Complicated Love Story - Help!

[SunShowers87 0]

Hello everyone - for all of you who have already gone through the K1 Visa application with success, I would appreciate it if you could try and read through my and my fiance's complicated situation....any help would be appreciated!!

Here's the situation:

In September, 2009, I arrived in France on an 8 month work contract to teach English. My contract ended and I Went home on May 29, 2010.

Within the first week of arrival, I met and started a relationship with my (now) fiance, who is from the Ivory Coast - originally. We saw each other quite often while he finished his 3-month stay in France, and then he returned to Italy, where he has his temporary residency. He came back to France in the Spring of 2010, before I returned to the United States.

He was in France on a 3-month vacation visiting friends at the time of our meeting in Paris, as his permanent residency is in Italy - where he has "Humanitarian Stay" (a sort of political asylum status, but with less benefits). He has this because he was forced to leave the Ivory Coast in 2008 after his country's political and social turmoil took a turn for the worse. There had been a full-out war in 2003-2005.

Our first problem is this: we aren't really able to fill out any employer history in Italy, as, due to the language barrier and the economic situation of Italy (one of the highest unemployment for nationals), he has been unemployed since his arrival, living with his cousin. He has been trying to get a job, and it just isn't working...to make matters worse, Italy is also known to be very racist toward blacks.

We will be able to fill in his employment in Africa, as he was employed in Ivory Coast until his departure; he ran his own store. We weren't sure if this would pose a problem - unemployment for nearly 3 years?

Our second problem is this: aside from TONS of photos (which are not time stamped from the camera, even though I've handwritten the dates and places on the back of each one) - my Fiance does not have any primary evidence for his travels in France to prove we met there. He has the address where he was staying, but he didn't keep his train tickets (which don't have his name anyway), and since he doesn't have a European credit card (he only still has his African bank card), he doesn't have any receipts with his name on it proving he spent money in France. Since I was living in France, he would stay with me at my apartment, or with his friend in Paris.....so we don't have any hotel stubs with our names on it.

Does anyone think this is a problem? We obviously are together in Paris....we have photos where we are clearly at Versailles, and the Eiffel Tower, Louvre, etc....but again, they are not time stamped...so there is no evidence that they were taken in the past 2 years, as the condition states!! It could have been 3 years ago!!

We have tons of letters, emails, msn chat logs, poems, post cards, etc....so a ton of proof of an ongoing relationship. We also have pictures of our rings.

We are just worried about the situation we find ourselves in, with respect to the Unemployment, and evidence that my Fiance was in France at the same time I was. Usually, I think it makes it a lot easier for other couples doing the K1 Visa process, because usually the non-American Fiance is living in their country of origin...so we're not sure what to do, if we should simply proceed with the evidence that we have, or to think of another solution.

Thanks so much for taking the time to read this...any thoughts/suggestions are welcome!

[ginnyb 3]

Hello SunShowers,

I don't know about the employment history requirements, but as for proof of meeting within 2 years, since you are the petitioner, I believe it's you who has to prove that you met, not your fiance.

Others with more experience/knowledge, correct me if I'm wrong in this case.

[Crossed_fingers 128]

I don't have any advice about your second question or how USCIS will view the photographs (although if your passport demonstrates that you were only in France during your teaching assignment, it seems to me that bolsters your claim that the undated photographs in front of French monuments took place within the last 2 years), but I don't think the fact that he is unemployed will matter at all. That is extremely common in many parts of the world and I've never read about it being a problem for any couple. The consulates care a lot more about your ability to sponsor than about the beneficiary's work history!

Good luck. Cute pics!

Edited December 17, 2010 by Crossed_fingers

[Aztec&Taino 144]

Hello everyone - for all of you who have already gone through the K1 Visa application with success, I would appreciate it if you could try and read through my and my fiance's complicated situation....any help would be appreciated!!

Here's the situation:

In September, 2009, I arrived in France on an 8 month work contract to teach English. My contract ended and I Went home on May 29, 2010.

Within the first week of arrival, I met and started a relationship with my (now) fiance, who is from the Ivory Coast - originally. We saw each other quite often while he finished his 3-month stay in France, and then he returned to Italy, where he has his temporary residency. He came back to France in the Spring of 2010, before I returned to the United States.

He was in France on a 3-month vacation visiting friends at the time of our meeting in Paris, as his permanent residency is in Italy - where he has "Humanitarian Stay" (a sort of political asylum status, but with less benefits). He has this because he was forced to leave the Ivory Coast in 2008 after his country's political and social turmoil took a turn for the worse. There had been a full-out war in 2003-2005.

