Applying for 1st Passport Abroad as Naturalized Citizen

[Naey 7]

Hey folks - After years of applications, interviews, and sometimes lengthy, sometimes quick responses to applications, my partner had his oath ceremony last week and is officially a citizen. 

 

Now the tricky part. His father is in poor health, not dying, but in need of familial assistance, and we were set to visit said father for three months in Germany to help set up caregiving services. His flight is on the 15th of July and he received his Naturalization Certificate the day of his ceremony, on the 6th. We've been calling the DoS Passport agency line for urgent travel as early as July 1st and there are 0 appointments nationwide for first time applicants traveling in 14 days. We're calling every day and each day, nothing is open. 

 

He still holds his German citizenship (through a Beibehaltungsbescheinigung for anyone interested) and we have a place to stay in Germany for the time we're there and we're confident he can leave the country on his German passport without any issue given what I've read from other posts here.

 

My question then: Can he apply for his first passport abroad? The embassy website specifically lists a Certificate of Naturalization as one of the "proofs of citizenship" allowed for such applications. But there's a fair bit of mixed information on the "grey zone" of leaving on your other passport and older posts here aren't conclusive about the situation. We would be there long enough for him to receive the passport and can also stay in Germany longer if needed. 

 

Thanks for any insight!

[Crazy Cat 39,604]

"Can he apply for his first passport abroad? "

As a US citizen, he must exit and enter the US with a valid US passport.  Call your Senator's office and request help.  They can find you an emergency appointment. 

Edited July 9, 2023 by Crazy Cat

[Naey 7]

1 minute ago, Crazy Cat said:

As a US citizen, he must exit and enter the US with a valid US passport.  Call your Senator's office and request help.  They can find you an emergency appointment. 

Unfortunately, that's not been our experience re: Senators being helpful. We've been told that there are no appointments available nationwide before the 15th, emergency or no. 

 

Additionally, as other posts on this forum have confirmed, there are a number of freshly minted US citizens who have left the country on another passport; the posts just end without confirming whether they got their passport abroad or came back in through land via Canada or Mexico. Again, the question is if he can apply for his first passport abroad.

 

Thanks though!

 

[milimelo 4,245]

Yes, he can. Make sure you have everything the DS-11 requires (photo, birth certificate, naturalization certificate) and schedule ACS appointment.

Oh and also make sure you can hang around for 4-5 weeks as that's how long it will take to get his passport. 

[Crazy Cat 39,604]

14 minutes ago, milimelo said:

Yes, he can. Make sure you have everything the DS-11 requires (photo, birth certificate, naturalization certificate) and schedule ACS appointment.

How do you get around this:

Dual Nationality (state.gov)

 

Edited July 9, 2023 by Crazy Cat

[Crazy Cat 39,604]

21 minutes ago, Naey said:

We've been told that there are no appointments available nationwide before the 15th, emergency or no. 

By whom were you told that?  I have seen numerous people succeed by contacting their Senator.  Good luck.

Edited July 9, 2023 by Crazy Cat

[Naey 7]

10 minutes ago, Crazy Cat said:

By whom were you told that?  I have seen numerous people succeed by contacting their Senator.  Good luck.

 

By the DoS phone line and whoever took the call at Baldwin's office last week. We'll keep trying there and the DoS Passport call line, but I'm not optimistic anything will change.

 

To your point on bearing a passport. I'd refer to this post:

There are quite a few similar threads like it here, but they either mention an emergency limited use passport or the thread dies without an update. We have time to wait for a full passport but just wonder if they'll even issue one.

 

Thanks again, though!

[Crazy Cat 39,604]

Just now, Naey said:

There are quite a few similar threads like it here, but they either mention an emergency limited use passport or the thread dies without an update. We have time to wait for a full passport but just wonder if they'll even issue one.

 

Thanks again, though!

Please update us when you resolve the issue.  

[VinnyH 59]

On 7/9/2023 at 3:27 PM, Crazy Cat said:

How do you get around this:

Dual Nationality (state.gov)

 

The law is still on the books but it was gutted from the punitive provision making it, in practice, unenforceable, because CBP has no official way to discipline you for not using your U.S. passport to exit and/or (re-)enter the U.S.

 

This is explained and detailed at this page:

https://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2013/05/01/the-history-of-the-requirement-that-u-s-citizens-only-use-u-s-passports-to-enter-the-u-s/
 

Add to that the fact that there is no passport control upon exiting the U.S. (aside from checking the records of the airline's reservation), there is virtually no chance in practice that the person will be caught.

 

Even upon (re-)entering the U.S. territory, there were several reported cases that U.S. citizens were successful to do so without a U.S. passport. You cannot be denied entry because you are a U.S. citizen, so if you come back and present to CBP your Certificate of Naturalization, it is proof enough that you are a U.S. citizen.

