The American paradox of Christianity and capitalism

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

That's because when women go to college they turn into feminist lesbians.

[drool]Mmmmmm. Lesbians.[/drool]

[^_^ 5,021]

[drool]Mmmmmm. Lesbians.[/drool]

[I AM NOT THAT GUY 5,715]

So do you throw out Christianity if it is concluded that there are socialistic elements within its theology? Anti-marxism trumps basic Christianity?

I hang out with Christians. I hang out with hippies. I do the Christian ritual thing. I do the hippie ritual thing. I am not a Christian, as much as I understand the mythology, and I am not a hippie, as much as I understand parasitic organisms. I drive my wife wherever she needs to go, because I can drive, and she cannot. I am not a chauffeur. I hope that helps.

Fantasy is always better than reality.

[Danno 1,228]

If you believe as a Catholic and a Christian that we have no moral obligations beyond our capacities as individuals, you have missed the understanding of the Gospel. You can find all kinds of arch-conservative Catholic websites like that which support such an archaic view of the Gospel, but that doesn't represent the Church's stance on social justice, which has been a central aspect of our faith. The Church's own charities function on that premise.

"Far too many Catholics are not familiar with the basic content of Catholic social teaching. More fundamentally, many Catholics do not adequately understand that the social teaching of the Church is an essential part of Catholic faith. This poses a serious challenge for all Catholics, since it weakens our capacity to be a Church that is true to the demands of the Gospel. We need to do more to share the social mission and message of our Church." Sharing Catholic Social Teaching: Challenges and Directions

U.S. Catholic Bishops

What does seem odd is the lack of admonishing coming from Christ to "collectively" do anything.

Which does not rule out your viewpoint.... it just gives no real weight to it.

[SuperDuper! 230]

American Christianity is largely based in Protestantism.

The Protestants believed that the more financially successful you were, the more God was approving and blessing you.

So tell us again, where exactly is the "paradox"?

[ready4ONE 5,400]

[james&olya 1,121]

American Christianity is largely based in Protestantism.

The Protestants believed that the more financially successful you were, the more God was approving and blessing you.

So tell us again, where exactly is the "paradox"?

It is also a principle from the bible that 'unto whom much is given, much is expected!'

As to flat tax proponents, read the parable of the widow's mite.

And arguing that hypocrites in the past have done things a certain way justifies continuing their hypocrisy sounds so... 'republican'!!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

As to flat tax proponents, read the parable of the widow's mite.

[james&olya 1,121]

What does seem odd is the lack of admonishing coming from Christ to "collectively" do anything.

Which does not rule out your viewpoint.... it just gives no real weight to it.

Christ had no experience with democratically elected government. But the early christian church did in fact work collectively, they functioned very much as a (gasp!!, horror) commune! You demonstrate the lack of knowledge of basic christian principles that is so typical of those on the right who tend to make so much noise about this country being founded on christianity, etc....

[Nina~ 431]

American Christianity is largely based in Protestantism.

The Protestants believed that the more financially successful you were, the more God was approving and blessing you.

So tell us again, where exactly is the "paradox"?

Sorry to burst your bubble, but the "Gospel of Wealth" is not a mainstream protestant idea. It is purely a Capitalistic ideology. Srsly, Jesus never said "follow me and I will make you so rich that you will poop out gold turds"

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Jesus never said "follow me and I will make you so rich that you will poop out gold turds"

lol....there are golden hemorrhoids in the Old Testament though.

[chri'stina 190]

While I don't completely disagree with points in the original post, I think it's very convenient for the left to pick and choose which issues they think Christians need to be more Christian about. Why should we trust Colbert's opinions exactly? Is he a beacon of Christian behavior? Does he show us how to live a holy Christian life? Jesus was not involved in politics, and I know they didn't even have a vote then either. We do have the freedom to vote, but I don't think it's fair to say that Christians need to support the health care reform as it has been proposed. And to assume that Christians don't help the poor because they don't support the way democrats put together the health care bill is very judgmental. The deeper problem is how people even need insurance to go see doctors due to medical expense. How giving everyone insurance so we can have health access doesn't change the fact that insurance is needed and seems like it will never not be needed.

"They can wrap themselves up in the flag but when the time comes to walk the walk they'll say no their neighbor, their state, their nation, their president and even Jesus himself."

I don't believe they need to say yes to their state, nation or president on everything. So because they don't say yes to those 3 things all the time, it means they say no to Jesus and their neighbor? That's laughable.

