Obama administration knew millions could not keep their health insurance

[B_J 2,752]

If the system changes and they could weed out all the freeloaders, I'm all for it.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

I've seen some people freeloading to the point it makes my stomach turn. Married dude, 4 kids, 3 ex wives, he doesn't work, his wife works 3 jobs to support him and his son, doesn't pay child support for any of his kids, doesn't bother with the kid he has with his current wife, brags about this to anyone who listens to him. I've told him to his face, I hate he does this because it hurts those who actually need help, instead of just being a lazy slob.

All I know is I pay my bills, I take care of my wife and kids, I do what's right. I don't complain about other folks because they have their lives to live. If the system changes and they could weed out all the freeloaders, I'm all for it.

and i think that is the point some of us try to make that makes some of you think we hate the poor.

I am all for helping those that cannot help themselves or that need a hand up

But there is way too much abuse in the system

[himher 634]

hahaaha. well hello there lover boy

[unsmiley 111]

and i think that is the point some of us try to make that makes some of you think we hate the poor.

I am all for helping those that cannot help themselves or that need a hand up

But there is way too much abuse in the system

Amen, brother.

[james&olya 1,121]

1) My Insurance coverage prior to ACA was / is satisfactory. I'm not worried about becoming any1s dependent. Even when I need some1 to wipe the drool off my chin. I have that covered too = LTC Insurance. So for me? I'm cool except for ACA. I have a very long explanation why I don't like ACA but that's not your question. Maybe next time.

2) People will drop out. Pay the fine and move on. Unfortunately...the system's check = raise premiums again and again until = implodes. In the meantime.... ACA is a vampire sucking the life out of an already dying middle class.

Keep in mind. I'm a capitalist. I don't give a rats wazoo what happens to the other guy unless it impacts me in ways that are more negative than positive. I believe in survival of the fittest. (But) I also have a charitable / compassionate side = willing to help those in need...but ...ACA is NOT charity. It's a mandated tax increase to feed Insurance companies, Unions & our bloated federal gov. & What's worse...it's a circus ran by clowns.

(but) I'm not a total road kill = How many times did the Wright brothers fail to fly? None - it's called process of development.

Just curious, have you read all the fine print in your policy? What prevents your trusted private insurance company (who also really believes in only looking out for THEIR bottom line) from dropping you if you start costing them too much. Maybe you have a lifetime cap on benefits or restrictions on some costly prescriptions. Many people assume they are protected till they get a catastrophic illness. You are aware that the majority of bankruptcies occur because of medical bills? The ACA is a weak compromise that unfortunately pays off these vampire insurance companies, but it is at least an incremental improvement in the status quo, especially in its provisions preventing you from being dropped from your insurance if someday you actually really need it. What we need is either a single-payer system or a health system like our military enjoys. Those are the ideas of the true liberals, not this weak, federalized Romneycare!

[james&olya 1,121]

nowhere near what i was talking about.

Then what ARE you talking about? That is, after all, the unfortunate reality of how our current system works. Do you have a better idea? Or maybe you actually have NOTHING to talk about!

[james&olya 1,121]

You have been paying for the employee portion of your health insurance for years

And she has been working and receiving whatever other benefits are in her contract! Which she has EARNED!

[james&olya 1,121]

and i think that is the point some of us try to make that makes some of you think we hate the poor.

I am all for helping those that cannot help themselves or that need a hand up

But there is way too much abuse in the system

We agree at last! I want to see the abusers weeded out and that includes all the big shots and corporate freeloaders!

[unsmiley 111]

Just curious, have you read all the fine print in your policy? What prevents your trusted private insurance company (who also really believes in only looking out for THEIR bottom line) from dropping you if you start costing them too much. Maybe you have a lifetime cap on benefits or restrictions on some costly prescriptions. Many people assume they are protected till they get a catastrophic illness. You are aware that the majority of bankruptcies occur because of medical bills? The ACA is a weak compromise that unfortunately pays off these vampire insurance companies, but it is at least an incremental improvement in the status quo, especially in its provisions preventing you from being dropped from your insurance if someday you actually really need it. What we need is either a single-payer system or a health system like our military enjoys. Those are the ideas of the true liberals, not this weak, federalized Romneycare!

Do you even know what is in YOUR policies??? Do you know that in New York, not one of the policies offered on the exchanges allows ANY out of network benefits, even the platinum plans???? Do you know that even people like me who have always been willing to cough up extra dough for this privilege, DO NOT EVEN HAVE THAT CHOICE UNDER OBAMACARE?