Our first problem is this: we aren't really able to fill out any employer history in Italy, as, due to the language barrier and the economic situation of Italy (one of the highest unemployment for nationals), he has been unemployed since his arrival, living with his cousin. He has been trying to get a job, and it just isn't working...to make matters worse, Italy is also known to be very racist toward blacks.

We will be able to fill in his employment in Africa, as he was employed in Ivory Coast until his departure; he ran his own store. We weren't sure if this would pose a problem - unemployment for nearly 3 years?

Our second problem is this: aside from TONS of photos (which are not time stamped from the camera, even though I've handwritten the dates and places on the back of each one) - my Fiance does not have any primary evidence for his travels in France to prove we met there. He has the address where he was staying, but he didn't keep his train tickets (which don't have his name anyway), and since he doesn't have a European credit card (he only still has his African bank card), he doesn't have any receipts with his name on it proving he spent money in France. Since I was living in France, he would stay with me at my apartment, or with his friend in Paris.....so we don't have any hotel stubs with our names on it.

Does anyone think this is a problem? We obviously are together in Paris....we have photos where we are clearly at Versailles, and the Eiffel Tower, Louvre, etc....but again, they are not time stamped...so there is no evidence that they were taken in the past 2 years, as the condition states!! It could have been 3 years ago!!

We have tons of letters, emails, msn chat logs, poems, post cards, etc....so a ton of proof of an ongoing relationship. We also have pictures of our rings.

We are just worried about the situation we find ourselves in, with respect to the Unemployment, and evidence that my Fiance was in France at the same time I was. Usually, I think it makes it a lot easier for other couples doing the K1 Visa process, because usually the non-American Fiance is living in their country of origin...so we're not sure what to do, if we should simply proceed with the evidence that we have, or to think of another solution.

Thanks so much for taking the time to read this...any thoughts/suggestions are welcome!

Hello!

Welcome to the immigration journey. As far as your fiance's lack of employment, no, it does not matter if he has been unemployed (for whatever reason), but make sure you list the years of unemployment in his Biographical Info sheet, regardless.

Now, as to the second question, this is trickier... A VJ member received a RFE not too long ago because they were in a similar situation. The petitioner and the beneficiary did not meet in the beneficiary's country, and since the beneficiary is in the European Union, there is no record of the fiance entering the country that the petitioner visited. They were going to try to get as much other proof, train and bus tickets, credit card and hotel receipts, etc. Plus, the pictures... You do have a copy of your passport with the entry stamps to France, right? Your fiance must have some sort of documentation that would prove that he has "special" status to live in Italy, but no other proof that he was actually in France? Well, I would say give it your best shot and send in your petition packet, though be aware that you may receive a RFE because pictures are only secondary evidence and cannot be taken into account, on their own, to satisfy the petition requirements. Any chance you might go to Italy, soon? Any chance you can get married there (and file the I-130) or wait until after you go to send in your I-129 F petition?

Best wishes!

[SunShowers87 0]

To answer your question, yes, I myself have plenty of proof that I was in France. I have passport stamps, my work contract, my official address, bank statements, etc.

He, however, doesn't have: train tickets (didn't keep them), phone bills (he had a prepaid French phone, that doesn't have his name connected to it), a passport with a stamp (EU residency doesn't require passport stamping if its on a train), credit card transactions (only has an African bank account).

Here are the solutions I've thought of -

1) Sending in the pictures, with the date clearly marked on the back,w ith the 'obvious locations.'

2) A letter from a friend of mine who lived in my apartemnt building, another American who was teaching English....she will say that she met us/knew us, and that he came and visited me at my apartement. Witness? I know its still not primary evidence, but maybe it would help?

3)A letter from me/him explaining exactly what I wrote in this post??? This situation?? Why he doesn't have any proof that he was in France?? Or should I just leave it be...in case we get an examiner at USCIS that is more easy going...?

Should I not bring attention to this? Or try to be up front by explaning the situation in a letter??

If not...and this seems a bit more far-fetched...I WAS in Italy in April, 2010, with my family. I have the proof, the stamps, and the plane tickets. I was thinking of including one of our pictures in a non-descript location, and simply state that we met briefly in Italy, while I was on the trip with my parents...=/ Granted this isn't exactly correct...but it would eliminate the problem with cross-border, EU proof etc...??

P.S. Thanks for the compliments on our photos:) hehe..

