Arizona taxpayers spend up to $1.2 billion annually

[sjr09 155]

Well you know what, health care is not a school system. If the government dares covering the 20,000,000 illegal immigrants, this will bankrupt the system. No country in the world can just cover everyone. None.

Pro illegal alien groups have two ways of working around the obstacle of not being permitted to use the proposed UHC. The first method is to get a supreme court ruling that not covering them is unconstitutional. And we all know just how much power the courts yield over the people in America. So that would be a done deal. The second is to legalize them, therefore, their status is no longer an issue. In any of these cases, the United States will end up bankrupt and go down in history as the nation that bankrupted itself trying to take care of citizens of other nations.

However, I still take Obama's word for it. People will have to apply for this using the appropriate forms and ID. It's not as if people will simply walk up and be covered.

So much for the appropriate forms.

Congressional Research Agency Confirms Illegal Aliens Will Get Health Benefits Under House Bill

Last Tuesday, the Congressional Research Service (CRS), which is the non-partisan "research arm" of the United States Congress, issued a report that concludes that illegal aliens will be able to receive benefits under the House health care bill (H.R. 3200) through two major loopholes. (See CRS Report and FAIR Press Release, August 26, 2009).

According to its own website, CRS is a legislative branch agency that provides Congress with "policy and legal analysis" that is authoritative, objective and accurate. (CRS website). The latest CRS report validates what FAIR has been saying for the past month and a half — that illegal aliens will be able to receive taxpayer-funded health benefits under the House health care bill. (See FAIR's Legislative Updates, July 20, 2009; July 27, 2009 and August 3, 2009).

The House bill creates an "exchange" and "all individuals," which would include illegal aliens, are eligible to participate in the exchange. Anyone who participates in the exchange, and does not otherwise have health insurance, can either enroll in the public option plan created by the House bill or enroll in a private insurance plan. Accordingly, the first loophole that provides illegal aliens with health insurance is the ability for illegal aliens to freely enroll in the taxpayer-subsidized public option. According to CRS, "H.R. 3200 does not contain any restrictions on non-citizens — whether legally or illegally present, or in the United States temporarily or permanently — from participating in the Exchange." (CRS Report). Accordingly, illegal aliens can enroll in the public option, courtesy of the American taxpayers, to meet their health insurance needs. (See CNN.com, August 2009).

The second major loophole is the failure to require any meaningful verification procedure for taxpayer-subsidized insurance credits. Under the House bill, individuals who buy private insurance through the Exchange may receive an affordability credit to offset the cost of insurance. This credit is ostensibly limited to individuals lawfully present in the U.S., but CRS (like FAIR) notes the complete absence of any provision in the House bill that requires verification of eligibility for the affordability credits. Without such a mechanism, there is nothing in the bill that will prevent illegal aliens from receiving this taxpayer subsidy to buy private health insurance.

These conclusions by CRS should eliminate any remaining doubt about whether illegal aliens will receive health benefits under the bill. As a result of this report, President Obama can no longer characterize the concerns about the illegal alien health care loophole under the bill as "misinformation." (See FAIR's Legislative Update, August 24, 2009 and FAIR's Health Care Podcast, August 24, 2009). In addition, Members of Congress can no longer claim the bill prevents coverage for illegal aliens, and the media can no longer suggest this concern is a "myth." (See FAIR's House bill summary and Townhall.com, August 27, 2009).

[Heracles 417]

H.R. 3200: Sec 246 — NO FEDERAL PAYMENT FOR UNDOCUMENTED ALIENS

Nothing in this subtitle shall allow Federal payments for affordability credits on behalf of individuals who are not lawfully present in the United States.

Edited September 14, 2009 by Booyah!

[Danno 1,228]

Worst of them all is the anchor babies. The amendment giving people citizenship, no questions asked needs to be amended asap.

You're exactly right (This time

Actually the intent of the 14 amendment was to protect the citizenship of ex-slaves as this amendment came right after the Civil war as some jurisdictions were claiming Blacks were Not Citizens and therefore not entitles to the same rights.

Read it for yourself, it does not say "anyone born in the USA is a citizen" as we often suppose.

<<<All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.>>>

-14th Amendment

"subject to the Jurisdiction" makes a big difference.

To believe this protection was pointed at aliens sneaking across our borders in the night is looney.

[Heracles 417]

Worst of them all is the anchor babies. The amendment giving people citizenship, no questions asked needs to be amended asap.

You're exactly right (This time

Actually the intent of the 14 amendment was to protect the citizenship of ex-slaves as this amendment came right after the Civil war as some jurisdictions were claiming Blacks were Not Citizens and therefore not entitles to the same rights.

