FormerlyKnownAs

There certainly are some happy endings. You'll get a mixed bag of responses, but just keep in mind that only YOU know what kind of relationship you have with your husband. As long as you're being smart about things and you've made yourself aware of the fact that these things sometime result in the younger man using the older woman, you've done as much as you need to do. It's your relationship, don't let anyone here tell you it's wrong. Educate yourself, be smart and vigilant. That's all you can do. If you're feeling happy and secure about things, don't feel bad reading the horror stories. Those are stories about other people in other situations.
I've come to understand that VJ is incredibly helpful for support from those who've been down a similar road re the visa process, not so much the best place to get support for your relationship. It can be especially brutal for those women who happen to be in relationships with younger MENA men. Some people just can't resist the temptation to tear you down and explain to you in no uncertain terms that you must be a fool. Take it all with a grain of salt.
All the best to you.

There certainly are some happy endings. You'll get a mixed bag of responses, but just keep in mind that only YOU know what kind of relationship you have with your husband. As long as you're being smart about things and you've made yourself aware of the fact that these things sometime result in the younger man using the older woman, you've done as much as you need to do. It's your relationship, don't let anyone here tell you it's wrong. Educate yourself, be smart and vigilant. That's all you can do. If you're feeling happy and secure about things, don't feel bad reading the horror stories. Those are stories about other people in other situations.
I've come to understand that VJ is incredibly helpful for support from those who've been down a similar road re the visa process, not so much the best place to get support for your relationship. It can be especially brutal for those women who happen to be in relationships with younger MENA men. Some people just can't resist the temptation to tear you down and explain to you in no uncertain terms that you must be a fool. Take it all with a grain of salt.
All the best to you.

There certainly are some happy endings. You'll get a mixed bag of responses, but just keep in mind that only YOU know what kind of relationship you have with your husband. As long as you're being smart about things and you've made yourself aware of the fact that these things sometime result in the younger man using the older woman, you've done as much as you need to do. It's your relationship, don't let anyone here tell you it's wrong. Educate yourself, be smart and vigilant. That's all you can do. If you're feeling happy and secure about things, don't feel bad reading the horror stories. Those are stories about other people in other situations.
I've come to understand that VJ is incredibly helpful for support from those who've been down a similar road re the visa process, not so much the best place to get support for your relationship. It can be especially brutal for those women who happen to be in relationships with younger MENA men. Some people just can't resist the temptation to tear you down and explain to you in no uncertain terms that you must be a fool. Take it all with a grain of salt.
All the best to you.

Don't listen to this #######. Being submissive will only make you more miserable. #######!? You don't need to "make him love you again."
Un f*&%%^*(&* believable.

Important Question: What is the household size of the joint sponsor? This will help people give you some actual figures.

If this forum teaches anyone anything - it's to really think about what kinds of personal information to share with the public. It's not really a good idea to divulge every thought, idea, personal conversation, private argument, etc. We all have personal lives and sometimes our lives get crazy or messy or whatever. However, not all of us feel the need to come to a public message board to talk about it in detail. If you're going to share all of this personal stuff you have to be prepared to face whatever reaction others may have whether good or bad. I don't share too much on these boards but it doesn't mean my life is perfect or that I don't have my own personal dramas to deal with from time to time. I just choose not to invite strangers to pick apart my life. I know that the OP and others are new at this and don't yet have their filter. Hopefully they can learn to either toughen up or be more careful with whom they share their personal business with. Also, ask yourself - would my SO, fiance, husband want all these ppl to know what we talk about, argue about, deal with or any other vulnerability? Probably not. I know I'd be pissed if my husband was on a public board discussing our personal business with strangers.

