France Rejects Far Right

[IAMX 3,055]

 

All the backlash to Trump's immigration policy, honestly for those of you who have never visited France or Belgium and at the moment on a smaller scale my own country. Take a visit and see these ghetto's, these people don't want to integrate and the local police forces struggle to enter. Their wish is to form a smaller country within your own borders and police it themselves with no outside influence. It's easy to say yes to open borders when you have not fully witnessed the destruction that goes with it. 

 

 

It's not even about that for the left. They see Obama stump for Macron, Trump stump for Le Pen, and immediately begin their cheerleading. They have no idea what this means, to the point where they join with the people they generally dislike (global corporate interests), in desperation to search for a victory of any kind, all because Trump won and they're upset. It's too bad those on the left in the US aren't the ones who are going to deal with the repercussions. Plus, they're going to wake up the next morning and Trump will still be their President. 

 

As I said in the other thread (strange two threads of this are going on at once), I'm not too worried about the short term (I already knew Le Pen would lose), as undoubtedly Macron will follow in his predecessors footsteps and only add onto the misery the French people have had to endure with this massive refugee influx. As was the situation with this case, more people will understand Le Pen's philosophies, and all the money in the world those like Macron, Obama, and fellow globalists try to throw at voters to deceive them won't make a difference. 

[Mr&Mrs G. 903]

 

 

I agree with you there is nothing ignorant about wanting to be safe, but that is not the topic at hand here. In the case of the fear mongering being waged by the alt-right in Europe, the case is of ignorance, pure and simple. 

Sorry I have to totally disagree. Living in Europe and regularly holidaying I don't need to read anything to see whats happening. The topic at hand is security, all the current elections across the world are based on security and border protection. Now if your trying to say it something that's made up by the papers and it's just a case of ignorance then you really need a holiday in France to see the reality. 

 

Comparing a Jewish community in France with a Muslim one is just bonkers. Getting a loaf of bread from the local Jewish bakery is no issue, service with a smile, try entering one of the tight knit muslim areas and see how your welcomed. And I am not anti muslim but I am against any race or religion that chooses to set up in my country and refuses to mix. 

[IAMX 3,055]

 

Sorry I have to totally disagree. Living in Europe and regularly holidaying I don't need to read anything to see whats happening. The topic at hand is security, all the current elections across the world are based on security and border protection. Now if your trying to say it something that's made up by the papers and it's just a case of ignorance then you really need a holiday in France to see the reality. 

 

Comparing a Jewish community in France with a Muslim one is just bonkers. Getting a loaf of bread from the local Jewish bakery is no issue, service with a smile, try entering one of the tight knit muslim areas and see how your welcomed. And I am not anti muslim but I am against any race or religion that chooses to set up in my country and refuses to mix. 

The left just are for reckless migration no matter the costs. Look at their beliefs about illegal immigration and refugees in the US.

 

Add onto that their desperation and tantrums over the Trump election. It's comedic but also dangerous. 

[Amica Nostra 4,803]

 

All the backlash to Trump's immigration policy, honestly for those of you who have never visited France or Belgium and at the moment on a smaller scale my own country. Take a visit and see these ghetto's, these people don't want to integrate and the local police forces struggle to enter. Their wish is to form a smaller country within your own borders and police it themselves with no outside influence. It's easy to say yes to open borders when you have not fully witnessed the destruction that goes with it. 

 

 

no one ever won an argument about a the character of a broad class class of people with the terms "you people" or "these people" 

[Mr&Mrs G. 903]

 

no one ever won an argument about a the character of a broad class class of people with the terms "you people" or "these people" 

Maybe poor choice of words buy doesn't change the message.

[CaliCat 3,957]

 

Sorry I have to totally disagree. Living in Europe and regularly holidaying I don't need to read anything to see whats happening. The topic at hand is security, all the current elections across the world are based on security and border protection. Now if your trying to say it something that's made up by the papers and it's just a case of ignorance then you really need a holiday in France to see the reality. 

 

Comparing a Jewish community in France with a Muslim one is just bonkers. Getting a loaf of bread from the local Jewish bakery is no issue, service with a smile, try entering one of the tight knit muslim areas and see how your welcomed. And I am not anti muslim but I am against any race or religion that chooses to set up in my country and refuses to mix. 

