That is incomprehensible stupidity . Knives kill more people that Assault weapons.

BTW I edited out you attempt to Fbomb again... Have some class

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

I was born and raised in St. Louis, back then it wasn't as bad as it is now. When I got back from basic training back in 1994, I was shocked to see how bad things had fallen, I was only gone 7 months and when I returned, my mom had bars on the windows. Talk about a culture shock, and what's worse is we used to live in a decent neighborhood, now it's straight hood. If you can clean up the area with jobs and maybe stop idolizing those saggy pants and bad behavior, we might be able to work something out.

Amen Brother

[Karee 4,189]

BTW I edited out you attempt to Fbomb again... Have some class

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

nice arbitary cutoff range -

We were talking about the time that spooky went to school. I wager a guess that he was done with school by the year 2000. Probably much earlier and certainly no later. No arbitrary cut-of there, Chuck. Do you need tin foil, too?

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

And we have morons who want to ban a gun because of the way it looks, which is only a small percentage of the problem.

Why are you all hung up on that assault weapons ban discussion? That's the least of the worries. Preventing access to firearms - all firearms - to people who should not have such access is what the issue is. THAT is what needs to happen. Assault weapons should not be in civilian hands - that is common sense. We know that gun nuts lack common sense so naturally they will not ever be able to grasp the obvious. It's not the big issue but those should come off the streets all the same.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

Why are you all hung up on that assault weapons ban discussion? That's the least of the worries. Preventing access to firearms - all firearms - to people who should not have such access is what the issue is. THAT is what needs to happen. Assault weapons should not be in civilian hands - that is common sense. We know that gun nuts lack common sense so naturally they will not ever be able to grasp the obvious. It's not the big issue but those should come off the streets all the same.

Ok so as of today you are not calling for an assault weapons ban any longer ? Good that because that is a foolish position.

So what kind of ban are you proposing now.

[james&olya 1,121]

Once again you have regressed to calling for a ban on assault weapons., can you you give one credible shred of evidence that this would make us safer. A ban on assault weapons is a politically motivated exercise in grandstanding to whip ignorant people into a state of frenzy and make them think someone is making them safer. As i showed more people die from hands and feet than from assault weapons every years. Why do you people keep screaming ban "assault Hollywood looking scary guns"

I just don't understand how you people think going after a weapon because of the way it looks or magazine capacity is going to change anything. Go back and look at the FBI numbers. It just does not add up.

P,>S So I can only have a 10 round mag for my AR-15. I can tell you as an ex-infantryman, I can change that mag and be back firing before you count to 3, which is about the same amount of time it takes someone to acquire and shoot at a target that is not concealed.

So tell me how a ban on assault weapons is going to bring down the firearm murder rate when the vast majority are committed by easily concealed handguns. You can't becuse it makes no sense what so ever. Rememeber where this started. More people die of assault with feet and hands than by assault weapons ever year.

So if the recent massacre had been carried out by a guy with a shotgun and 2 glocks with 10 round mags would you feel better. I can promise the results would have been the same

You can promise me the moon. It still will not make you right! When that brave principal and the other woman there lunged for this gunman their chances of successfully reaching him and disarming him would have been substantially improved if he was trying to change magazines. Saying otherwise is pure RWNJ BS and if you have any brains at all you know it is true!!

[james&olya 1,121]

This thread was started with those statistics that clearly point out hand guns kill way way more than assault weapons. So do hands and feet.

We are trying to do something in the name of fixing gun violence that is not the problem. Just the hand gun murders in one city "Chicago" account for more murders than all assault weapons in the whole of the U.S.

Yet the liberal politicians spend so much time to ban something that anyone with any common sense knows is not the problem. It's a joke. Anyone that supprots this ban, does not understand, 1. Statistics 2. Math 3. Tactics 4. Weapons.

Perhaps your problem grasping this is that you are unable to see or acknowledge that we are dealing with more than a single problem. Handgun violence is also a real issue but just because more deaths in total are attributed to their use that does not mean assault weapons are not also a problem! So stop using the article 'the' and replace it with 'a'.

Perhaps you might want to figure out a solution to the handgun violence problem! No? That somehow does not surprise me!!!

[himher 634]

Germany is not our peer. What you don't get because you havent looked into it is that the second ammendment is about giving the people the right and power to hold back their own GOVERNMENT. The men who wrote the second ammendment put it down and carefully recorded their reason for it.

Your example of the bastion of freedom that Germany has become pales under the spotlight of mass graves containing millions of bodies and ash layers on the homes of German towns from incenerated civilians.