A word of advice here for anyone who doesn't know any better: You can never ask a question in any MENA thread as all the people who are bored here or have their own issues will come here and make it a madhouse and make you out to be the worst person in the world and then go off topic and start fights of their own like some zoo. I usually read and run because I get so disgusted, but I will say something this time and for anyone sane out there in MENA land: please don't ask for any advice in this forum or give any of the crazy ones on here any personal info-they will tear you apart unfairly while thinking themselves perfect!
Just because she asked a naive question does not mean that her relationship is doomed just because her fiance wants custody of his child (right or wrong)! Please. Get a life. There are a few of you who are sane on here, but I have been sadly disappointed reading the MENA forum for years now and it's too bad because I am married to a Muslim too and will never find a sisterhood here, that's for sure. I don't understand why people are so mean and nasty here.

Yes, despite the strong words and opinions that OP's post have inspired...we are all looking for her best interest as well. If not through personal experience, I think we have all at least heard and read enough true horror stories here and else where to be warranted in our concerns. I can't knock meeting online and online relationships and falling madly in love with a man I haven't even met in person...I have been there, it can happen...Al hamdalillah, I got one of the truly good ones....I hope she has as well and we are all overreacting, but I am extremely cautious and worried based on the escalation of her posts...As a wife and someone deeply in love, I would go to the ends of the earth for my husband even walk through hell and back...but we are married and we have proven our relationship and I know with every fiber of my being he would do the same for me without question...she is not even to this point yet and already so consumed with basically how to be a good wife for him..I really hope Melissa, that you have not abandoned this post feeling that we have ganged up on you..if you read everyone's post you will see that is clearly not the intent...most of us have been here for a good while and seen too many things to sit idly by...if you were one of my girlfriends in real life, we would have a girls night out and I would say "honey, what are you thinking?" You said in one of your early posts that you both were in bad marriages when you met and supported one another through the disolution of those...maybe you did truly find your soulmate, but it is also very clear you were both in very vulnerable states so please make 100% certain everything is as it seems there is far too much at stake especially now that the two of you are discussing how to bring his children into the mix...
I do wish you the best and all the strength in the world..(F)no matter what choices you make from here it will not be an easy road. Please don't let this post deter you from seeking help or advice in the future here...this is a great group of people with lots of experience and insight, you just happened to open a very sensitive topic that is going to get lots of heartfelt responses.