 

But predicating that countries should isolate themselves behind closed borders and nationalism only exacerbates that to a global level. You say you're against any race or religion that chooses to set up in your country and refuses to mix, and yet, you speak the language of your British lords and colonialists, and abide by the religion of the King. Further isolating immigrants in ghettos will only increase the divide, which will only help breed more ignorance and resentment.

Of all the things Europe could learn from America, is that inclusion, not segregation, should be the starting point for a nation.

The same rhetoric you use today, was used by the anti-Irish of a hundred years ago, who saw in the Catholic immigrants the same type of scour they saw in other second-class Europeans. Should we then consider doing away with St. Patrick's day, and force the Irish to fully assimilate, or should we turn in into an American celebration, and make it ours?

As an immigrant soon, you will find yourself in the shoes of someone of whom assimilation will be expected. Should you be required to speak American, and drop your accent, and perhaps choose another religion? Think of that. 

[Mr&Mrs G. 903]

2 minutes ago, CaliCat said:

Should we then consider doing away with St. Patrick's day, and force the Irish to fully assimilate, or should we turn in into an American celebration, and make it ours?

 

As odd is this may seem the first St Patrick's Day parade was celebrated in the USA in 1762, so it is already yours. And everyone knows the Irish built America or at least it's what we tell ourselves.

 

The immigrants choose to isolate themselves that's my issue. I wish they would just get involved instead of always hankering back to whats going on in the middle east and bringing the violence from there to other countries. When I move to the US I fully expect to assimilate instead of going to look for a whole neighborhood of Irish. At the moment I am not aware of any ghetto type areas in the US with immigrants from the middle east but why should they act any differently in the USA than they have done in Europe.

 

Be careful what you wish for.  

[Amica Nostra 4,803]

29 minutes ago, CaliCat said:

 

But predicating that countries should isolate themselves behind closed borders and nationalism only exacerbates that to a global level. You say you're against any race or religion that chooses to set up in your country and refuses to mix, and yet, you speak the language of your British lords and colonialists, and abide by the religion of the King. Further isolating immigrants in ghettos will only increase the divide, which will only help breed more ignorance and resentment.

Of all the things Europe could learn from America, is that inclusion, not segregation, should be the starting point for a nation.

The same rhetoric you use today, was used by the anti-Irish of a hundred years ago, who saw in the Catholic immigrants the same type of scour they saw in other second-class Europeans. Should we then consider doing away with St. Patrick's day, and force the Irish to fully assimilate, or should we turn in into an American celebration, and make it ours?

As an immigrant soon, you will find yourself in the shoes of someone of whom assimilation will be expected. Should you be required to speak American, and drop your accent, and perhaps choose another religion? Think of that. 

please don't ask him to drop the Irish accent...it is a major asset

[Jacque67 7,328]

Vive la France!!! 

 

The idiot who started #Macronleaks, aside for being very insecure about his masculinity, can't even read French, and leaked a document claiming it was Macron's life insurance -it was campaign refund insurance. The very self-same idiot, makes a living out of smearing Trump protestors as anarchists. He's a pet project of Roger Stone's. 

 

Well done France!!!

[CaliCat 3,957]

41 minutes ago, Mr&Mrs G. said:

As odd is this may seem the first St Patrick's Day parade was celebrated in the USA in 1762, so it is already yours. And everyone knows the Irish built America or at least it's what we tell ourselves.

 

The immigrants choose to isolate themselves that's my issue. I wish they would just get involved instead of always hankering back to whats going on in the middle east and bringing the violence from there to other countries. When I move to the US I fully expect to assimilate instead of going to look for a whole neighborhood of Irish. At the moment I am not aware of any ghetto type areas in the US with immigrants from the middle east but why should they act any differently in the USA than they have done in Europe.

 

Be careful what you wish for.  

 

You make two highly contestable claims, for which I am sure you can't offer evidence or any support.

 

1. The Irish didn't build America, or at least they didn't do it alone. We ALL built and continue to build America. Before the Irish, there were the slaves who made it possible that the riches of the land converted into wealth. Before the slaves, there were those who came here on ships with nothing but a dream, fleeing religious and political persecution in their own countries, not very differently from what the alt-right is proposing today. Add to that the native Americans who by any standard had already built their countries, before they were taken by the immigrants. And then there are the Asians and Europeans who flocked to our shores, not to mention the western Americans who found themselves in a new country as a border was built between what was once Mexico and then became America. Everyone built America. For better or worse, we continue to do so today.