Read it for yourself, it does not say "anyone born in the USA is a citizen" as we often suppose.

<<<All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.>>>

-14th Amendment

"subject to the Jurisdiction" makes a big difference.

To believe this protection was pointed at aliens sneaking across our borders in the night is looney.

It's ridiculous that so many people have been able to exploit this.

Whereas, as I said earlier, someone legitimately naturalized cannot become president yet these guys can. How can anyone not see a problem with this? This technically means that even Bin Laden and his wives could come here, have babies, be eligible to run for president and have the full range of benefits offered to citizens.

Anchor babies is the sole reason that Aus, amongst numerous other nations, amended their Constitution to specifically state only those born in the country who have at least one parent that is a citizen, are automatically eligible for citizenship.

Edited September 14, 2009 by Booyah!

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

I like how the one was lamenting how he had to struggle when he made the decision to come here illegally. Boo Hoo.

How can we afford NOT to build a wall?

[sjr09 155]

Booyah, hate to clue you in or break it to you gently but sadly your taxes you have or will pay on federal level are being used for this sort of nonsense. That is why we are so upset by it.

This is disgraceful. I hope non of the federal tax I pay is going to this sort of idiocy.

We have American kids (black, white and even Hispanic) that are in desperate need of good quality schools and teachers yet one state alone is spending over a billion to educate the kids of foreign nationals who are not even permitted to be here.

As I have said many times before, I am all for helping Americans out, however, I do not support $1 going to services for illegal aliens. As you know, I 110% support health care reform.

Worst of them all is the anchor babies. The amendment giving people citizenship, no questions asked needs to be amended asap.

If you pay tax, you are supporting illegal aliens. And for supporting health care reform 110% you will be paying for illegal aliens to have the care!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I like how the one was lamenting how he had to struggle when he made the decision to come here illegally. Boo Hoo.

How can we afford NOT to build a wall?

Does anyone know how much all those illegal immigrants are adding to the state in terms sales and payroll taxes? Anyone want to take a guess? Anyone know if the ratio of tax and sales revenue to tax burden they are and whether that ratio is any different from USC's within the same income levels?

Facts are funny things.

[Danno 1,228]

I like how the one was lamenting how he had to struggle when he made the decision to come here illegally. Boo Hoo.

How can we afford NOT to build a wall?

Does anyone know how much all those illegal immigrants are adding to the state in terms sales and payroll taxes? Anyone want to take a guess? Anyone know if the ratio of tax and sales revenue to tax burden they are and whether that ratio is any different from USC's within the same income levels?

Yes Steve and therein .... is the key to your point.

Most illegals have very low income due to a number of factors

1. no English

2. No visa

3. Very limited education

Sure if you find Americans who are so bad off that this is their "comparison" level I would imagine they would be an equal drain on the system.... in fact they might even be more due to taking up Jail space.

But rather than throw out vague concepts lets do it this way.

Mexican with wife and kid slips over the Border, arrives in city X

WHAT would you guess his income in the next 12 months (subject to withholding) would be on this typical guy?

Edited September 15, 2009 by Danno

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I like how the one was lamenting how he had to struggle when he made the decision to come here illegally. Boo Hoo.

How can we afford NOT to build a wall?

Does anyone know how much all those illegal immigrants are adding to the state in terms sales and payroll taxes? Anyone want to take a guess? Anyone know if the ratio of tax and sales revenue to tax burden they are and whether that ratio is any different from USC's within the same income levels?

Yes Steve and therein .... is the key to your point.

Most illegals have very low income due to a number of factors

1. no English

2. No payers

3. Very limited education

Sure if you find Americans who are so bad off that this is their "comparison" level I would imagine they would be an equal drain on the system.... in fact they might even be more due to taking up Jail space.

But rather than throw out vague concepts lets do it this way.

Mexican with wife and kid slips over the Border, arrives in city X

WHAT would you guess his income in the next 12 months (subject to withholding) would be on this typical guy?

Most illegals are here for work. The OP was about the financial burden of their children in public schools...so my questions centered around the financial cost.

Do you know?

[natty bumppo 289]

I like how the one was lamenting how he had to struggle when he made the decision to come here illegally. Boo Hoo.

How can we afford NOT to build a wall?

Does anyone know how much all those illegal immigrants are adding to the state in terms sales and payroll taxes? Anyone want to take a guess? Anyone know if the ratio of tax and sales revenue to tax burden they are and whether that ratio is any different from USC's within the same income levels?

Yes Steve and therein .... is the key to your point.

Most illegals have very low income due to a number of factors

1. no English

2. No visa

3. Very limited education

Sure if you find Americans who are so bad off that this is their "comparison" level I would imagine they would be an equal drain on the system.... in fact they might even be more due to taking up Jail space.

