Evidence Advice

[jassan 1]

My wife's I-751 got kicked back - "You have not sent sufficient examples of share assets and liabilities spanning the period of the marriage to show that you continue to share a life together."

Issue is, we don't have joint bank accounts or credit cards. It's just something we've never done. She's paid for her schooling and the food in the home, I've taken care of the rest. Her preference has been to pay for things with her earnings. That doesn't mean our finances are completely separate. I've paid for numerous trips together domestically an internationally and assisted with her schooling for example. There are times as well where she's compensated on the price of travel and various expenses. A perusal of bank statements show this, but in face of this I-751 it would be preferable had things been officially in both our names. We cant change that now.

So, even though USCIS is requesting share liabilities assets, I'm curious if sending other evidences will assist. Not all of it is financially related, but approval as I understand it doesn't fully hinge on only one single element, so I'm considering bolstering other elements of evidence as well. My list is a follows:

Primary Financial Evidence

1. Joint apartment insurance

2. Joint leases (3 years, two states)

3. Wife as beneficiary on retirement account (two jobs, two states)

4. Wife as beneficiary on life insurance policies (two separate jobs)

- actual copy of beneficiary paperwork from federal job

- letter on official letterhead from previous state employer describing all benefits on which my wife was listed

5. Joint car insurance policy

6. Joint health insurance policies (two jobs, two states)

7. Official IRS Tax transcripts - married filing jointly (3 years)

Secondary Financial Evidence

1. Credit Card Statements showing:

a) Purchase of ring

b) Purchase of flight to Azerbaijan for marriage

c) Purchase of flight and accommodations for honeymoon in Turkey

d) Purchase of flight (this year) for family visit (both of us)

f) Purchase of flight to Israel (religious pilgrimage)

g) Domestic flight itinerary

h) Occasional payment of wife's schooling

2. Bank statements indicating payment for above travel

3. Bank statements showing transfer of payment from wife's account to mine to contribute to travel cost

4. Bank statements showing payment to credit cards for wife's schooling

Various Evidence

1. Wife's college transcripts and online payment receipts

2. Email correspondence pre-dating relationship

3. Various cards from family

4. Photos from all the aforementioned travel inclusive of other family members

5. Corresponding travel itineraries when available

6. Affidavit from friend with whom my wife and I initially lived for 3 months when she first arrived to the US

7. Recent payments for Azeri classes (for myself to interact with family)

Three last things:

1. My wife has primarily paid for food in the house - this is something I certainly do not handle. I have her bank statements to show this.

2. We have, after receiving this request for additional evidence, established a joint account and added names to credit cards. There's no history to these however, though it is a sign we are not adverse to the idea, it's just not how we've handled our finances. I'm not sure to demonstrate this or not as it may appear we are just trying to appease immigration (which we are in a sense, but not in a deceptive way).

3. I mentioned religious pilgrimage. My wife and I are members of the Baha'i Faith - it's how we met almost 8 years ago now. A duty for every Baha'i is pilgrimage to the Baha'i holy sites in Israel. This is an official process that is documented. One must apply for pilgrimage and the waiting list was 5 years at the time of my application in 2003. After marriage, I had to add my wife to the application so she could be permitted to attend by the Baha'i World Center. I have the correspondence making the request to add my wife and the subsequent acceptance and travel dates (along with photos, itineraries of course). Is this useful to send as well?

What should I expect after sending this off? Should I be lawyering up? Four years of marriage, moved to DC last year to start my Federal Career and my wife obtaining schooling to get a proper professional job now seems at risk of being upturned by an immigration officer. *Sigh*

[Kathryn41 3,205]

Is the above list what you are submitting new or the combined list of what you already submitted plus what you are now submitting?

