Help with Adoption of Adult Needing Citizenship

[mdanner423 9]

OP

Do whatever you think is best for your family. Please understand that everyone here is giving their best faith opinion. Some people back it up with resources, some just back it up with insults.

You are just as valuable as a person being a new member as I am and as any human is. Just because he's been here longer doesn't make him special. He's just a bully.

I hope everything works out for the best for you! I'm sure it will! If you have the money of course a lawyers advice is a great idea. Some people don't have that kind of cash so do their own research and decide what's best.

Good luck!

Thanks for the advice. This forum seems to have some bullies who go off giving advice with no resources. It's not a good community, I'm asking my account to be closed!

Thanks!

Edited July 13, 2016 by Ryan H
Reason for edit: to remove quote of removed post

[squareleg 69]

FAFSA does not ask anything about citizenship. Ask me how I know? I currently have 2 children in college.

I was not eligible for FAFSA as a foreign student on F1. It does ask for citizenship status.

Not certain, how you are able to get two children in college thru FAFSA circumventing this important requirement. As stated before, falsifying citizenship status can have consequences. You may want to exercise caution.

[TBoneTX 47,141]

A harassing post has been removed, along with a quote of it.

The harasser has closed his account. Please return to a higher level of discourse.

VJ Moderation

[TBoneTX 47,141]

Another post has been removed. Return to civilized discourse or risk administrative action.

[jan22 3,154]

There is a lot of extraneous information/suggestions in this thread that have made it, I'm sure, somewhat overwhelming for the original poster (OP). The OP should not be distracted by the talk of false claims to US citizenship or DACA -- really has no application here. False claims are an issue when one knows they are not a US citizen but claims a benefit for which one needs to be a US citizen. Has no applicability when applying for documentation of what you reasonably believe is your claim to US citizenship, even if it turns out you were wrong. (If it did, everyone who filed for a CRBA that ended up being denied would be found to have made a false claim to US citizenship and suffer the consequences -- doesn't happen.) It also has nothing to do with DACA -- she was not brought into the country illegally as a minor. I have no knowledge of FAFSA, but it also has nothing to do with the OP's question, so I'll avoid that rabbit hole!

The most important piece of information -- you found the adoption certificate from the first family...hooray! The reason it does not definitively say she is a US citizen is because a state court cannot adjudicate US citizenship -- only USCIS and/or the State Department can do that. So, all the state court can do is what they did here -- remind the adopting parents that she should be a US ciziten as a reminder, IMO, that it should be checked out. The great news for your daughter is that it appears she did, in fact, become a US citizen after the adoption was finalized because she met all of the requirements of the Child Citizenship Act of 2000 -- 1) she was under the age of 18; 2) she had been admitted into the US as a Legal Permanent Resident for purposes of an adoption (and the adoption was finalized); and, 3) she was in the custody of her US citizen parent. Someone might question her meeting number 3, but legally she was likely still considered to be in their custody or the final adoption decree would not have been issued. Most importantly, both USCIS and the State Department (passport agencies) are generous in their interpretation of this requirement; they do not want children to become essentially stateless.

If you are in a hurry because of the need to document her for college, I would apply directly for a US passport. I would submit her home country birth certificaate (with a translation, if it is not in English), a copy of her green card (and home country passport with the immigrant visa, if you have it), a certified copy of the first adopton decree, and a certified copy of your adoption decree (to document her name change, as I'm sure you want the passport to be in the correct surname). You need to be sure and list her birth name and her first adoption name in the area asking for other names used. That will tie all of her records together. You can, of course, apply for a certificate of citizenship also, but it will likely take a lot longer.

Finally, I wish you the best in this process. I am thankful that there are people like you who would go to this length to help a child whom others had not appreciated.

Edited July 13, 2016 by jan22

[EM_Vandaveer 2,427]

There is a lot of extraneous information/suggestions in this thread that have made it, I'm sure, somewhat overwhelming for the original poster (OP). The OP should not be distracted by the talk of false claims to US citizenship or DACA -- really has no application here. False claims are an issue when one knows they are not a US citizen but claims a benefit for which one needs to be a US citizen. HAs no applicability when applying for documentation of what you reasonably believe is your claim to US citizenship, even if it turns out you were wrong. (If it did, everyone who filed for a CRBA that ended up being denied would be found to have made a false claim to US citizenship and suffer the consequences -- doesn't happen.) It also has nothing to do with DACA -- she was not brought into the country illegally as a minor.