You are so proud of what Germany is but fail to acknowledge that Germany is what it is because good people with guns displaced bad people with guns and good people with guns guarded Germany against bad people with guns for DECADES afterwards. You were SAFE because AMERICANS holding guns believed that you should be safe and put their lives on the line to ensure it.

Now you pass it off as if it's nothing. Better you say thank you and move on to a topic that you know something about.

Extinction by government had not and does not happen in America. These are the worst of the mass killings in history. Those of you who put Japan and their safety or China and their safety forget the Nanking massacre or forget that Mao killed 20,000,000 of his own civilians

That old A303 that I joke about being ban-worthy because of the bayonete attachment came from a war and it came from Europe and the reason that gun was in Europe is because a nation in Europe entrusted their government with full power and that government then selected entire parts of that society for efficient and systematic extinction.

Short answer: I lived in the ME and did fine over there. I do not however like places (like Germany or the ME) where unarmed people are and can be arbitrarily killed so I prefer to live in the US.

"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion.... And what country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms.... The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."

- Thomas Jefferson, in letter to William S. Smith, 1787

Those words were true then and they are true today. God bless America - even when America and the American people have to deal the occasional smack-down to the German so-called "utopias" of the world.

Dude, if you like schools like that for your kids, then I recommend Jakarta or some place in the ME for you. I remember going to school w/o ever seeing any armed guards, without there ever being any checks for whatthefcukever at the gate and guess what? We were SAFE at school. Yes, that IS possible. Safety for kids in schools w/o barb wire, fences, security checks and guns is possible. I've seen it with my own eyes and I can still see it with my own eyes in developed nations around the world that have sane gun policies. So rather than trying to head down the path of countries that are centuries behind us, I'd rather we take a look at our peers and see what we can learn from them. Trust me, we can learn a lot from them.

Edited December 29, 2012 by himher

[himher 634]

Dam smart to stay out of pre-1950. Inceneration of schoolchildren would have maybe skewed the data a bit

nice arbitary cutoff range - naturally it excludes some significant ones that occurred recently.

- The Erfurt massacre was a school shooting that occurred on April 26, 2002, at the Johann Gutenberg Gymnasium in Erfurt, Germany. Sixteen people were killed before the perpetrator committed suicide.

- July 3 2003 - 16-year-old student shoots two of his teachers before taking his own life.

- November 20 2006 - Geschwister Scholl School attack, Emsdetten, Germany.

- March 11 2009 - Former 17-year-old student kills 16, injuring nine others..

[james&olya 1,121]

I'll add this:

I taught at an American school in the Middle East for 5 years. My students were made up of embassy and oil kiddos, along with some local VIPs.

Very few vehicles were allowed onto the campus. The ones that were had to be bomb-checked. Guards everywhere, and ten foot high fences with barbed wire.

In the Middle East, this makes sense, as American establishments have a history of being targeted in the region. When I came home to the USA for short holidays, the freedom and peacefulness of not having to worry about bombs and such was amazing and energizing.

I find it sad and depressing (not to mention slightly infuriating) that our nation may resort to the same security measures in order to protect itself from its own citizens. I think it's a slippery slope. Next it'll be malls, hotels, and pretty soon we'll be no different than many of the establishments in the Middle East.

That is not the America I love and envision.

Many lives have already been sacrificed on the altar of those who worship the 2nd amendment and many more will join them before we control this cancer, if we are even ever able to do so!

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Ok so as of today you are not calling for an assault weapons ban any longer ? Good that because that is a foolish position.

So what kind of ban are you proposing now.

You have trouble with reading comprehension? How did you get what you say there out of what I said?

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Perhaps your problem grasping this is that you are unable to see or acknowledge that we are dealing with more than a single problem. Handgun violence is also a real issue but just because more deaths in total are attributed to their use that does not mean assault weapons are not also a problem! So stop using the article 'the' and replace it with 'a'.

Perhaps you might want to figure out a solution to the handgun violence problem! No? That somehow does not surprise me!!!

I will. Surprise!

Allow anyone to carry concealed handguns. No permits, no licenses, no training, no background checks, do not even need to be a resident. There simply is NO LAW which restricts the practice. None. Simply repeal ALL laws related to the carrying of firearms. Allow ANYone to carry concealed weapons ANYwhere, ANYtime. Create the law so that ALL people are potentially armed. Works in the United States of America (who cares about Germany?) Vermont is consistentlay the state with the lowest crime rate. Vermont has a crime rate 1/3 that of Canada, 1/7 that of Great Britian. Vermont is, actually, the safest political subdivision in the western hemisphere which is larger than a zip code.

Tell me exactly why it would not work in your part of the United States of America. THEN tell me how a gun law(s) would correct the issues you list.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Germany is not our peer.

It is closer to us than the Middle East will ever be.