Removing conditions after annulment

[kzo1 0]

Hello,

I recently got separated, after almost 2 years of being married. Now my soon to be ex-wife is applying for annulment on top of divorce.

The base on her petition is because the location where we got married at didn't follow the normal process (we didn't obtain a marriage license days before the wedding).

I know that getting annulment based on fraud could complicate things for me to remove conditions, but in this case the fraud is not against me or us.

I talked to a few immigration lawyers and nobody has seen a similar case before, so I'm wondering if any of you guys had been through anything similar.

[dhlunar 25]

Hello,

I recently got separated, after almost 2 years of being married. Now my soon to be ex-wife is applying for annulment on top of divorce.

The base on her petition is because the location where we got married at didn't follow the normal process (we didn't obtain a marriage license days before the wedding).

I know that getting annulment based on fraud could complicate things for me to remove conditions, but in this case the fraud is not against me or us.

I talked to a few immigration lawyers and nobody has seen a similar case before, so I'm wondering if any of you guys had been through anything similar.

What did you use to show that you were married when you filed for AOS or the CR-1 visa? Or are you saying that the marriage was preformed before the required waiting period, and you still got married and a marriage certificate after the ceremony?

[kzo1 0]

I got a marriage certificate but apparently we needed to do something else before that. I'm not too sure how would it be ok for USCIS but divorce court could consider it fraud, but her lawyer is pretty confident she can get it.

We used a place my friend recommended me, and he got the 10 year GC with no problem. Maybe they don't even have a chance of getting it after all...

[belinda63 2,981]

I would think if the marriage is annulled because you didn't follow proper procedure that would make it as though the marriage never happened.

[Jawaree 717]

Your wife & atty seem confident that an annulment can go through

that means (if so) your marriage was never legal.did U not obtain a marriage

license before tying the knot? I can see a marriage cert. if issued in an authentic

manner at a ceremony getting by USCIS, however with an annulment for

that reason of no license issued, no you are not legally married. You wont be

able to AOS when she pull the rug

[TBoneTX 43,058]

*** Thread moved from Removing Conditions forum to the Effects of Major Changes forum, where related issues are often discussed. ***

[Chris&Angel 5]

What type of Visa and where were you married?

[Elle&Kev 120]

A fraud generally means that one person intentionally lied about something they knew was important to the other person in order to convince the person to marry. The lie must be so serious that if the other person knew the truth, the other person would never have gone through with the marriage. Anyone using this as a reason for annulment must prove the fraud to the judge by "clear and convincing" evidence. However, if the spouse learns about the fraud and continues to willingly live with the other spouse as husband and wife, the marriage cannot be annuled. There is no right or wrong way to prove one of the grounds for an annulment, since each case is different. Ultimately, it will be up to the judge to decide if enough evidence has been presented to support the claim.

If you have not already... I would "Lawyer Up" and quickly and not an immigration lawyer but a divorce lawyer.

******************************************************************************************************************************************************

Assuming you are still in California this is the link and the definition of fraud for California.

• Fraud: Either party got married or registered the domestic partnership as a result of fraud. The fraud must have been about something vital to the relationship that directly affected why the party who was deceived agreed to the marriage or domestic partnership. Some examples are marrying only to get a green card or hiding the inability to have children.

http://www.courts.ca.gov/1037.htm

Edited July 5, 2015 by Elle&Kev

[mallafri76 1,012]

You got your CR-1 visa based on marriage to a USC or LPR. In my opinion, if your marriage is annulled it means the marriage never took place and hence you have no grounds to stand on for adjustment of status.

It must have been a really really bad break-up for your wife to go for annulment rather than divorce. It's like she wants to punish you?! If you can talk to your wife, I would try and convince her to file for a divorce rather than an annulment. As far as I have understood from other posters here on VJ, if you divorce, you can still adjust on your own as long as you can show that the marriage was entered into in good faith.

You say you "didn't follow the normal process (we didn't obtain a marriage license days before the wedding)". What does that mean, you obtained the marriage license after the actual wedding ceremony? California don't have a waiting time, so once you get your marriage license, you can marry straight away.

[onye uwaoma 131]

Hello,

I recently got separated, after almost 2 years of being married. Now my soon to be ex-wife is applying for annulment on top of divorce.

The base on her petition is because the location where we got married at didn't follow the normal process (we didn't obtain a marriage license days before the wedding).

I know that getting annulment based on fraud could complicate things for me to remove conditions, but in this case the fraud is not against me or us.