 

How do you manage in practice to get to the Point of Entry though?

 

- by land (Canada or Mexico), it's easy, jist show up your Certificate of Naturalization.
 

- by air, boarding the flight is the main issue since you need to show either a visa or an ESTA (depending in your foreign citizenship) before the agent will issue you a boarding pass. It is not unheard that dual citizens somehow manage to get an ESTA (for the sole purpose of being able to board – there was a page on CBP even advising it to), bit as soon as you arrive, identify yourself to the CBP agent as a U.S. citizen.

 

Sure you will be sent to secondary inspection in both cases (land and air), where the CBP will detain you and make hell to you, but they will eventually be obligated to release you into the U.S. after strongly admonishing you and tell you to get a f*cking U.S. passport next time.

 

All that to say that @Naey that she is fine and that her German husband will have absolutely no issue at all to leave the U.S. on his German passport, apply and receive his U.S. passport from the local German Embassy and fly back. He can technically even come back with only his Certificate of Naturalization by flying to Canada & Mexico and attempt to enter by land (easier than by air as explained above).

 

My only question is that: how can he keep his German citizenship after naturalizing? I believe Germany forbids dual citizenship and the new law has gone into effect yet.

[Crazy Cat 39,604]

7 hours ago, VinnyH said:

The law is still on the books

Yes, it is.  I'm out.

[Naey 7]

7 hours ago, VinnyH said:

The law is still on the books but it was gutted from the punitive provision making it, in practice, unenforceable, because CBP has no official way to discipline you for not using your U.S. passport to exit and/or (re-)enter the U.S.

 

This is explained and detailed at this page:

https://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2013/05/01/the-history-of-the-requirement-that-u-s-citizens-only-use-u-s-passports-to-enter-the-u-s/
 

Add to that the fact that there is no passport control upon exiting the U.S. (aside from checking the records of the airline's reservation), there is virtually no chance in practice that the person will be caught.

 

Even upon (re-)entering the U.S. territory, there were several reported cases that U.S. citizens were successful to do so without a U.S. passport. You cannot be denied entry because you are a U.S. citizen, so if you come back and present to CBP your Certificate of Naturalization, it is proof enough that you are a U.S. citizen.

 

How do you manage in practice to get to the Point of Entry though?

 

- by land (Canada or Mexico), it's easy, jist show up your Certificate of Naturalization.
 

- by air, boarding the flight is the main issue since you need to show either a visa or an ESTA (depending in your foreign citizenship) before the agent will issue you a boarding pass. It is not unheard that dual citizens somehow manage to get an ESTA (for the sole purpose of being able to board – there was a page on CBP even advising it to), bit as soon as you arrive, identify yourself to the CBP agent as a U.S. citizen.

 

Sure you will be sent to secondary inspection in both cases (land and air), where the CBP will detain you and make hell to you, but they will eventually be obligated to release you into the U.S. after strongly admonishing you and tell you to get a f*cking U.S. passport next time.

 

All that to say that @Naey that she is fine and that her German husband will have absolutely no issue at all to leave the U.S. on his German passport, apply and receive his U.S. passport from the local German Embassy and fly back. He can technically even come back with only his Certificate of Naturalization by flying to Canada & Mexico and attempt to enter by land (easier than by air as explained above).

 

My only question is that: how can he keep his German citizenship after naturalizing? I believe Germany forbids dual citizenship and the new law has gone into effect yet.

 

Thanks for going into more detail, that makes me optimistic about the trek. This week hasn't seen any movement from DoS or the Senator's office. 

 

To your question, because of his family situation and a couple of employers actively (in writing) saying they can't employ him as a Greencard holder as they only employ citizens, he was able to successfully apply for a Beibehaltungsbescheinigung from Germany to keep his citizenship and take on the American one. It took about 14 months and made the citizenship application complicated as we had to postpone his interview for over a year, which we only managed by letting the case "close" then reopening it. 

[VinnyH 59]

55 minutes ago, Naey said:

 

Thanks for going into more detail, that makes me optimistic about the trek. This week hasn't seen any movement from DoS or the Senator's office. 

 

To your question, because of his family situation and a couple of employers actively (in writing) saying they can't employ him as a Greencard holder as they only employ citizens, he was able to successfully apply for a Beibehaltungsbescheinigung from Germany to keep his citizenship and take on the American one. It took about 14 months and made the citizenship application complicated as we had to postpone his interview for over a year, which we only managed by letting the case "close" then reopening it. 

 

***Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer. Everything I wrote only reflects my personal opinion***

 

Thanks @Naey for the clarification re. the Beibehaltungsbescheinigung, makes sense, and glad he was able to keep his German citizenship! I am myself a U.S.-French dual citizen.