With the re-submission of evidence include a cover letter to explain why you did not have joint accounts and credit cards, as well as explaining that you have now done so although realize it may be late. State what expenses each of you habitually paid through your own individual accounts and then include bank statements that show those expenses paid by those accounts. Be sure the expenses cover the 4 years of your marriage as well, or at least back to when you submitted the AOS application because all information since will be new evidence and will show you have been living together in a married relationship ever since. Use a highlighter to show those expenses and highlight the account holder's name and mailing address on the statements. Were there any other household expenses that your wife paid or contributed to? Any one time maintenance expenses over the years? Show your wife also paying for her schooling as well as your contributions to her schooling so it shows you are both contributing. You could also write your wills, naming each other as your beneficiary and if desired, executor of the estate. You show joint car insurance - does she drive? Include her Driver's license. Has she paid for gas for the one car using her accounts? Again, you can highlight that expense on her accounts. What about phones? Do you have cell phones and a shared family plan or account? (and if not, why not - it's cheaper!) Definitely include the information/documentation about your pilgrimage, especially as it shows it required planning and involvement over several years - this is part of presenting yourself to the community as a married couple and your community requires proof of this relationship as well. Do you have pets together - you can get them microchipped and list both individuals as the contact person. Do you have joint investments such as a CD or IRA? You can list the other as the beneficiary even though the spouse is automatically the beneficiary - I made sure my husband was listed by name as I knew I could use this as an additional piece of evidence. Who has paid for the co-pays or non-covered expenses for medical exams, treatments, etc. . If these are from your account for her, include the statement from the provider/insurance as well as the bank statement showing where it was paid by you. If you have cards from your family to her for birthdays, her family to yours for birthdays, cards to both of you for anniversaries, you include copies of those and hopefuly you still have the envelopes as well. What about a joint safety deposit box? Even if each of you weren't listed on joint accounts together, was the other listed with the bank as being the spouse? Perhaps you can get a letter from the bank stating that fact (don't know if it is possible or not).

I don't think you need to lawyer up. The lawyer wouldn't be able to do much more than write your cover letter for you and possibly suggest some other types of evidence to provide. You would still need to provide the documents yourself. You just need to create a preponderance of evidence that you would not normally be able to obtain unless you really were in a valid relationship. Include as much as you can either directly or indirectly related to the financial aspects of your lives and then add in evidence that documents your daily lives as a couple living together as a couple and in the community at large.

You may also include a final statement in your cover letter stating that you and your wife would be happy to meet with an immigration officer for an interview so they may see in person the validity of your marriage.

Good luck.

Edited July 25, 2010 by Kathryn41

[Tom_Jim 40]

Jassan,

Your primary and secondary lists are very strong. My lawyer previously mentioned that for situations such as yours, where there are no joint accounts and each individual pays for different things; one can enumerate those in a succinct cover letter accompanying your RFE. A strong indication of shared liabilities is you listing your wife as a beneficiary in your retirement and insurance policies. That's very strong. Of course, looking back, it may have saved you from this RFE if you sent those at the outset, but moving on.

Your "second wave" of evidence is excellent. I would imagine it would satisfy the adjudicator in your case. The opening of your joint account is a good idea and it will not hurt if you send that as evidence in the shared assets.

Also, your pilgrimage to Israel is also an excellent form of evidence. Who paid for that trip? Was it paid separately by the two of you? If you (or she) bought it, that can also be used. If you paid for it each for yourselves, that's OK too. If you have the boarding cards or itinerary for that trip, include those as well. If you have photos of that trip, I would include it.

Additionally, the affidavit from your friend should prove helpful and give the adjudicator some insight into your personal relationship with your spouse. And finally, as a side note. The lawyer I consulted with, who was once an INS adjudicator, advised (and verified when I read the AFM ("Adjudicator's Field Manual")) me that one factor in the denial of an ROC case is that it presented clear compelling evidence that the marriage was entered to gain immigration benefits - solely. So, I wouldn't worry too much about it. Just get that second wave of evidence to them as soon as practicable.

Best of luck, and I have a very positive feeling that with the second set of evidence, your spouse will successfully remove the conditions on her residency.

[Brian&Mel 0]

My wife's I-751 got kicked back - "You have not sent sufficient examples of share assets and liabilities spanning the period of the marriage to show that you continue to share a life together."

Issue is, we don't have joint bank accounts or credit cards. It's just something we've never done. She's paid for her schooling and the food in the home, I've taken care of the rest. Her preference has been to pay for things with her earnings. That doesn't mean our finances are completely separate. I've paid for numerous trips together domestically an internationally and assisted with her schooling for example. There are times as well where she's compensated on the price of travel and various expenses. A perusal of bank statements show this, but in face of this I-751 it would be preferable had things been officially in both our names. We cant change that now.

