Ongoing Evidence of Relationship after filing I-129F?

[mrs_sdp 0]

Hi

My fiance will be filing the I-129F petition as soon as my divorce becomes final in September/October.

We have been together for two years and we have several visits to each other under our belts, but have decided just to wait out the visa time without any further visits to each other. I need this time to finish a college course and to hopefully get a temporary job to help out with the K1 financial implications. My fiance has used his holiday entitlement for this year and so he will be unable to visit.

My question is this ... how do we SHOW an ongoing relationship without visits? We will have the usual YM chat logs, phone bills, cards etc up until my interview ... will this be enough?

Sorry if it's a stupid question, just getting antsy here and thinking about the possible things that could go wrong!

Have a good day ...

[payxibka 10,048]

Hi

My fiance will be filing the I-129F petition as soon as my divorce becomes final in September/October.

We have been together for two years and we have several visits to each other under our belts, but have decided just to wait out the visa time without any further visits to each other. I need this time to finish a college course and to hopefully get a temporary job to help out with the K1 financial implications. My fiance has used his holiday entitlement for this year and so he will be unable to visit.

My question is this ... how do we SHOW an ongoing relationship without visits? We will have the usual YM chat logs, phone bills, cards etc up until my interview ... will this be enough?

Sorry if it's a stupid question, just getting antsy here and thinking about the possible things that could go wrong!

Have a good day ...

You can only provide what you have... If that is how you have maintained your relationship then so be it.

[Devkpaik 1]

Hi

My fiance will be filing the I-129F petition as soon as my divorce becomes final in September/October.

We have been together for two years and we have several visits to each other under our belts, but have decided just to wait out the visa time without any further visits to each other. I need this time to finish a college course and to hopefully get a temporary job to help out with the K1 financial implications. My fiance has used his holiday entitlement for this year and so he will be unable to visit.

My question is this ... how do we SHOW an ongoing relationship without visits? We will have the usual YM chat logs, phone bills, cards etc up until my interview ... will this be enough?

Sorry if it's a stupid question, just getting antsy here and thinking about the possible things that could go wrong!

Have a good day ...

You have already satisfied the requirements of having met within the last two years, and if you visited him and have visas in your passport then this is primary evidence. Secondary evidence is pictures, etc.

You can show an ongoing relationship by using exactly what you have. Though it's not outstanding evidence, it will have to suffice since you two aren't going to be able to visit each other.

[Eric-Pris 1,607]

We will have the usual YM chat logs, phone bills, cards etc up until my interview ... will this be enough?

yes

[TBoneTX 46,941]

Oh, brother (perhaps). Your questions are not stupid -- it's good that you're asking them.

Without your timeline or other information, it's impossible to tell your embassy or consulate, and whether it's known as an easy or tough one from which to get a visa. Regardless, that doesn't matter that much, because easy embassies can become tough overnight, without warning.

You're very fortunate NOT to have filed the I-129f paperwork yet. I suggest getting letters from the school and the employer -- written as officially as possible -- to INCLUDE in the I-129f package, stating the objective reasons why another mutual visit during the visa process is not feasible. Even if your I-129f application is approved in a matter of a couple of months, it will not hurt to have these letters.

There should also likely be a couple of letters from your (OP's) people to explain (very carefully, thoroughly, and convincingly!) how you and your fiance could be "together" for two years even though you were married, and how he could be your "fiance" at all when you were married. I strongly recommend that you find an attorney or a former consular officer (maybe an attorney who WAS a CO -- there are a few) to advise you on the best language to use. Otherwise, I fear that even at the most lenient embassy, any CO would notice this marital situation and question it. If it becomes too strong of a red flag (even before you appear for your interview!), you may not have a snowball's chance... and consular decisions are 99.44% unappealable.

All else being equal, you have a chance at I-129f approval as long as you file AFTER your divorce becomes final. However, you could well be sunk at the embassy level unless you head them off at the pass during the I-129f filing stage... and even then, it's not guaranteed.

Send me a PM for some specific tips, at your option, but please reveal your fiance's country or embassy, at minimum.

Edited August 15, 2008 by TBoneTX

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Hi

My fiance will be filing the I-129F petition as soon as my divorce becomes final in September/October.

We have been together for two years and we have several visits to each other under our belts, but have decided just to wait out the visa time without any further visits to each other. I need this time to finish a college course and to hopefully get a temporary job to help out with the K1 financial implications. My fiance has used his holiday entitlement for this year and so he will be unable to visit.