[Robert de Bonda 3]

I would recommend that you mention all trips that you have taken and met him whether in France, Italy or whereever. If the letter from your friend in Paris was in the nature of an affidavit, I would think that that would more likely to be primary evidence. The fact that you were briefly in Italy is more importnant than you think. You have the stamps, he has his papers, there are photos and thi trip itself goes towrds establishing the ongoing nature of your relationship.

As others have said above, the fact that he hasn't worked in 3 years is not a determinant. If that were the case, many of us here on VJ would never get to be with our loved ones.

Good luck!

[Crossed_fingers 128]

I would strongly suggest not to lie about meeting him in Italy.

[SunShowers87 0]

Just one question - what do you mean by 'in the nature of an affadavit?" Does this mean notarized? I was just planning to have her write a letter, than says "I, __name___, hereby state that __my name___ and __my fiance___ met at my apartment, and that we were indeed a couple, etc etc etc...." And then she was going to sign it. Do you think this would be enough?

No, I wasn't going to say we met in Italy. We met in France, and that's what I'm going to say.

However, it would be much easier to prove if we say that we "met up" briefly, for a day, while I was in Florence with my family. That way, I have proof of being in his country of residence, and it would avoid all the hassle.

Edited December 18, 2010 by SunShowers87

[Canadiandggal 49]

Just one question - what do you mean by 'in the nature of an affadavit?" Does this mean notarized? I was just planning to have her write a letter, than says "I, __name___, hereby state that __my name___ and __my fiance___ met at my apartment, and that we were indeed a couple, etc etc etc...." And then she was going to sign it. Do you think this would be enough?

No, I wasn't going to say we met in Italy. We met in France, and that's what I'm going to say.

However, it would be much easier to prove if we say that we "met up" briefly, for a day, while I was in Florence with my family. That way, I have proof of being in his country of residence, and it would avoid all the hassle.

Yes that means notarized..it will definitely help your case

did you met up in italy? IF yes then mention it if not then don't as it would be a fib.

[Kathryn41 3,205]

If you did not meet up when you were briefly in Italy, then don't say it. USCIS takes any form of misrepresentation very seriously - enough to completely deny a petition and make any further petitions unobtainable. It would just take a slip of a tongue from either of you during an interview - or a difference in the stories - or him saying you didn't meet or you met at XXX and you saying you did meet or met at YYY. It just adds an unnecessary and dangerous level of complication. Don't ever lie, fudge the details or stretch the facts to make them 'more convenient'. Believe me - in the long run, they will far less convenient and possibly catastrophic.

Provide a clear letter detailing the circumstances of your meeting in France. Provide copies of your documentation proving the time you were in France. Provide copies of his documentation allowing him to live in Italy and travel to EU countries. Provide photographs of the two of you together in front of a number of different Parisian landmarks or locations that the Consulate staff can recognize. Provide the letters of affidavit (notarized) from friends/family who met with you together. Get a notarized statement from your former landlord or your friend that they met him when he visited you. Get a notarized statement from the friend he stayed with that he was in Paris on such and such dates, showing he was there when you were there.

Definitely address this situation up front - this will be your only chance to satisfy the 2 year meeting requirement. If you do not satisfy it for the petition, the petition will be denied. If you do satisfy it for the petition, then the petition will be forwarded to the Consulate in Italy and the rest of the process will go on from there. The 2 year meeting requirement must be satisfied long before the process ever gets to the Consulate or an interview.

His being unemployed will not matter. Your financial ability to support him, however, will, as you will have to provide him with evidence and documentation as part of the Visa process that you earn at least 125% of the poverty level for a family of 2. If you are not able to meet that income requirement, then you will want to look at betting a co-sponsor who does.

Good luck. (Oh, and include your 'clowining around together' photo that you have included here - it's priceless and while it doesn't show the 2 year requirement, it does actually indicate a 'relationship' :-) )

Edited December 18, 2010 by Kathryn41

[PeruvyandGringa 25]

His being unemployed will not matter. My fiance was not living in his home country and had been unemployed for 6 months by the time his interview came time because of the economy. They only care that the US Citizen (or co-sponsor) is willing and able to provide support, assuming the possibility that they may never find work here once they arrive (regardless if they are employed currently or not).

One thing I don't understand, there is no proof of withdrawls/charges made in France because he has an African bank account? I have a US bank account and I have records I can retrieve from my bank (or print from the computer) showing where each purchase was made. If it is not typically on the statement they provide to him, then the bank would still surely have record of the locations he used it somewhere, the transaction got back to the bank, no?