The most important piece of information -- you found the adoption certificate from the first family...hooray! The reason it does not definitively say she is a US citizen is because a state court cannot adjudicate US citizenship -- only a USCIS and/or the State Department can do that. So, all the state court can do is what they did here -- remind the adopting parents that she should be a US ciziten as a reminder, IMO, that it should be checked out. The great news for your daughter is that it appears she did, in fact, become a US citizen after the adoption was finalized because she met all of the requirements of the Child Citizenship Act of 2000 -- 1) she was under the age of 18; 2) she had been admitted into the US as a Legal Permanent Resident; and, 3) she was in the custody of her US citizen parent. Someone might question her meeting number 3, but legally she was likely to still be considered in their custody or the final adoption decree would not have been issued. Most importantly, both USCIS and the State Department (passport agencies) are generous in their interpretation of this requirement; they do not want children to become essentially stateless.

If you are in a hurry because of the need to document her for college, I would apply directly for a US passport. I would submit her home country birth certificaate (with a translation, if it is not in English), a copy of her green card, a certified copy of the first adopton decree, and a certified copy of your adoption decree (to document her name change, as I'm sure you want the passport to be in the correct surname). You need to be sure and list her birth name and her first adoption name in the area asking for other names used. That will tie all of her records together. You can, of course, apply for a certificate of citizenship also, but it will likely take a lot longer.

Finally, I wish you the best in this process. I am thankful that there are people like you who would go to this length to help a child who others had not appreciated.

That's the thing she was NOT in the custody of those first set of adoptive parents at the time, she was in the custody of her (now) parents, the second set of adoptive parents, so it is far from clear if she met the requirements of CCA.

Also I don't understand your point about CRBA and the possibility of false claim of US citizenship.

Obviously an infant is not going to be found to have made any false claim, but that does not mean that claiming US citizenship falsely is OK. In this case it is simply unclear if the young lady is a citizen.

I definitely would recommend consulting a competent immigration attorney, or if that's cost prohibitive, I'd at least start with filing an N-400 as that does not involve any claim to US citizenship (quite the opposite). If it's denied on the basis that she is already a USC, then at least it's black-and-white on USCIS letterhead and passport and/or N-600 filing is not risky anymore.

Edited July 13, 2016 by EM_Vandaveer

[jan22 3,154]

That's the thing she was NOT in the custody of those first set of adoptive parents at the time, she was in the custody of her (now) parents, the second set of adoptive parents, so it is far from clear if she met the requirements of CCA.

Actually I don't believe that either of us know that for sure; the OP did not say when/if they were given legal custody of her, unless I missed it. The state court would have considered her in the first parents' custody or they wouldn't have granted the adoption to them -- the adoption confirmed they were her legal parents. The federal government is not going to question that. Children live with someone other than their parents all the time without their being a legal change of custody.

[jan22 3,154]

That's the thing she was NOT in the custody of those first set of adoptive parents at the time, she was in the custody of her (now) parents, the second set of adoptive parents, so it is far from clear if she met the requirements of CCA.

Also I don't understand your point about CRBA and the possibility of false claim of US citizenship.

Obviously an infant is not going to be found to have made any false claim, but that does not mean that claiming US citizenship falsely is OK. In this case it is simply unclear if the young lady is a citizen.

I definitely would recommend consulting a competent immigration attorney, or if that's cost prohibitive, I'd at least start with filing an N-400 as that does not involve any claim to US citizenship (quite the opposite). If it's denied on the basis that she is already a USC, then at least it's black-and-white on USCIS letterhead and passport and/or N-600 filing is not risky anymore.

OK, if you don't like the CRBA analogy (and not all CRBAs are applied for on behalf of an infant, some are filed for 16-to-18-year-old children who can be found to have made a false claim to citizenship), take the same case to the adult level, i.e., an adult who believes they received derivative citizenship from their US citizen parent but they never got a CRBA prior to the age of 18. They, therefore, apply directly for a passport, believing that they have met the requirements for citizenship. Even if they don't (e.g., because the parent did not actually meet the transmission requirements), they are not accused of falsely claiming US citizenship. The passport is merely denied and they are told to pursue other means of legally entering the US.