My question is this ... how do we SHOW an ongoing relationship without visits? We will have the usual YM chat logs, phone bills, cards etc up until my interview ... will this be enough?

Sorry if it's a stupid question, just getting antsy here and thinking about the possible things that could go wrong!

Have a good day ...

If that is how your relationship was handled then just show all the evidence you have. There are no "hard and fast rules". But may I suggest...for the I-129 F you only need to submit evidence of meeting ONE time in person within the last two years. Why spill all the beans at once? Send in your documentation of meeting ONE time with the I-129F and keep the rest for the interview. For our I-129F I sent in copies for ONE of our visits and ONE photo together from that visit. Our petition was approved in 61 days with no RFEs. Even though I visited my fiancee during the process 4 times (and three times before the filing of the petition) I kept all that for the interview. Our visa was approved no questions asked.

Gary

[TBoneTX 46,941]

But may I suggest...for the I-129 F you only need to submit evidence of meeting ONE time in person within the last two years. Why spill all the beans at once? Send in your documentation of meeting ONE time with the I-129F and keep the rest for the interview. For our I-129F I sent in copies for ONE of our visits and ONE photo together from that visit. Our petition was approved in 61 days with no RFEs. Even though I visited my fiancee during the process 4 times (and three times before the filing of the petition) I kept all that for the interview. Our visa was approved no questions asked.

It's great that this poster's interview went swimmingly, but I must strongly disagree with taking a cavalier or casual attitude toward "assuming" what a consular officer will do. With limited evidence in your I-129f package, the CO can decide to grill you mercilessly in the interview (and that's a best-case scenario!), or throw your fiance out of the interview on the assumption of limited-or-no validity of relationship WITHOUT LOOKING AT EVIDENCE BROUGHT TO THE INTERVIEW, or (even worse) deny outright on a 221g -- which is unappealable. The danger is compounded if the foreign fiance(e) interviews poorly or is nervous.

On the other hand, the CO is said to be prohibited (or at least discouraged) from "readjudicating" a petition that has been passed by DHS (USCIS). If information (red flags, other evidence of visits, support letters) are included IN the I-129f submission that DHS SEES, the embassy will have less excuse to refuse issuance of the visa.

Why take the chance? WHY?

Edited August 15, 2008 by TBoneTX

[payxibka 10,048]

But may I suggest...for the I-129 F you only need to submit evidence of meeting ONE time in person within the last two years. Why spill all the beans at once? Send in your documentation of meeting ONE time with the I-129F and keep the rest for the interview. For our I-129F I sent in copies for ONE of our visits and ONE photo together from that visit. Our petition was approved in 61 days with no RFEs. Even though I visited my fiancee during the process 4 times (and three times before the filing of the petition) I kept all that for the interview. Our visa was approved no questions asked.

It's great that this poster's interview went swimmingly, but I must strongly disagree with taking a cavalier or casual attitude toward "assuming" what a consular officer will do. With limited evidence in your I-129f package, the CO can decide to grill you mercilessly in the interview (and that's a best-case scenario!), or throw your fiance out of the interview on the assumption of limited-or-no validity of relationship WITHOUT LOOKING AT EVIDENCE BROUGHT TO THE INTERVIEW, or (even worse) deny outright on a 221g -- which is unappealable. The danger is compounded if the foreign fiance(e) interviews poorly or is nervous.

On the other hand, the CO is said to be prohibited (or at least discouraged) from "readjudicating" a petition that has been passed by DHS (USCIS). If information (red flags, other evidence of visits, support letters) are included IN the I-129f submission that DHS SEES, the embassy will have less excuse to refuse issuance of the visa.

Why take the chance? WHY?

But the prohibition (if you will) of the CO to not readjudicate is to the eligibility of the petitioner to petition and to the beneficiary/applicant to apply for the visa. There is no clear cut evidence that by simply including "relationship evidence" automatically makes this evidence irefutable when it comes to the CO's consideration to approve/refuse the visa. This is a "theory" put forth by a respected immigration attorney and I have yet to see evidence that it is in fact plausible and has been proven consistently successful.

Edited August 15, 2008 by fwaguy

[TBoneTX 46,941]

But the prohibition (if you will) of the CO to not readjudicate is to the eligibility of the petitioner to petition and to the beneficiary/applicant to apply for the visa. There is no clear cut evidence that by simply including "relationship evidence" automatically makes this evidence irefutable when it comes to the CO's consideration to approve/refuse the visa. This is a "theory" put forth by a respected immigration attorney and I have yet to see evidence that it is in fact plausible and has been proven consistently successful.