If you think your proofs are not strong enough, is a quick visit to Italy out of the question? Flights to Europe are much less expensive in the winter

Good Luck

[SunDrop 59]

Just a quick thought, but is there any way you can do a quick trip to Italy, maybe over the holidays? That way you'll just need to provide evidence of that one trip as primary evidence of meeting in person, and you can include all the other fun pics and brief relationship history as supporting evidence. It all gets forwarded to the Embassy, so as long as the petition adjudicator can tick the 'concrete evidence of meeting within 2 years' box, the rest will go to supporting his visa application in Italy.

[pushbrk 12,234]

Just a quick thought, but is there any way you can do a quick trip to Italy, maybe over the holidays? That way you'll just need to provide evidence of that one trip as primary evidence of meeting in person, and you can include all the other fun pics and brief relationship history as supporting evidence. It all gets forwarded to the Embassy, so as long as the petition adjudicator can tick the 'concrete evidence of meeting within 2 years' box, the rest will go to supporting his visa application in Italy.

The bottom line is that you make a quick trip or a pretty high risk of denial a few months down the road, resulting in making the trip anyway. You do NOT have primary evidence of meeting in the past two years. Read here about similar denials and judge the risk for yourself.

http://www.uscis.gov/uscis-ext-templating/uscis/jspoverride/errFrameset.jsp

The page displays in a strange way but you mouse down to D6.

Edited December 18, 2010 by pushbrk

[SunShowers87 0]

So I found a way to display picture properties on Microsoft Picture Manager...they show the date the picture was taken. Some are obviously in Paris, like the one we have at Place de la Concorde, taken on March 27th, 2010.

Do you guys think this will suffice??

[pushbrk 12,234]

So I found a way to display picture properties on Microsoft Picture Manager...they show the date the picture was taken. Some are obviously in Paris, like the one we have at Place de la Concorde, taken on March 27th, 2010.

Do you guys think this will suffice??

I suppose it depends on how you would manage to present that as evidence. Here's an example of how strict USCIS is about the evidence of meeting.

When he filed the petition, the petitioner responded "Yes" to question #18 on the I-129F Petition that

asks whether he and the beneficiary had met in person within the two-year period immediately

preceding the filing of the petition. The petitioner stated that he traveled to Iran in July of 2008 to visit

his family, whereupon he was introduced to the beneficiary. The petitioner stated further that, after

spending some time together, he and the beneficiary decided to marry.

On January 16, 2009, the director issued an RFE, requesting that the petitioner submit additional

information, including, inter alia, evidence that he and the beneficiary had met in person within the

two-year period immediately preceding the filing of the petition or, in the alternative, evidence to

establish why the requirement of an in-person meeting should be waived.

In his February 9, 2009 response to the director's WE, the petitioner submitted additional evidence,

including copies of pages from his U.S. and Iranian passports and an itinerary reflecting a trip to Iran in

July of 2008.

The director denied the nonirnmigrant visa petition because the record contains no evidence that the

petitioner and the beneficiary personally met within the two-year period immediately preceding the

filing of the petition or that the petitioner qualified for a waiver of that requirement.

On appeal, counsel states, in part, that the petitioner has submitted adequate evidence that he traveled to

Iran in July of 2008, during which time he met and became engaged to the beneficiary. Counsel's

supporting documentation includes: letters from the beneficiary and her father pertaining to their

cultural practice of taking photographs of unmarried daughters; and a confirmation of premarital

counseling and medical examination for the petitioner and the beneficiary, dated August 4, 2008, from

Page 4

the Shahid Soltani Health Center of the University of Medical Sciences and Health Services of Fars

Province.

In this case, the petitioner and the beneficiary were required to have met in person between September

15, 2006 and September 15, 2008. The petitioner has submitted evidence of traveling to Iran in July of

2008, which falls within the two-year period immediately preceding the filing of the petition. The

petitioner has also submitted a confirmation of premarital counseling and medical examination for the

petitioner and the beneficiary, dated August 4, 2008, from the Shahid Soltani Health Center of the

University of Medical Sciences and Health Services of Fars Province. Taking into account the totality

of the evidence, the AAO finds that the petitioner has established that he and the beneficiary met

between the September 15,2006 and September 15,2008 timeframe.

A review of the record finds that the petitioner has submitted all of the required documentation, as

described in the instructions to the I-129F petition. Thus, the AAO finds the petitioner to have

overcome the basis for the director's denial of the instant petition. Accordingly, the AAO will sustain

the petitioner's appeal and approve the petition.