OMG OMG OMG OMG
I just got settled in back here in Alex, thought I would hop on and see what's new here with my fellow MENA pals and I read this..........
As Amber so nicely put it, we don't all always agree or share opinions here too often but I think you definitely got an honest overwhelming majority opinion 100on this one..
Melissa, I was so hopeful for you and your "fiance" to get through this whole process and I am still more than willing to help out with any advice pertaining to relationship with and marriage to an Egyptian man as well as immigration proceedings once you arrive at this point, as I am sure many here are as well...however this is one topic that no one can help with nor should you even be looking for help unless as a few others have said there is some legitimate reason the mother should not have custody for the "CHILD'S sake" which clearly does not appear to be the case. I am very sorry for saying this and I truly hope I am being too harsh and wrong, but I am really beginning to question the character of a man, specifically an Egyptian man, who would do such a thing or consider it let alone drag you into it. As others have pointed out, the boy is not even living with him and he is not even in Egypt at this point he works in Saudi and only goes back for short visits during summer break..he doesn't have a daily life with this child at this point, how could any good come out of the two of you tearing him from his mother who has basically been he sole parent and uprooting him to a strange country where he will have no one other than his dad and step brother as far as blood relatives go and ppl to look up to with same culture and background and a foreign step mom whom can't even communicate with him?!?!?!?!:blink:
Sweetie, you seem like a really nice and possibly overly caring woman from your previous posts...to be honest I am quite concerned and worried that your "love" and desire to want to make this man happy will be your undoing. No good Egyptian or good man period, would suggest doing this. I also can't help but notice from all of your previous posts how you are constantly looking for ways that seemingly are to make things easier or more conveinent for your "fiance". If he really wants to be actively involved in their lives more than just via skype and the occasional extended vacations, which by the way the boys mother may or may not even allow since you are talking about sending her child out of the country, the best thing you both could do would be live in Egypt...that is what is in the best interest of the children- this is everything and everyone they have ever known..you guys are the adults, you can adapt and make your own choices- they cannot...In addition to worrying about your "fiance's" feelings and wishes, have you for a moment considered those of the young boy? How will he feel towards you, a stranger, some foreign woman, who aided in helping his father take custody of him then uproot him from what as far as any of us know is a happy home and childhood with a mother whom I am certain he is very attached to and will be extremely loyal to especially if his father were to succeed in doing this...this is a recipe for disaster that you really do not want or need to bring into an already complicated and new relationship/marriage.
My suggestion, stay out of this one and please, please, please get to the core of your "man" and everything he truly stands for and make for certain it is in line with your true values and beliefs. It is easy to fall in love with someone online, especially since you spend so much time talking with them since that is basically all you can do from afar, I venture to say most of us here started that same way. The true test of the relationship lies in what happens in person, not how long you are able to nurture and maintain an online relationship, and only at this point will you get to know the real person you are in love with- by living with them day in and day out, during arguments when neither of you can escape by simply signing out of your computer- right now you are focusing on and thinking about the wrong things, you two first need to sort out a good and proper first official meeting. I strongly urge you not to wait until next summer to do so and marry at that point as you previously indicated. Please take a week and go now, have him meet you in Egypt prior to the school year starting- there is still plenty of time especially since Ramadan falls on August 1, this year- if this is impossible, then by all means get him to agree to meet with you for such a visit over winter break..see how it goes in person and between now and then, then plan your marriage for next summer's visit. I am in Egypt now and work in the education system as well, I am very familiar with the breaks and the fact that there are still plenty of opportunities to have such a visit during the next few months.
I gotta stop now, I feel I will get off topic; this just really got to me on many levels so I had to respond in such a way. Please don't take my response as a personal attack, I really really do wish you the very best.

Wow that's a very brash and insulting comment to make. I was raised Christian and found a lot of unanswered questions and contradictions in Christianity through a lot of research, reading, and talking with clergy. I didn't convert because I "lacked a backbone" I converted because Islam made more sense for me. I think being so self-righteous about your personal decision is pretty unattractive. Would you like us all to give you a round of applause? Certainly there are some people who make choices based on the relationship their in but to just assume that you're better than anyone who has converted without even the inkling of knowledge about their decision is just rude.

Total hypocrisy, and it came in classic covert aggression form:
The callousness here is your attack on the OP. In your attack he is not treated as a human with feelings. He was given zero courtesy. The important thing is to put one's-self in the judgement seat and try to get people on the defensive by manufacturing "crimes" out of ordinary language.
These attacks often begin with a form of denial by the attacker - the "I'm sorry, but..." denial. The attacker denies that they are attacking by starting off this way.
This particular page has a lot of this pretentious uber-policing. The pretense is acting as the hero for the poor abused non-members who are not here, not reading this, but treating the member who is here and who is reading it as if he were a monster.

I'm sure you're very upset with yourself, we all would be if this happened to any of us, but you just need to take a few deep breaths. This journey is so difficult and the process takes a lot out of all of us emotionally, I know to reach the end and then have something like this happen must feel huge right now. It's not. It's really really not. Don't fret anymore over this, pull yourself together and move forward, this is really not a big deal even though it feels earth-shattering right now while you're still in the moment. Accidents happen and the consulate knows this, I am certain you can get your visa replaced. You're going to look back at it one day and get a good laugh, I promise.
You've come so far, just some baby steps to go. Don't let yourself fall apart, your other half needs you!

I'm sure you're very upset with yourself, we all would be if this happened to any of us, but you just need to take a few deep breaths. This journey is so difficult and the process takes a lot out of all of us emotionally, I know to reach the end and then have something like this happen must feel huge right now. It's not. It's really really not. Don't fret anymore over this, pull yourself together and move forward, this is really not a big deal even though it feels earth-shattering right now while you're still in the moment. Accidents happen and the consulate knows this, I am certain you can get your visa replaced. You're going to look back at it one day and get a good laugh, I promise.
You've come so far, just some baby steps to go. Don't let yourself fall apart, your other half needs you!