So while you tout its supposed "benefits", you need to consider many of its despicable detriments. It is NOT an improvement for people like me, and there are millions of us.

[BatmanUSA 105]

What we need is either a single-payer system or a health system like our military enjoys. Those are the ideas of the true liberals, not this weak, federalized Romneycare!

This is not just an idea of the true liberals...

I am a libertarian leaning conservative, I think the progressives/liberals are promoting moral decay and deleting self-responsibility from our society.

However, I support a single payor government run nation health insurance. for example, Medicare for all, with everyone paying into the system by a monthly/yearly premium, and/or a 1% national sales tax. There should be no caps for Medicare and social security tax, and they should implement means testing for those receiving social security payments.

This thread title, "... Obama administration knew millions could not keep their health insurance"... YES, Obama LIED, the POTUS willfully and purposely lied to the American people.! This is a fact and is not in dispute.

But the majority of Americans had hope and believed that Obama would give them something for nothing... and now America has nothing but increased debt... There are still millions of Americans without affordable health care. There will continue to be bankruptcies filed due to healthcare costs, the emergency rooms will still be overcrowded with people seeking treatment for minor illness. (because the emergency room must treat everyone without asking for payment, while physicians offices' can still demand payment before services are rendered).

Most Americans live, pay check to pay check, with maybe a little money in savings for vacation and savings for retirement.. In Obama's first term, he temporarily lowered payroll taxes, he extended unemployment payments for years, increased food subsidies, gave out free cell phones, and promised free healthcare.. Hell, I almost wanted to give him my vote in 2012.

But an educated person understands that at some time, all these freebies and hand-outs must be paid for... Funny, when the national debt was 9 trillion, Senator Obama was against raising the debt ceiling, I think he even said it would be irresponsible to raise the debt ceiling.. But now that he is the POTUS, he says it is irresponsible to not raise the debt ceiling..

Obama is a hypocrite and a willful liar.. But even educated people believe and support this man.

Of course Obama, Pelosi, et all.. knew millions could not keep their health insurance.. They misled and blatantly lied to the American people, but he still won a second term as POTUS. The majority of people do not care... They just continue to hope they will get the free stuff...

[unsmiley 111]

This is not just an idea of the true liberals...

I am a libertarian leaning conservative, I think the progressives/liberals are promoting moral decay and deleting self-responsibility from our society.

However, I support a single payor government run nation health insurance. for example, Medicare for all, with everyone paying into the system by a monthly/yearly premium, and/or a 1% national sales tax. There should be no caps for Medicare and social security tax, and they should implement means testing for those receiving social security payments.

This thread title, "... Obama administration knew millions could not keep their health insurance"... YES, Obama LIED, the POTUS willfully and purposely lied to the American people.! This is a fact and is not in dispute.

But the majority of Americans had hope and believed that Obama would give them something for nothing... and now America has nothing but increased debt... There are still millions of Americans without affordable health care. There will continue to be bankruptcies filed due to healthcare costs, the emergency rooms will still be overcrowded with people seeking treatment for minor illness. (because the emergency room must treat everyone without asking for payment, while physicians offices' can still demand payment before services are rendered).

Most Americans live, pay check to pay check, with maybe a little money in savings for vacation and savings for retirement.. In Obama's first term, he temporarily lowered payroll taxes, he extended unemployment payments for years, increased food subsidies, gave out free cell phones, and promised free healthcare.. Hell, I almost wanted to give him my vote in 2012.

But an educated person understands that at some time, all these freebies and hand-outs must be paid for... Funny, when the national debt was 9 trillion, Senator Obama was against raising the debt ceiling, I think he even said it would be irresponsible to raise the debt ceiling.. But now that he is the POTUS, he says it is irresponsible to not raise the debt ceiling..

Obama is a hypocrite and a willful liar.. But even educated people believe and support this man.

Of course Obama, Pelosi, et all.. knew millions could not keep their health insurance.. They misled and blatantly lied to the American people, but he still won a second term as POTUS. The majority of people do not care... They just continue to hope they will get the free stuff...

Single payer system, don't agree but that's an argument for another day. I do agree with your more general opinions... However: If there are no caps on Social Security tax there should also be correspondingly no caps on Social Security benefits. Otherwise this would be another wealth redistribution scheme of the types the libs love. In addition, means testing for Social Security would be more despicable wealth redistribution. Theoretically Social Security is supposed to be our own money -- that we pay into the system. But the problem is people are taking out much more than they put in, and this MUST end, or there will be nothing left.

[BatmanUSA 105]

I agree that in utopia, there would be no need for income redistribution. but then you would need to have a flat tax, and a whole host of other reforms....