But rather than throw out vague concepts lets do it this way.

Mexican with wife and kid slips over the Border, arrives in city X

WHAT would you guess his income in the next 12 months (subject to withholding) would be on this typical guy?

** .. I'll hire them ....

no paperwork and they will do whatever I want ... including popping steven in the azz for a few $$$$$ more ....

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I like how the one was lamenting how he had to struggle when he made the decision to come here illegally. Boo Hoo.

How can we afford NOT to build a wall?

Does anyone know how much all those illegal immigrants are adding to the state in terms sales and payroll taxes? Anyone want to take a guess? Anyone know if the ratio of tax and sales revenue to tax burden they are and whether that ratio is any different from USC's within the same income levels?

Yes Steve and therein .... is the key to your point.

Most illegals have very low income due to a number of factors

1. no English

2. No visa

3. Very limited education

Sure if you find Americans who are so bad off that this is their "comparison" level I would imagine they would be an equal drain on the system.... in fact they might even be more due to taking up Jail space.

But rather than throw out vague concepts lets do it this way.

Mexican with wife and kid slips over the Border, arrives in city X

WHAT would you guess his income in the next 12 months (subject to withholding) would be on this typical guy?

** .. I'll hire them ....

no paperwork and they will do whatever I want ... including popping steven in the azz for a few $$$ more ....

Figures. More nutty drivel...

Natty, you might be take care with the choice of words there, sparky, because that sure sounds to me like a death threat.

[dalegg 143]

I believe Arizona schools receive part of their funding from property taxes just like California. You start getting a larger percentage of the population not paying property taxes then you get a funding problem if those families send children to school. How many illegals are paying property taxes? Whichever are, grant them amnesty now.

[natty bumppo 289]

I like how the one was lamenting how he had to struggle when he made the decision to come here illegally. Boo Hoo.

How can we afford NOT to build a wall?

Does anyone know how much all those illegal immigrants are adding to the state in terms sales and payroll taxes? Anyone want to take a guess? Anyone know if the ratio of tax and sales revenue to tax burden they are and whether that ratio is any different from USC's within the same income levels?

Yes Steve and therein .... is the key to your point.

Most illegals have very low income due to a number of factors

1. no English

2. No visa

3. Very limited education

Sure if you find Americans who are so bad off that this is their "comparison" level I would imagine they would be an equal drain on the system.... in fact they might even be more due to taking up Jail space.

But rather than throw out vague concepts lets do it this way.

Mexican with wife and kid slips over the Border, arrives in city X

WHAT would you guess his income in the next 12 months (subject to withholding) would be on this typical guy?

** .. I'll hire them ....

no paperwork and they will do whatever I want ... including popping steven in the azz for a few $ more ....

Figures. More nutty drivel...

Natty, you might be take care with the choice of words there, sparky, because that sure sounds to me like a death threat.

spoken like a true son of Arizona ...

death threat?

a chance to get home delivery for your dreams

does this mean ... you brother will beat up my brother?? you know the cop vs a citizen ...

Edited September 15, 2009 by Natty Bumppo

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Here's a report on the state of Texas. I would guess that Arizona and other states would have similar economic benefits from illegal immigrants:

UNDOCUMENTED IMMIGRANTS IN TEXAS: A FINANCIAL ANALYSIS

Illegal immigration is draining hundreds of millions from local governments but bolstering the Texas economy by $17.7 billion a year, the state comptroller estimates in a new report.

And when it comes to taxes, illegal immigrants are a boon:

• They cost the state $1.16 billion in services, such as public health services and education, but they pay $1.58 billion every year in taxes and fees, according to the report, released Thursday.
• That's a net profit to the state of $420 million.

But counties pay the price:

• They're taking in $513 million in local taxes and revenues -- but spending $1.44 billion in indigent care and law-enforcement costs.
• Cities and school districts suffer as well, the report said.

While the debate on the impact of illegal immigrants has roiled the state and nation, the study represents the first time Texas has comprehensively looked at the costs and financial benefits. An estimated 1.4 million illegal immigrants live in Texas.

Advocates for immigrants and business groups said the report shows that critics' claims about damage to the economy have been overblown and false.

The report says the absence of the illegal immigrants would decrease the gross state product by $17.7 billion a year.

http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/index.php?Article_ID=13938

[HAL 9000 96]

I believe Arizona schools receive part of their funding from property taxes just like California. You start getting a larger percentage of the population not paying property taxes then you get a funding problem if those families send children to school. How many illegals are paying property taxes? Whichever are, grant them amnesty now.

If they own a home, they pay property taxes.