Hello pot...meet kettle
It may be helpful if you stop projecting the guilt you feel for your inadequacy resulting from your poor choice in a husband onto everyone here. And by the way, I don't get any happy lovey vibes from you. Stop being so bitter, take responsibility for your part in your situation and move on. For your good and for your children.

I don't like the whole concept... You shouldn't get married to an "American" or a "Russian" or whoever...
You get married to the best person for you. Mine happened to be American. I never even liked American guys before I met him. It just happened that the right person for me was born in the States.
But I don't understand marrying or not marrying somebody just cause they belong or don't belong to a certain nation and then bragging about it... And I don't understand assuming that it's harder or easier to find a good wife/husband somewhere. It's all the same. Just because your wives didn't meet any decent men in FSU doesn't mean that they don't exist.
All decent 35+ year old men in FSU are happily married though and have no intentions of leaving their wives and children. And they DON'T use dating websites.

So I read something in a thread today and it raised a question in my mind... Another member mentioned that converting to Islam while knowing your SO is a red flag. I am just wondering, of those of you who have gotten both approvals and denials, how many of you ladies converted to Islam over the course of time you knew your MENA SO? If you don't mind sharing, that is. Thanks all, just very curious about this topic. I'd never have really viewed it as a red flag since I suppose I'm a little more liberal minded about the "freedom of religion" thing in our country.
** I just want to say that I realize this is a sensitive topic and I hope I won't ruffle too many feathers. I would really appreciate VJers biting their fingers and resisting flaming in this thread. I find this a valid topic for discussion in the regional forum since it seems to impact visa approvals for MENA filers. If you have negative feelings regarding any portion of what I'm asking about, please move along. Thank you.

There is one common trait. I see a lot of Asian and RUB women here, but not with the sucker one that brought them to the party.

I guess I should say face to face means living together here or there, where ever there may be a home for their foreign SO's.
It always comes back to my same point, "Only the people in the relationship really know the truth about it." People may have the majority of an online relationship but that doesn't mean it's not a real relationship. People who are living with their SO may also get more of a full picture of who that person is in person and in the relationship but that doesn't make them a relationship expert. The nature of the relationship could be a lie online or even while living together but it is still a relationship in some sense of the word. The relationship could be sunshine, rainbows and kitten online and living together in person too and that's not saying that's a bad thing either if you're an eternal optimist like me. May sunshine, rainbows, lollipops, kittens and all the good things in this world live on forever and breath fresh air into our souls.
"Like attracts like."

Isn't there irony though saying that those who spend the majority of their time in an online relationships with their SO thus far don't really know their SO? By that logic it also negates all their own online relationships, with people for example on VJ, and how they judge them based on online posts with almost absolute certainty that is who that person is because they spend a lot of time reading about them and communicating on the boards with them and others. Sure some meetup regularly with those in their area and get to know a person or a couple but even that could be compared to the communication and time spent face to face with a ones SO.
How can one speculate about the authenticity of another couples relationship spent online with a few visits in person vs face to face, "they're here living together," communication when they are only getting information about it from an person they know from online themselves? Also from what the recent relationship poll indicates the vast majority sharing here are only half the story.
Edited to define face to face.