[EM_Vandaveer 2,427]

OK, if you don't like the CRBA analogy (and not all CRBAs are applied for on behalf of an infant, some are filed for 16-to-18-year-old children who can be found to have made a false claim to citizenship), take the same case to the adult level, i.e., an adult who believes they received derivative citizenship from their US citizen parent but they never got a CRBA prior to the age of 18. They, therefore, apply directly for a passport, believing that they have met the requirements for citizenship. Even if they don't (e.g., because the parent did not actually meet the transmission requirements), they are not accused of falsely claiming US citizenship. The passport is merely denied and they are told to pursue other means of legally entering the US.

That's all good but in this case the young lady in question does not know if she's a citizen or not. I realize that mistakenly thinking that one is a USC and claiming that is not false claim, but if you don't know to begin with?

[Penguin_ie 5,999]

That's all good but in this case the young lady in question does not know if she's a citizen or not. I realize that mistakenly thinking that one is a USC and claiming that is not false claim, but if you don't know to begin with?

I think considering the text quoted on her adoption papers, and what jan22 said (he used to be a CO, so is an expert in CRBA and visa/ citizenship issues), she can reasonably assume she is one.

[Villanelle 4,123]

I agree that jan is always on the money with what they post. Im just a bit confused because you stated she was IR4

• IR-3 visa: Issued when a full and final adoption is completed abroad:
  • Requires that the parent (if unmarried), or at least one parent (if married) physically see the child prior to or during the adoption proceedings.
• IR-4 visa: Issued to a child that:
  • is coming to the United States to be adopted.
  • was adopted abroad by only one parent (if married).
  • was not seen by the parent(s) prior to or during the adoption.

  Child Citizenship

  For more information on the Child Citizenship Act see the Child Citizenship Act Information Fact Sheet.

  Children with IR-4 and IH-4 visas:

  • do not acquire automatic citizenship upon entry to the U.S., but instead become Permanent Residents.
  • will automatically receive a permanent resident card (green card).
  • will automatically acquire citizenship on the date of their adoption in United States if the adoption occurs before the child’s 18th birthday.

So I 100% agree, if they found the adoption paperwork showing it was completed at age 13 and it was an IR4 then she should be a citizen. Id also like to post the following supporting what Jan said

Exceptions to a Finding of False Claims to U.S. Citizenship

The Child Citizenship Act of 2000 changed the rules on who may acquire or derive U.S. citizenship from their parents. While many people benefited from this legislation, some mistakenly assumed that they are U.S. citizens. To deal with this problem, Congress included an exception in the Act preventing deportation of children who make false claims to citizenship under the following circumstances:

1) the child’s parents were U.S. citizens by birth or naturalization

2) the child made the false claim when he or she was under age 18

3) the child was a U.S. permanent resident prior to age 16, and

4) the child reasonably believed, when making the false claim to citizenship, that he or she actually was a U.S. citizen.

[EM_Vandaveer 2,427]

You guys make good points.

Personally, I'm 99% sure that she is in fact a USC, but if I was in that situation, I'd probably either consult a lawyer or file a N-400, just to be super cautious.

That said, filing N-600 and/or filing for a US passport directly are reasonable options.

Sidenote: I'd be 100% sure she is a USC if she was living with those parents at the time of adoption when she was 13. The fact that she was living with her (now) parents and that other couple was finalizing her adoption causing her (now) parents to also have to (adult) adopt her just makes it sound complicated. When did the first set of parents give up their parental rights? Does it even matter?

Also if there WAS a case of false claim now, the exception would not apply as she is older than 18 now. But like I said, most likely she is a USC.

Edited July 14, 2016 by EM_Vandaveer

[Villanelle 4,123]

Well I find this to be an interesting thread. Ive discussed it with some other people I know and heres what we got.

Submitting a 600 or passport application IS a claim to citizenship. Basically when you sign its stating you are a citizen. If you are not this is considered a false claim. I do agree with jan though that in this case because of the confusion it wouldnt end up with deportation. It may end up in court but there are various relief methods available.