 

I would like to make it very clear that I am not saying that we should not follow the law. I am a law-abiding citizen as far as I am concerned. But like I mentioned, some laws are:

 

- stupid-yet-still-on-the-books (e.g. the Statute 18 U.S.C. § 336 makes it a federal crime to issue "any note, check, memorandum, token, or other obligation for a less sum than $1” in lieu of money.") or just

 

- still-on-the-books-but-not-enforceable-in-practice which is the case for the requirement for a U.S. citizen to exit and re-enter the United States with a U.S. passport. Again, when exiting, because unlike other countries, there is no systematic passport control upon exiting the U.S., the government is not even capable to flagging it (unlike re-entering where there are CBP POE controls).

 

So I am not suggesting that you break the law, on the contrary, you should always be a law-abiding citizen (after all, your partner doesn't want to start his U.S. citizenship by violating a federal statute 😉).

 

Your German/U.S. partner should do his best and exhaust all the options (incl. your Congressmen) he has to get his passport on time before leaving the U.S., but you also have to be practical and use your common sense, especially when an emergency arises and that there is no other solution.

 

Given the current passport applications backlog and the (very real) difficulty to obtain an appointment at a U.S. Passport Agency (even for extreme emergencies), the option of leaving the U.S. on the German passport, apply for the U.S. passport through the Consulate and re-enter the U.S. with it is a reasonable option which should only be considered as a last resort solution. And if you believe the various testimonies on this forum and others, people doing what you suggest happens more than you think...

 

It seems however that some black-or-white mindset people here have a problem with this thinking... 😊

 

Good luck!

[Naey 7]

Hey folks - I wanted to share an update here so that anyone facing a similar problem knows how this worked in our specific case if facing a similar one in the future.

 

My husband was able to leave the country on his German passport, then successfully submit a passport application using form DS-11 with his Naturalization Certificate as proof of citizenship at the US Embassy in Berlin. He'll receive his passport at the German address we're staying at in about three weeks time.

 

As other users advise above, I'd encourage you all not to violate a federal statute, especially not if other options work for you. In our case, our Senator said "Can't help you," and there were no emergency or urgent passport appointments available anywhere in the US, even in Hawai'i before my husband and I needed to be in Germany to take care of his father. Still, if you have no other option, it is an option to leave on one passport and apply for your first full passport abroad as a naturalized citizen.

 

For anyone curious about more detail: The embassy was not thrilled with my husband when he first arrived to his passport application appointment and the first question he was asked was, "So why did you leave the US without a passport? This is not the way to do this." Upon explaining the situation, the case worker gruffly responded that, "Well this isn't a real passport we give you, it's an emergency one-use passport." My husband asked if a real one was possible since he was going to be in Germany taking care of his father for two months and the case worker's mood immediately changed. After that, it was no problem at all and the entire appointment took about ten minutes with a much nicer tone to the conversation. My takeaway is that the case workers do not like having to issue emergency passports to non-passport holders, but are more than willing to issue first passports to citizens outside of the country if they have time to wait for a passport. The case worker quite bluntly acknowledged that the passport situation in the States was absurd.

 

Hope this helps others in the future!

[jxn 86]

4 hours ago, Naey said:

Hey folks - I wanted to share an update here so that anyone facing a similar problem knows how this worked in our specific case if facing a similar one in the future.

 

My husband was able to leave the country on his German passport, then successfully submit a passport application using form DS-11 with his Naturalization Certificate as proof of citizenship at the US Embassy in Berlin. He'll receive his passport at the German address we're staying at in about three weeks time.

 

As other users advise above, I'd encourage you all not to violate a federal statute, especially not if other options work for you. In our case, our Senator said "Can't help you," and there were no emergency or urgent passport appointments available anywhere in the US, even in Hawai'i before my husband and I needed to be in Germany to take care of his father. Still, if you have no other option, it is an option to leave on one passport and apply for your first full passport abroad as a naturalized citizen.

 

For anyone curious about more detail: The embassy was not thrilled with my husband when he first arrived to his passport application appointment and the first question he was asked was, "So why did you leave the US without a passport? This is not the way to do this." Upon explaining the situation, the case worker gruffly responded that, "Well this isn't a real passport we give you, it's an emergency one-use passport." My husband asked if a real one was possible since he was going to be in Germany taking care of his father for two months and the case worker's mood immediately changed. After that, it was no problem at all and the entire appointment took about ten minutes with a much nicer tone to the conversation. My takeaway is that the case workers do not like having to issue emergency passports to non-passport holders, but are more than willing to issue first passports to citizens outside of the country if they have time to wait for a passport. The case worker quite bluntly acknowledged that the passport situation in the States was absurd.

 

Hope this helps others in the future!

Thank you for the detailed information!