Not to give the impression that I live in the Land of Oz, because I certainly am aware of the scamming men from both Morocco and Egypt (where my fiance is from), but I wanted to add that Lisamarie brings up a very valid point. I'll explain...
Several years ago I had a somewhat controversial surgery to correct a problem that was keeping me from being able to walk without experiencing extreme pain. When my doctor suggested the surgery, I went to the internet to investigate other people's experiences with the surgery. I was interested in recovery times, etc. What I found was enough to make me have 2nd and 3rd thoughts about going through with the surgery, even though the surgeon was a close friend of my family. So many horror stories of people who never walked again! I mean hundreds of them. And not a single positive one! I did end up going through with it and a year later I was better than new.
Point being... How many people go out to the internet to share their *positive* experiences? I can tell you in the case of this surgery... Not very many! They're all too busy being happy and living their lives happily. There's really no reason for them to post their good stories. So it makes me wonder sometimes how skewed the viewpoint shared across the internet is. Hope that makes sense. Just food for thought!

Agreed. I really enjoy hearing every perspective. I love a good meeting of the minds and expression of opinion. There is absolutely no reason we can't all express our opinions here, it's what forums are best for. What kind of place would this be if only one side could express a viewpoint while the opposing side kept quiet? Kind of hinders the effectiveness of an open forum.
What I don't enjoy are the little drive-by snipings regarding my character (including the implication that I'm in fantasy land, which I find highly insulting) or the character of others. Might I remind everyone reading this post that most of us are strangers to one another. I know many of the "old timers" know each other personally and are "friends" outside this forum, but you don't know me or my situation. You wouldn't know me if you passed me on the street. You can think whatever you want about myself or others on this forum, but I respectfully ask that you think twice before offering up publicly your opinions regarding my choices (unless asked), my candor, or my personal situation (again, unless asked). It serves no purpose except to insult the other person, which really shouldn't be going on in this kind of forum. This goes for everyone here regarding every other member. I'm not nearly as disappointed with the reception I've gotten as I am with the overall treatment of all the members in this regional forum, almost without exception. Calling someone a bitter old woman is just as insulting as calling someone a fantasizing fool.
I would like to stick around here, I happen to think you all have valid opinions which I appreciate. It's really nice to be in the company of others who have been through similar circumstances and come out on the other side, good stories or bad. It would be fantastic if we could just attempt to be ladies about things. (Or maybe I really am a dreamer after all for asking...) Just my two cents' worth.
On another note, I want to thank everyone for their responses in this thread. Reading them has been a real pleasure.

I know I stated yesterday that I was going to drop out of this thread, but I had to respond to this since it addresses me personally... You caught me red handed. I totally made this up.
We take a taxi almost everywhere we go in Cairo. When we do cross the street, it's usually a major street... In the middle of said major street there is a *gasp!* median. Thanks for the input, though. You certainly added a great amount of on topic value to this thread.

Did I not mention that we don't yet live together and that I KNOW things will change when our living arrangements change? I'm not 12 and this isn't my first relationship. Yes, he happens to do everything right now. I don't ask him to nor do I expect it. Not that I should have to explain myself... Thanks for judging, though, and calling my fiance a doormat. It's appreciated.
Maybe some people, not mentioning names, should read all of my posts and consider for a moment that they don't really know me AT ALL before resorting to sniping and back biting. I mean, really... I've not said a thing on this forum to give the impression that I'm going through any sort of "lollipops and rainbows syndrome". And before you repeat that you didn't mention a name, it was *my* post that was quoted, so that would be me that you're talking about. I just asked for a variety of opinions on a specific matter and this turned into senseless mudslinging. I don't get it.
Anyway... No point in wasting my time trying to explain to some of you what is and isn't appropriate behavior toward another human being. The rudeness can continue in my absence, but I'm not going to get in the mud with you. Let me just say before dropping out of my own thread that this group of people seems to be like the cliques in high school and Heaven forbid some new person come to school and try to befriend anyone. I assumed we were all adults with at least one common interest and I guess I assumed also that most of the adults here would treat me as I've treated them, but no such luck. To those of you who have been decent people, thank you. To the rest of you, enjoy your drama.

My hubby has male chromosomes and his mama (whom I adore) raised him well. I know he's got my back, he's clever, cool, kind, a quick learner and funny as all get out. And he cooks for me! He's a keeper. Thank you, God, every blessed day