However, one purpose of Obamacare was to have the more fortunate, help the less fortunate...

I disagree with lifetime welfare, Obamaphones, lifetime food assistance, ect... but we can not simply have thousands of homeless, hungry people living in the local park...

hence my suggestion of having (forcing) millionaires, multimillion dollar earning executives, ect, pay more taxes.., and to not collect social security payments if they do not need it... I agree, its still a crappy solution, but I think this idea is better as opposed to raising the retirement age to 70 or even higher...

Unfortunately, if we just cancel the social security system and leave people to make their own decisions... we will again end up with people who do not embrace personal responsibility. So we will have very old, sick, homeless, hungry people living and dying in local parks...

and like I said before, as seen/proven by Obama's reelection victory, the majority of Americans seem uninterested in accepting personal responsibility. so with the continued and expanded Obama hand-outs, people have no incentive to accept personal responsibility.

Im thinking, why squeeze the middle class even more, when currently there are some who have multi-millions. Their quality of life will not deteriorate if forced to pay increased taxes and be denied social security benefits... But at the same time, I think it is wrong to take from people who have honestly worked for what they have...

So I guess the question is.. Is there a moral or civic responsibility to help the less fortunate. And how can this be done in a way that does not promote permanent reliance on government subsidies, and how can this be done, without hurting the people who are...comfortable, but not well off...

[unsmiley 111]

I agree that in utopia, there would be no need for income redistribution. but then you would need to have a flat tax, and a whole host of other reforms....

However, one purpose of Obamacare was to have the more fortunate, help the less fortunate...

I disagree with lifetime welfare, Obamaphones, lifetime food assistance, ect... but we can not simply have thousands of homeless, hungry people living in the local park...

hence my suggestion of having (forcing) millionaires, multimillion dollar earning executives, ect, pay more taxes.., and to not collect social security payments if they do not need it... I agree, its still a crappy solution, but I think this idea is better as opposed to raising the retirement age to 70 or even higher...

Unfortunately, if we just cancel the social security system and leave people to make their own decisions... we will again end up with people who do not embrace personal responsibility. So we will have very old, sick, homeless, hungry people living and dying in local parks...

and like I said before, as seen/proven by Obama's reelection victory, the majority of Americans seem uninterested in accepting personal responsibility. so with the continued and expanded Obama hand-outs, people have no incentive to accept personal responsibility.

Im thinking, why squeeze the middle class even more, when currently there are some who have multi-millions. Their quality of life will not deteriorate if forced to pay increased taxes and be denied social security benefits... But at the same time, I think it is wrong to take from people who have honestly worked for what they have...

So I guess the question is.. Is there a moral or civic responsibility to help the less fortunate. And how can this be done in a way that does not promote permanent reliance on government subsidies, and how can this be done, without hurting the people who are...comfortable, but not well off...

Obamacare was never about healthcare, it is all about redistributing wealth. There were already so many programs available for the healthcare of the indigent (ie: Medicaid) paid for by the rest of us. I don't have a problem with that, even though there is ENORMOUS waste and abuse in that program. No, it is easy to say take from the successful - but it would be wrong. They already account for the vast majority of paying for ALL governmental programs, and do not directly benefit from most of them. Enough already of piling on the rich, who already carry almost the entire load. (And I am not one of them, but I aspire to be.) What we need is EVERYONE sharing in the pain of funding these programs and paying taxes. We should be INSISTING that we all have some skin in the game. Absurdly almost 50% of the adult population in the US pays NO federal income taxes. That is outrageous and is the reason why so many cannot say no to ANY government program. After all, it costs them nothing, what do they care? It's "free" so they want more. This is the problem!!! If somebody making $10 year had to pay $1 in taxes they would begin to understand the "pleasure" of paying taxes and would think twice before insisting on another stupid, wasteful government program. Flat tax is great, its the only truly fair system. Flat tax with absolutely NO deductions.

[BatmanUSA 105]

I agree with you.. It is not fair to take from people who have worked hard and earned more...

and its not fair or right that almost 50% of Americans pay no income tax.... I agree that if you force everyone to have "some skin in the game" this could be the beginning of reeducation our society on personal responsibility..

the people you get all the free stuff, really don't care about the national debt, or increasing healthcare costs, because they get all that for free, and of course they will vote for whomever will continue to continue giving them free stuff..

it has to stop...

Senator Obama was against raising the national debt above 9 trillion... now as POTUS, he is demanding it be raised above 16 trillion.. when and how did his perception change.???