And what about other Christian views that are rejected by the left as an intrusion of church legislating state? Like abortion. Like morality issues. Pornography. Jesus preached to live a holy life. Are Christians even representing Him in their talking? In their sexual jokes? In their compromised morals that are influenced by Western culture and not the bible? Bottom line: He came for our spirituality and not for politics. If a Christian doesn't want to be involved in politics at all(which I sometimes feel like), I don't see anything wrong with it. How I live is based on my beliefs in Jesus' words and the bible, not on my government, whether a democracy or dictatorship.

Edited January 18, 2011 by chri'stina

[chri'stina 190]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but the "Gospel of Wealth" is not a mainstream protestant idea. It is purely a Capitalistic ideology. Srsly, Jesus never said "follow me and I will make you so rich that you will poop out gold turds"

True and I believe Martin Luther was disgusted by the extravagant manner in which the Catholic churches were adorned and the materialism involved. He was a leader of the Protestant reformation. Whether some Protestants later became materialist, I wouldn't be surprised. But it wasn't part of the original views.

[james&olya 1,121]

While I don't completely disagree with points in the original post, I think it's very convenient for the left to pick and choose which issues they think Christians need to be more Christian about. Why should we trust Colbert's opinions exactly? Is he a beacon of Christian behavior? Does he show us how to live a holy Christian life? Jesus was not involved in politics, and I know they didn't even have a vote then either. We do have the freedom to vote, but I don't think it's fair to say that Christians need to support the health care reform as it has been proposed. And to assume that Christians don't help the poor because they don't support the way democrats put together the health care bill is very judgmental. The deeper problem is how people even need insurance to go see doctors due to medical expense. How giving everyone insurance so we can have health access doesn't change the fact that insurance is needed and seems like it will never not be needed.

"They can wrap themselves up in the flag but when the time comes to walk the walk they'll say no their neighbor, their state, their nation, their president and even Jesus himself."

I don't believe they need to say yes to their state, nation or president on everything. So because they don't say yes to those 3 things all the time, it means they say no to Jesus and their neighbor? That's laughable.

And what about other Christian views that are rejected by the left as an intrusion of church legislating state? Like abortion. Like morality issues. Pornography. Jesus preached to live a holy life. Are Christians even representing Him in their talking? In their sexual jokes? In their compromised morals that are influenced by Western culture and not the bible? Bottom line: He came for our spirituality and not for politics. If a Christian doesn't want to be involved in politics at all(which I sometimes feel like), I don't see anything wrong with it. How I live is based on my beliefs in Jesus' words and the bible, not on my government, whether a democracy or dictatorship.

I understand your views as a christian. I grew up in a very fundamentalist church, went to church schools the whole way through! What you must understand is the frustration we on the left have with right wing 'christians' who are only too ready to shove their religious views on us by having government legislate our private morality. We believe that our private morality is not government's business! But for these same christians who want government to legislate private morality to then say that moral/religious beliefs do not have relevance with public policy and the 'goodness' of the government policies they support is just wrong! They have it all completely backwards. Which does not surprise me in the least since, as I witnessed first hand for so many years, they are decidedly un-christian in how they use their 'christianity' as a club against others, never as a way to show compassion. There are good christians. I have met a few. I find little real christianity in most of what I see in the 'tea-party' republican faction!

[chri'stina 190]

I understand your views as a christian. I grew up in a very fundamentalist church, went to church schools the whole way through! What you must understand is the frustration we on the left have with right wing 'christians' who are only too ready to shove their religious views on us by having government legislate our private morality. We believe that our private morality is not government's business! But for these same christians who want government to legislate private morality to then say that moral/religious beliefs do not have relevance with public policy and the 'goodness' of the government policies they support is just wrong! They have it all completely backwards. Which does not surprise me in the least since, as I witnessed first hand for so many years, they are decidedly un-christian in how they use their 'christianity' as a club against others, never as a way to show compassion. There are good christians. I have met a few. I find little real christianity in most of what I see in the 'tea-party' republican faction!

Some people, which includes some Christians who are right wing (but also includes people who aren't Christians), don't think it's the government's business to legislate a lot of things, including requiring everyone to buy health insurance. That does not = not wanting people to get help or medical care. I won't deny that there are Christians who don't seem to represent Jesus well.

I guess a problem I have with Christians on the left is using Jesus for their own political means, when it suits them. The same thing you seem to have as a problem with Christians on the right. I guess in general, Christians- or maybe all humans, are just picky. The right might say, how can Christians on the left tolerate abortion? Christians on the left here say, how can Christian tolerate people not getting health care? Can you say with confidence that either side is actually doing exactly what Jesus wanted? I can't say that with confidence.