So, even though USCIS is requesting share liabilities assets, I'm curious if sending other evidences will assist. Not all of it is financially related, but approval as I understand it doesn't fully hinge on only one single element, so I'm considering bolstering other elements of evidence as well. My list is a follows:

Primary Financial Evidence

1. Joint apartment insurance

2. Joint leases (3 years, two states)

3. Wife as beneficiary on retirement account (two jobs, two states)

4. Wife as beneficiary on life insurance policies (two separate jobs)

- actual copy of beneficiary paperwork from federal job

- letter on official letterhead from previous state employer describing all benefits on which my wife was listed

5. Joint car insurance policy

6. Joint health insurance policies (two jobs, two states)

7. Official IRS Tax transcripts - married filing jointly (3 years)

Secondary Financial Evidence

1. Credit Card Statements showing:

a) Purchase of ring

b) Purchase of flight to Azerbaijan for marriage

c) Purchase of flight and accommodations for honeymoon in Turkey

d) Purchase of flight (this year) for family visit (both of us)

f) Purchase of flight to Israel (religious pilgrimage)

g) Domestic flight itinerary

h) Occasional payment of wife's schooling

2. Bank statements indicating payment for above travel

3. Bank statements showing transfer of payment from wife's account to mine to contribute to travel cost

4. Bank statements showing payment to credit cards for wife's schooling

Various Evidence

1. Wife's college transcripts and online payment receipts

2. Email correspondence pre-dating relationship

3. Various cards from family

4. Photos from all the aforementioned travel inclusive of other family members

5. Corresponding travel itineraries when available

6. Affidavit from friend with whom my wife and I initially lived for 3 months when she first arrived to the US

7. Recent payments for Azeri classes (for myself to interact with family)

Three last things:

1. My wife has primarily paid for food in the house - this is something I certainly do not handle. I have her bank statements to show this.

2. We have, after receiving this request for additional evidence, established a joint account and added names to credit cards. There's no history to these however, though it is a sign we are not adverse to the idea, it's just not how we've handled our finances. I'm not sure to demonstrate this or not as it may appear we are just trying to appease immigration (which we are in a sense, but not in a deceptive way).

3. I mentioned religious pilgrimage. My wife and I are members of the Baha'i Faith - it's how we met almost 8 years ago now. A duty for every Baha'i is pilgrimage to the Baha'i holy sites in Israel. This is an official process that is documented. One must apply for pilgrimage and the waiting list was 5 years at the time of my application in 2003. After marriage, I had to add my wife to the application so she could be permitted to attend by the Baha'i World Center. I have the correspondence making the request to add my wife and the subsequent acceptance and travel dates (along with photos, itineraries of course). Is this useful to send as well?

What should I expect after sending this off? Should I be lawyering up? Four years of marriage, moved to DC last year to start my Federal Career and my wife obtaining schooling to get a proper professional job now seems at risk of being upturned by an immigration officer. *Sigh*

May I asked what is being sent the first time when you filed for the I-751?

Thanks

[Brother Hesekiel 2,235]

If you are looking for a few specific flowers, it's easier to find them in a flower store than in a field of 10,000 square miles.

You violated the quality over quantity rule, plain and simple.

The good stuff you have in there is hidden among the stuff that has no bearing to the ROC process. You traveled to Azerbaijan when courting your wife? Great, but that was way before she moved here and long before she got her Green Card. And how exactly does that prove that you lived together in the same household since she got her card?

You don't have a joint bank account (neither had my wife and I), but do you both have access to your spouse's account(s), in case one of you guys is crushed by a school bus and the rent is due on the first? If so, did you send proof of that?

You "reimbursed" your wife for cost she had in regard to school costs? That's a term you use in the business world, but it's not something that would help in an immigration case between a man and his wife who live together in harmony. Roommates reimburse one another for cost related to sharing a living space.

"Various cards from family?" Wow, how easy is it to ask family members to send a few cards for birthdays and holidays. That's not proof of you two living together, but meaningless filler as well. Affidavits from friends and family also fall under this category.

It is my opinion that you could have pulled this off with LESS evidence and a good cover letter instead of drowning the I.O. in so much paperwork that they did what I've predicted many times on this board: got fed up with it, closed the file and send an RFE.

You need to make it EASY for the I.O. to approve you.

Same house: apartment lease. Taxes: tax returns. Banking: bank statements or letter from manager stating full access to each other's accounts. Intermingling: travel tickets and boarding passes, photos, car titles, insurances.

Everything else is filler. I also -- and that's my personal opinion -- feel that politics and religion should be left totally out of the immigration process.

