Who Pays Taxes in America? America’s tax system as a whole is just barely progressive.

[웃 910]

U guys should run Mrs. Johnson's 3rd grade class as VP to Romney!

[Usui Takumi 1,562]

All you need to thrive is the rule of law and freedom to go about your daily business without fear. You don't have that in Somalia, which is why there are no thriving Somalian businesses.

Got it. Middle class and the poor should basically ignore the law...anyway its pretty easy to see that those with the greatest wealth control the country and have the greatest stake in the country as a result..monetarily if they were to fail, the country fails....and thats why they should be paying more.

But the sheeple don't seem to get that.

Edited April 11, 2012 by Sousuke

[dalegg 143]

..monetarily if they were to fail, the country fails....

Well if that's true instead of them paying any taxes we should all be paying them a few bucks each directly to keep them safe. I don't want the country to fail!

[mawilson 2,133]

I heard a Dem on TV last night repeat the same soundbite - that the rich somehow benefit more from the infrastructure, transportation, education, R&D, energy, police, the courts, etc.

Must be in the Obama playbook.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Libertarians don't believe in lawlessness. Libertarians believe in more personal responsibility - which you liberals obviously hate. There are far more cradle-to-grave leftwing, big government wastelands than any other.

I am a liberal and I do believe in personal responsibility. I do not, however, believe in a each for his own philosophy. I'm not sure why the discussion always goes along the all-or-nothing lines. You can have a society where the less fortunate are supported without creating cradle-to-grave wastelands. It's done all around the globe in the developed world where better social safety nets exist and yet people don't tend to live off the system generation after generation.

[mawilson 2,133]

It's done all around the globe in the developed world where better social safety nets exist and yet people don't tend to live off the system generation after generation.

They do though - in the UK, Germany, probably all European countries with generous safety nets.

[slim 1,514]

There's more than enough opportunity in this country for everyone to be successful.

We should encourage them to take advantage of that opportunity.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

agreed - it's a wonder we made it out of the 1700's!

Those were different times and different global economic realities. Remember that we did build all that infrastructure and the country made giant leaps forward as a result. Government - the federal government - was front and center on that effort. Easy to forget that, eh? And, oh, the country grew and made huge leaps forward, the largest and most prosperous middle class the world has ever seen formed with that growth. And the federal income tax system was a progressive as it have ever been while the country prospered with top marginal tax rates of up to 90%. Damn.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I am a liberal and I do believe in personal responsibility. I do not, however, believe in a each for his own philosophy. I'm not sure why the discussion always goes along the all-or-nothing lines. You can have a society where the less fortunate are supported without creating cradle-to-grave wastelands. It's done all around the globe in the developed world where better social safety nets exist and yet people don't tend to live off the system generation after generation.

Because if you're not wealthy, it's your fault. You're just a lazy leech, wanting to sponge off all those people who work harder than you and earned their dough. Go out and earn it, damn it!

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

There's more than enough opportunity in this country for everyone to be successful.

We should encourage them to take advantage of that opportunity.

This, I mostly agree with. I'd add "equip" to the second sentence, though.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

No other entity in this country has contributed more to the creation of the Middle Class than unions. They were the ones that gave us 40 hour work weeks, overtime, vacation and sick pay, health insurance and pensions. But thanks to the Right Wingers and their relentless vilification of unions, the Middle Class is getting smaller as union membership is significantly lower than it was half a century ago. The Republican Party and it's agenda has done more to create a Welfare State than anything, and then they conveniently place the blame on liberal policies that provide social safety nets for the less fortunate. What a clever scheme.

Edited April 11, 2012 by Mister Fancypants

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Because if you're not wealthy, it's your fault. You're just a lazy leech, wanting to sponge off all those people who work harder than you and earned their dough. Go out and earn it, damn it!

Let's not pretend that there aren't significant numbers of people that are quite skilled in working the various welfare systems rather than putting that skill to work in the real economy. Those do exist and it's a problem. I understand that people who work their butts off and pay taxes being angry with those that could work but choose not to because it requires effort. I understand people being angry when they see folks buying fancy groceries with their SNAP cards and then drive away in their new model Benzes and Beamers and Hummers. Or when they buy candy and ####### at the gas station instead of actual food. That shite makes my blood boil, too. And I see way too often for my comfort. No doubt is the welfare system in this country broken. I believe we ought to help those that can't help themselves, I believe we ought to help folks get on their feet. But I have an issue with folks just taking and not even trying to keep themselves above water.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Let's not pretend that there aren't significant numbers of people that are quite skilled in working the various welfare systems rather than putting that skill to work in the real economy. Those do exist and it's a problem. I understand that people who work their butts off and pay taxes being angry with those that could work but choose not to because it requires effort. I understand people being angry when they see folks buying fancy groceries with their SNAP cards and then drive away in their new model Benzes and Beamers and Hummers. Or when they buy candy and ####### at the gas station instead of actual food. That shite makes my blood boil, too. And I see way too often for my comfort. No doubt is the welfare system in this country broken. I believe we ought to help those that can't help themselves, I believe we ought to help folks get on their feet. But I have an issue with folks just taking and not even trying to keep themselves above water.

We'll always have corporate crime - people will always try to get away with it while they can. The best way to address dishonesty is to continuously tweak the rules and regulations to minimize it as much as possible. However, the damage done by a woman who receives $130 a month in food stamps, while her boyfriend (who she doesn't list on the household), provides her with a nice car, is miniscule in comparison to the cost of abuse from white collar crime. The Right Wingers like to focus their outrage toward the powerless and poor, while cheering for white collar criminals because, afterall, they're just trying to make a buck. Who cares if they dumped toxic waste on public land?

[mawilson 2,133]

Because if you're not wealthy, it's your fault. You're just a lazy leech, wanting to sponge off all those people who work harder than you and earned their dough. Go out and earn it, damn it!

Wealth is relative, but if you're dirt poor, it's probably is your fault - unless you're disabled or stupid.

Edited April 11, 2012 by mawilson

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

We'll always have corporate crime - people will always try to get away with it while they can. The best way to address dishonesty is to continuously tweak the rules and regulations to minimize it as much as possible. However, the damage done by a woman who receives $130 a month in food stamps, while her boyfriend (who she doesn't list on the household), provides her with a nice car, is miniscule in comparison to the cost of abuse from white collar crime. The Right Wingers like to focus their outrage toward the powerless and poor, while cheering for white collar criminals because, afterall, they're just trying to make a buck. Who cares if they dumped toxic waste on public land?

That's a fair point. There's a lively debate currently going on in my county around a multimillion dollar incentive package a big box sporting good retailer is set to receive for building a store. They talk about job creation and all but nobody talks about the mom and pop sporting good stores in the vicinity that will end up closing and letting people go because they cannot compete with the national chain store. The net effect of jobs in the county is going to be minimal but the corporate retailer will still get tens of millions of dollars of taxpayer funds. It's just a gift we as taxpayers get to make to the chain's shareholders and executives, I guess.