I talked to a few immigration lawyers and nobody has seen a similar case before, so I'm wondering if any of you guys had been through anything similar.

I'm afraid the fact that you did not follow the proper process could annul the marriage, just like the Obama administration's immigration policy has been stalled for not following one of policy procedures. Besides, there's a difference between law, ethics and morality... Somethings may seem ethically or morally right but are legally wrong and vice versa. It may be needful at this point to get a reputable lawyer who will argue your case to a reasonable conclusion... This type of annulment would definitely decide your further immigration journey if it falls through...

[Villanelle 4,121]

Well the above opinion is a popular one (if the marriage is annulled it means it never took place and you have no grounds for AOS etc etc)

This is a frequent misconception because it sounds logical but USCIS isnt always logical. Annulments are complex issues. The annulment itself does not cause you to be ineligible for benefits. However- the underlying reasons it was granted could cause you to be ineligible.

In most cases they are granted for fraud against the party involved- this can cause you to be ineligible after a review. In your specific situation your spouse is seeking to have it annuled based on failing to follow procedure.

This is very rare. I have read cases where the marriage was found out to be not legitimate (which is what may happen in your case) and YES- the underlying benefits were rescinded because no legitimate marriage- no benefits.

So an annulement canceling the marriage legally because of procedure will cause an impact. You will most likely end up in appeals court fighting it out but from previous cases Ive read (you can search the internet for examples because I dont know of any off hand- these are just things Ive come across through the years) I have recollection of the BIA upholding many times that the underlying marriage had to be legitimately documented.

You wont meet that burden of proof. This is similar to cases where one person was married to another at the time they re-wed making their second marriage invalid and it was a no-go. They get them on 'paperwork technicalities' . IMO thats where youre going to fall if the annulment happens based on that.

--

Like the other posters I am confused as to where you were married that you didnt obtain a license? Sounds very odd.

[onye uwaoma 131]

A fraud generally means that one person intentionally lied about something they knew was important to the other person in order to convince the person to marry. The lie must be so serious that if the other person knew the truth, the other person would never have gone through with the marriage. Anyone using this as a reason for annulment must prove the fraud to the judge by "clear and convincing" evidence. However, if the spouse learns about the fraud and continues to willingly live with the other spouse as husband and wife, the marriage cannot be annuled. There is no right or wrong way to prove one of the grounds for an annulment, since each case is different. Ultimately, it will be up to the judge to decide if enough evidence has been presented to support the claim.

If you have not already... I would "Lawyer Up" and quickly and not an immigration lawyer but a divorce lawyer.

******************************************************************************************************************************************************

Assuming you are still in California this is the link and the definition of fraud for California.

• Fraud: Either party got married or registered the domestic partnership as a result of fraud. The fraud must have been about something vital to the relationship that directly affected why the party who was deceived agreed to the marriage or domestic partnership. Some examples are marrying only to get a green card or hiding the inability to have children.

http://www.courts.ca.gov/1037.htm

Fraud is generally acceptable reason for annulment of marriage. However, there are other instances where fraud may not exist yet annulment could be sought and granted, such grounds as religious or cultural reason, or after a couple had been married and some facts emerge for which they shouldn't have been married together in the first place; such as the discovery that they are related etc etc...

[Elle&Kev 120]

Fraud is generally acceptable reason for annulment of marriage. However, there are other instances where fraud may not exist yet annulment could be sought and granted, such grounds as religious or cultural reason, or after a couple had been married and some facts emerge for which they shouldn't have been married together in the first place; such as the discovery that they are related etc etc...

Actually religious or cultural differences are not grounds for an annulment. A incestuous relationship would be of course, but the OP stated the wife is claiming fraud for her grounds for an annulment. Therefore, the OP needs to be ready to dispute any claims of fraud since that area can be very wide range.

[onye uwaoma 131]

Actually religious or cultural differences are not grounds for an annulment. A incestuous relationship would be of course, but the OP stated the wife is claiming fraud for her grounds for an annulment. Therefore, the OP needs to be ready to dispute any claims of fraud since that area can be very wide range.

I hear you... Try do your research on cultural and religious differences and see why this could work... Phillippines for example would not honor a divorce except it was filed by the foreign spouse. In this regard, annulment is more appropriate if the foreign spouse hesitates. In some religion, divorce is a taboo... Annulment could be well received for those in such religion. Go to court and show cause for annulment and see the outcome...

[onye uwaoma 131]

I would think if the marriage is annulled because you didn't follow proper procedure that would make it as though the marriage never happened.

Likewise...