The final component is how you come over. The I.O. opens your package and if it's neat and organized he'll check out the first page which is the cover letter. About 1 minute he should know everything he needs to know about you and your wife. He then checks out the documents he's looking for, like you would look for certain flowers. If 3 pounds of papers are pouring out of the envelope, many of which land on the floor so that he has to go down on his knees and try to figure out what's going on . . . that's not helping a case either.

Edited July 26, 2010 by Just Bob

[jkD 0]

If you are looking for a few specific flowers, it's easier to find them in a flower store than in a field of 10,000 square miles.

You violated the quality over quantity rule, plain and simple.

The good stuff you have in there is hidden among the stuff that has no bearing to the ROC process. You traveled to Azerbaijan when courting your wife? Great, but that was way before she moved here and long before she got her Green Card. And how exactly does that prove that you lived together in the same household since she got her card?

You don't have a joint bank account (neither had my wife and I), but do you both have access to your spouse's account(s), in case one of you guys is crushed by a school bus and the rent is due on the first? If so, did you send proof of that?

You "reimbursed" your wife for cost she had in regard to school costs? That's a term you use in the business world, but it's not something that would help in an immigration case between a man and his wife who live together in harmony. Roommates reimburse one another for cost related to sharing a living space.

"Various cards from family?" Wow, how easy is it to ask family members to send a few cards for birthdays and holidays. That's not proof of you two living together, but meaningless filler as well. Affidavits from friends and family also fall under this category.

It is my opinion that you could have pulled this off with LESS evidence and a good cover letter instead of drowning the I.O. in so much paperwork that they did what I've predicted many times on this board: got fed up with it, closed the file and send an RFE.

You need to make it EASY for the I.O. to approve you.

Same house: apartment lease. Taxes: tax returns. Banking: bank statements or letter from manager stating full access to each other's accounts. Intermingling: travel tickets and boarding passes, photos, car titles, insurances.

Everything else is filler. I also -- and that's my personal opinion -- feel that politics and religion should be left totally out of the immigration process.

The final component is how you come over. The I.O. opens your package and if it's neat and organized he'll check out the first page which is the cover letter. About 1 minute he should know everything he needs to know about you and your wife. He then checks out the documents he's looking for, like you would look for certain flowers. If 3 pounds of papers are pouring out of the envelope, many of which land on the floor so that he has to go down on his knees and try to figure out what's going on . . . that's not helping a case either.

Great post. Very meaningful. I guess, tax transcripts ( not returns ), bank statements, insurance cards, phone records etc should do the trick this time. Even if you decide to put all the proofs, I would recommend putting the important ones at the top. I would start with tax records and bank statements.

[nanggroe 1]

Yes, a nice cover letter stating your circumstances and document attached would help much.

If you are looking for a few specific flowers, it's easier to find them in a flower store than in a field of 10,000 square miles.

You violated the quality over quantity rule, plain and simple.

The good stuff you have in there is hidden among the stuff that has no bearing to the ROC process. You traveled to Azerbaijan when courting your wife? Great, but that was way before she moved here and long before she got her Green Card. And how exactly does that prove that you lived together in the same household since she got her card?

You don't have a joint bank account (neither had my wife and I), but do you both have access to your spouse's account(s), in case one of you guys is crushed by a school bus and the rent is due on the first? If so, did you send proof of that?

You "reimbursed" your wife for cost she had in regard to school costs? That's a term you use in the business world, but it's not something that would help in an immigration case between a man and his wife who live together in harmony. Roommates reimburse one another for cost related to sharing a living space.

"Various cards from family?" Wow, how easy is it to ask family members to send a few cards for birthdays and holidays. That's not proof of you two living together, but meaningless filler as well. Affidavits from friends and family also fall under this category.

It is my opinion that you could have pulled this off with LESS evidence and a good cover letter instead of drowning the I.O. in so much paperwork that they did what I've predicted many times on this board: got fed up with it, closed the file and send an RFE.

You need to make it EASY for the I.O. to approve you.

Same house: apartment lease. Taxes: tax returns. Banking: bank statements or letter from manager stating full access to each other's accounts. Intermingling: travel tickets and boarding passes, photos, car titles, insurances.

Everything else is filler. I also -- and that's my personal opinion -- feel that politics and religion should be left totally out of the immigration process.

The final component is how you come over. The I.O. opens your package and if it's neat and organized he'll check out the first page which is the cover letter. About 1 minute he should know everything he needs to know about you and your wife. He then checks out the documents he's looking for, like you would look for certain flowers. If 3 pounds of papers are pouring out of the envelope, many of which land on the floor so that he has to go down on his knees and try to figure out what's going on . . . that's not helping a case either.