 

2. The immigrants chose to isolate themselves. That is a fallacy that has no supporting evidence. What we do know is that racism in certain western European countries is all but statutory, so many immigrants found themselves in a situation of isolation in their new country, but that situation was imposed on them by the open class system in Britain, and the less-open class system in France. That is the lesson Europe must learn from America: immigration means getting to know people who are different and understanding that they are no worse because their skin is brown, black, or ashen, and whiteness makes no one superior or better.

 

3. What makes immigrants to America different? That we're all from somewhere else. Nobody here but the native Americans can claim the land or the ideals. All of us come from somewhere else, and our ideals are the result of an amalgamation of experiences. We're Americans first, and then we have religion, political affiliation, sports preferences, etc.  That is what Europe needs to learn from the American experiment. 

 

Both your claims show a deeper underlying assumption, that there really is "us" and "them." That is something that we must not let disappear from America. Here everyone becomes "us," and everyone is joined by one common goal.

 

Ask yourself, what you will have to do to fully assimilate into becoming and being an American once you land on these shores. Will you isolate yourself as an immigrant and be one of them, or will you renounce all that which you know and become one of us. Or perhaps, the ideal answer is to be somewhere in between?

 

 

 

Edited May 7, 2017 by CaliCat

[CaliCat 3,957]

24 minutes ago, ccneat said:

please don't ask him to drop the Irish accent...it is a major asset

 

I find it very musical and pleasant, personally. 

[IAMX 3,055]

Immigrants choose to isolate themselves because of da evil rassists. I wonder if the left really believes this "everyone I oppose are racists" tactic still works in 2017.. or if they understand that they've beat this horse so beyond dead it has no effect outside their own circles. 

 

People elect not to assimilate, it has nothing whatsoever in 21st century western civilization to do with racism. I really do hope the left keep this up because all this tactic stands to do is alienate moderate leftists as well as moderates and independents in general.

Edited May 7, 2017 by IAMX

[Mr&Mrs G. 903]

26 minutes ago, ccneat said:

please don't ask him to drop the Irish accent...it is a major asset

You can have everything else but the accent stays 

[OriZ 3,165]

1 hour ago, Mr&Mrs G. said:

Sorry I have to totally disagree. Living in Europe and regularly holidaying I don't need to read anything to see whats happening. The topic at hand is security, all the current elections across the world are based on security and border protection. Now if your trying to say it something that's made up by the papers and it's just a case of ignorance then you really need a holiday in France to see the reality. 

 

Comparing a Jewish community in France with a Muslim one is just bonkers. Getting a loaf of bread from the local Jewish bakery is no issue, service with a smile, try entering one of the tight knit muslim areas and see how your welcomed. And I am not anti muslim but I am against any race or religion that chooses to set up in my country and refuses to mix. 

I've been to Europe when things weren't even this bad yet(last time I was there was Provence in 2009) and I agree with you 100%.

[Mr&Mrs G. 903]

4 minutes ago, CaliCat said:

2. The immigrants chose to isolate themselves. That is a fallacy that has no supporting evidence. What we do know is that racism in certain western European countries is all but statutory, so many immigrants found themselves in a situation of isolation in their new country, but that situation was imposed on them by the open class system in Britain, and the less-open class system in France. That is the lesson Europe must learn from America: immigration means getting to know people who are different and understanding that they are no worse because their skin is brown, black, or ashen, and whiteness makes no one superior or better.

 

 

 

 

 

!. Is a joke about the Irish building America and honestly I was not expecting to have to defend it. It's more to do with the amount of builders who emigrated and left us with very little at home.

 

2. I wish it was as you describe and it's just us bad Europeans putting the immigrants from the middle east in ghetto's. But unfortunately that's not the way it is in real life. If I want to talk about a segment of people how do I describe them without using a "them" type word without you taking it as if I am a racist. Ireland is a very free country with no restrictions whatsoever but yet "they" choose to segregate themselves from the rest of the community. No one has to lose their national identity when they emigrate but you should assimilate, it's not a bad word. Why move to another country if you have no wish to embrace the culture and the people. 

 

I will say it again, what you have crossing your southern border is not the same as we have coming in to the EU.