The point is that problems CAN and DO occur. Consular officers can act how they please, including making assumptions and decisions purely on the basis of what they see in the I-129f package that arrives before the beneficiary shows up for the interview. They can refuse to look at what you have brought TO the interview.

No one cares as much about the success of our personal "visa journeys" as we ourselves do. Even if the "theory" by the RESPECTED IMMIGRATION ATTORNEY is only a theory, it makes sense to be prudent and to maximize our chances to the extent possible. Procuring plausible proof or "consistently successful" outcomes is impossible, because no consular officer is going to say "Had you not included this strong additional proof of relationship in your I-129f submission, I would have refused you the visa." Come on, now!

WHY take a chance?

By NOT taking a chance, whose interest are you serving, and is it more important than YOURS?

How is any of the above "wrong"?

[mrs_sdp 0]

Hi everyone

Thanks for your input.

I have updated my information so that you have the details you need.

TboneTX - I am still LEGALLY married, BUT have not lived with or indeed spoken to the man I already consider MY EX for well over two years.

In Scotland, you can apply for a divorce after the first year of separation and this will be granted if your ex agrees and signs the papers. Because I was the one to leave my ex, he dug his heels in and refused to sign the first year papers so I had to wait ANOTHER year. Divorce can take a long time here unfortunately ...

So you see .. I was never "together" with my (now) fiance WHILE I was living with my ex. I didn't even meet my fiance until a few months after my ex and I separated.

We didn't rush into things and were "together" for a year before getting engaged. Do you still see this as a problem? In all honesty, I just see it as moving on with my life ...

Thanks again .. have a great weekend all ...

[TBoneTX 46,941]

It could be a huge red flag! Please strongly consider including evidence in your I-129f submission that will diminish it as a concern when the consular officer reviews your package before your fiance's interview -- using your explanation above, and with verification from others. Better to prevent fires from starting than to put them out once they erupt. Good luck, and stay in touch!

Edited August 15, 2008 by TBoneTX

[payxibka 10,048]

A petitioner can provide whatever evidence they want and they should be guided accordingly.

The only thing that can be said to be "wrong" is that you have indicated " If information (red flags, other evidence of visits, support letters) are included IN the I-129f submission that DHS SEES, the embassy will have less excuse to refuse issuance of the visa" and there simply is no practical evidence to support this statement that if DHS blesses then DOS must concur.

[mrs_sdp 0]

It could be a huge red flag! Please strongly consider including evidence in your I-129f submission that will diminish it as a concern when the consular officer reviews your package before your fiance's interview -- using your explanation above, and with verification from others. Better to prevent fires from starting than to put them out once they erupt. Good luck, and stay in touch!

Hi again!

Sorry, I'm the alien fiancee and the one waiting for the divorce. My USC fiance is NOT married and hasn't been for the last five years.

Thanks

[TBoneTX 46,941]

If information (red flags, other evidence of visits, support letters) are included IN the I-129f submission that DHS SEES, the embassy will have less excuse to refuse issuance of the visa" and there simply is no practical evidence to support this statement that if DHS blesses then DOS must concur.

There's no practical evidence to refute it, either, so the matter still arises of whether it's better to be potentially safe than potentially sorry.

[payxibka 10,048]

If information (red flags, other evidence of visits, support letters) are included IN the I-129f submission that DHS SEES, the embassy will have less excuse to refuse issuance of the visa" and there simply is no practical evidence to support this statement that if DHS blesses then DOS must concur.

There's no practical evidence to refute it, either, so the matter still arises of whether it's better to be potentially safe than potentially sorry.

So the best thing to do is to attach a supplemental sheet of paper that says... "Upon careful consideration of all evidence submitted and with USCIS approval of the I-129F Petition for Alien Fiance(e), the subsequent application made for a K-1 visa by the beneficiary/applicant is now guaranteed to be issued." Under your theory, how can the CO do anything but approve?

Also, we know for a fact that there are many applicants who have previous visa overstays that have themselves subjected to a re-entry ban. There have been petitions submitted with all the information included. These petitions have been approved. The applicant gets to the interview and they are refused and are required to get a 601 waiver. How is this different? The USCIS had the information and approved the petition anyway... the CO acted upon information that had already be "adjudicated" by the USCIS and refused to issue the visa.

Edited August 15, 2008 by fwaguy