[jassan 1]

I figured I would give an update as this thread can maybe both a source of hope and a lesson of what not to do.

I sent off my initial I-751 in haste as I was preparing for extended travel and was up against some weighty work obligations. In my rush I absentmindedly sent off my I-751 without all my financial evidence (I think I has sent leases and insurance policies). Before I had to opportunity to submit additional evidence to add to my file I received the RFE and the worries began. Fearful that my case was under additional scrutiny, I frantically began to assemble all manners of evidence as shown above. My primary concern was the lack of joint bank accounts (in reading through these forums there was plenty of emphasis placed on joint accounts) over our nearly four-year marriage or shared accounts of any type besides taxes and leases. It took a while and some expenditures to pull together past credit card statements of travel purchases, to pull together beneficiary information from previous employers, to add my spouses name on accounts at the last moment, etc...

On the Friday evening that I had finally pulled everything together, as I was in the process of labeling and organizing all my evidence I noticed on the RFE that the due date was the coming Monday - a little over 48 hours time! My hopes were pinned on an overnight delivery on a Saturday morning. Needless to say I was sweating bullets and praying I hadn't been so remiss as to forget something this last time around. Fortunately the package arrived on time early Monday morning and not late Monday afternoon as the delivery projection indicated.

Today my wife and I logged onto the USCIS site and got the update we were nervously waiting for:

On August 17, 2010, we ordered production of your new card. Please allow 30 days for your card to be mailed to you. If we need something from you we will contact you. If you move before you receive the card, call customer service at 1-800-375-5283.

So, to anyone else in this process reading this:

1. Get joint bank accounts - it makes for less recording keeping

2. When submitting the I-751, don't rush. Give yourself time to put it aside and check over a day or two before sending.

3. Don't wait till the last moment - the stress will likely shorten your lifespan if not separate you from your true love.

4. If you don't have joint bank accounts all is certainly not lost

5. Overnight delivery certainly works, but I wouldn't recommend the night before it is actually due.

Thanks for the replies and advice - it was all very much appreciated.

[OBX 51]

Thanks for the update; glad it all worked out. Congratulations!

[jkD 0]

Congratulations. And thanks for the additional info. Pretty sure a lot of people will benefit from this experience.

I figured I would give an update as this thread can maybe both a source of hope and a lesson of what not to do.

I sent off my initial I-751 in haste as I was preparing for extended travel and was up against some weighty work obligations. In my rush I absentmindedly sent off my I-751 without all my financial evidence (I think I has sent leases and insurance policies). Before I had to opportunity to submit additional evidence to add to my file I received the RFE and the worries began. Fearful that my case was under additional scrutiny, I frantically began to assemble all manners of evidence as shown above. My primary concern was the lack of joint bank accounts (in reading through these forums there was plenty of emphasis placed on joint accounts) over our nearly four-year marriage or shared accounts of any type besides taxes and leases. It took a while and some expenditures to pull together past credit card statements of travel purchases, to pull together beneficiary information from previous employers, to add my spouses name on accounts at the last moment, etc...

On the Friday evening that I had finally pulled everything together, as I was in the process of labeling and organizing all my evidence I noticed on the RFE that the due date was the coming Monday - a little over 48 hours time! My hopes were pinned on an overnight delivery on a Saturday morning. Needless to say I was sweating bullets and praying I hadn't been so remiss as to forget something this last time around. Fortunately the package arrived on time early Monday morning and not late Monday afternoon as the delivery projection indicated.

Today my wife and I logged onto the USCIS site and got the update we were nervously waiting for:

On August 17, 2010, we ordered production of your new card. Please allow 30 days for your card to be mailed to you. If we need something from you we will contact you. If you move before you receive the card, call customer service at 1-800-375-5283.

So, to anyone else in this process reading this:

1. Get joint bank accounts - it makes for less recording keeping

2. When submitting the I-751, don't rush. Give yourself time to put it aside and check over a day or two before sending.

3. Don't wait till the last moment - the stress will likely shorten your lifespan if not separate you from your true love.

4. If you don't have joint bank accounts all is certainly not lost

5. Overnight delivery certainly works, but I wouldn't recommend the night before it is actually due.

Thanks for the replies and advice - it was all very much appreciated.