Filing an n400 and getting rejected is no big deal. Theres no penalty for asking to be a citizen when you are one. It was also brought up the idea of perhaps going to infopass and seeing if they have any idea. Perhaps getting a 551 stamp? Or rather asking if the girl is eligible for a stamp or not because it says in their systems shes a citizen. Remember the n600 and the passport are not 'obtaining' citizenship rather obtaining proof. The n400 is to apply for and obtain citizenship. So logically speaking when you submit for proof they should check the database. An infopass officer may be able to shed some light on the situation. There is also going to the congressman for assistance.

There have also been many reports of people who were entitled to a 600(certificate) applying for one and being told they dont qualify- even some who had already applied for and gotten a passport. So it seems to be better to go for the passport then the certificate. The passport is more useful anyway.The United States Supreme Court has held that the only conclusive evidence of US citizenship is a valid, unexpired US passport. If the USCIS challenges someone's claim to citizenship, they must go to the State Department and make a case for revocation of the passport. Any such revocation can be challenged in federal court. Also worthy to note there are no reports of someone honestly submitting the 600 and being denied and sent to removal. The only cases appear to be those in which false documents were presented.

But anyway for the n-600:

Automatic Acquisition of Citizenship after Birth (INA 320) Form N600. Any info already in the childs file because of the IR4 does not need to be submitted again. With out listing everything the relevant parts for the OP are:

1 Documentation of legal custody in the case of divorce, legal separation, or adoption.​

2 Copy of the full, final adoption decree, if applicable:​

​

•For an adopted child (not orphans or Hague Convention adoptees), evidence that the adoption took place before the age of 16 (or 18, as appropriate) and that the adoptive parent(s) had custody of, and lived with, the child for at least two years.​ [14] ((so this is NA)

​

•For an adopted orphan, a copy of notice of approval of the orphan petition and supporting documentation for such petition (except the home study) or evidence that the child has been admitted for lawful permanent residence in the United States with the immigrant classification of IR-3 (Orphan adopted abroad by a U.S. citizen) or IR-4 (Orphan to be adopted by a U.S. citizen).​ [15]If admitted as an IR-4 because there was no adoption abroad, the parent(s) must have completed the adoption in the United States. If admitted as an IR-4 because the parent(s) obtained the foreign adoption without having seen the child, the parent(s) must establish that they have either “readopted” the child or obtained recognition of the foreign adoption in the State of residence (this requirement can be waived if there is a statute or precedent decision that clearly shows that the foreign adoption is recognized in the State of residence). See ​8 CFR 320.1​.​

​

•For a Hague Convention adoptee, a copy of the notice of approval of Convention adoptee petition and its supporting documentation, or evidence that the child has been admitted for lawful permanent residence in the United States with the immigrant classification of IH-3 (Hague Convention Orphan adopted abroad by a U.S. citizen) or IH-4 (Hague Convention Orphan to be adopted by a U.S. citizen).​ [16] (this is NA)

For number 1- Legal custody refers to the responsibility for and authority over a child.

(1) For the purpose of the CCA, the Service will presume that a U.S. citizen parent has legal custody of a child, and will recognize that U.S. citizen parent as having lawful authority over the child, absent evidence to the contrary, in the case of:

(i) A biological child who currently resides with both natural parents (who are married to each other, living in marital union, and not separated),

(ii) A biological child who currently resides with a surviving natural parent (if the other parent is deceased), or

(iii) In the case of a biological child born out of wedlock who has been legitimated and currently resides with the natural parent.

(2) In the case of an adopted child, a determination that a U.S. citizen parent has legal custody will be based on the existence of a final adoption decree. In the case of a child of divorced or legally separated parents, the Service will find a U.S. citizen parent to have legal custody of a child, for the purpose of the CCA, where there has been an award of primary care, control, and maintenance of a minor child to a parent by a court of law or other appropriate government entity pursuant to the laws of th e state or country of residence. The Service will consider a U.S. citizen parent who has been awarded "joint custody," to have legal custody of a child. There may be other factual circumstances under which the Service will find the U.S. citizen parent to have legal custody for purposes of the CCA.

So as jan said they are lax in proof, even goes so far as to say based on the adoption

Adopted child means a person who has been adopted as defined above and who meets the requirements of section 101(b)(1)(E), or (G) of the Act. (believe she is under F)

17a/ a child, under the age of sixteen at the time a petition is filed in his behalf to accord a classification as an immediate relative under section 201(b) , who is an orphan because of the death or disappearance of, abandonment or desertion by, or separation or loss from, both parents, or for whom the sole or surviving parent is incapable of providing the proper care and has in writing irrevocably released the child for emigration and adoption; who has been adopted abroad by a United States citizen and spouse jointly, or by an unmarried United States citizen who is at least 25 years of age, at least 1 of whom personally saw and observed the child before or during the adoption proceedings; or who is coming to the United States for adoption by a United States citizen and spouse jointly, or by an unmarried United States citizen at least twenty-five years of age, who have or has complied with the preadoption requirements, if any, of the child's proposed residence: Provided, That the Attorney General is satisfied that proper care will be furnished the child if admitted to the United States: Provided further, That no natural parent or prior adoptive parent of any such child sha ll thereafter, by virtue of such parentage, be accorded any right, privilege, or status under this Act;

Remember the girl is IR4- orphan non hauge. I dont know why she was classified as that. The IR-4 Visa is issued when neither parent or only one parent traveled to the country and observed the child prior to the completion of the adoption. If both parents traveled but it post the Adoption Decree, you will not receive an IR-3 Visa, you will receive an IR-4 Visa. If the Order or Decree from the foreign Court was not an Adoption Decree/Order, you will receive the IR-4 Visa. In some countries, a family receives a Custody or Guardianship Order for the purpose of adoption and the adoption is later finalized in the U.S. In these situations the child will receive an IR-4 Visa. Did one parent travel or none? It honestly doesnt really matter because thats what was issued.

IR-4 visas are issued to children for whom a full and final adoption will be completed in the United States. This classification is used when a foreign country only permits prospective adoptive parents to obtain guardianship of a child, rather than allowing a full and final adoption; and/or the prospective adoptive parent(s) have not seen and observed the child prior to the adoption process. Orphans admitted to the United States on IR-4 visas become lawful permanent residents and are automatically processed to receive an Alien Registration Card ("green card").

This is where the complication comes in. The definition of 'child' to the USCIS is over a page long lol. One definition of child applies to approval of visa petitions, issuance of visas, and similar issues. The other definition of child applies to citizenship and naturalization. So for citizenship:

​the genetic, legitimated or adopted son or daughter of a U.S. citizen;

An adopted child means that the child has been adopted through a full, final, and complete adoption.

A child is an adopted son or daughter of his or her U.S. citizen parent if the following conditions are met:​

•The child is adopted in the ​United States​ or abroad;​

•The child is adopted before he or she reaches 16 years of age (except for certain cases where the child may be adopted before reaching 18 years of age);​ and​

•The child is in the legal custody of the adopting parent or parents at the time of the adoption.​

In order to be an 'orphan'

In general, the definition for adopted children applies to adopted orphans. USCIS, however, does not consider an orphan adopted if any of the following conditions apply:​

​

•The foreign adoption was not full and final;​

​

•The foreign adoption was defective; or​

​

•An unmarried U.S. citizen parent or a U.S. citizen parent and spouse jointly did not see and observe the child in person prior to or during the foreign adoption proceedings.​ [22]

​

If the orphan is not considered adopted:​

​

•The child must be must be readopted in the United States; or​
​

•The child must be adopted while under 16 years of age and must have been residing in the legal custody of the adopting parent or parents for at least two years.​ [23]

​

In all cases, the condition that the child must have been residing in the legal custody of the adopting parent or parents is not required if the child has been battered or subject to extreme cruelty by the adopting parent or by a family member of the adopting parent residing in the same household.​

So taking note of the "or" Im not sure the 2 year requirement is needed. That seems to apply to "E" She is "F" is she not?

[newacct 688]

Submitting a 600 or passport application IS a claim to citizenship. Basically when you sign its stating you are a citizen. If you are not this is considered a false claim.

On a passport application, what you sign to is that you are "a citizen or non-citizen national of the United States", so if it is not true, it is not necessarily a false claim to citizenship (you could be falsely claiming to be a non-citizen national). On the N-600, what you sign to is that the information on the application and the evidence submitted is truthful, and all of the evidence can be truthful without claiming citizenship.

[newacct 688]

So taking note of the "or" Im not sure the 2 year requirement is needed. That seems to apply to "E" She is "F" is she not?

2 years thing is for a normal adoption to count as a parent-child relationship. It doesn't apply to orphans.