Spouse Support - How much does she need?

[zhenia and brent 0]

BACKGROUND INFO:

My wife lives in Krivoy Rog, Ukraine. I have read about inflation in Ukraine and the declining value of the US dollar. Today one dollar buys 4.62 Hryvnia. My wife earns the equivelant of $60 US dollars per month. She lives with her mother, two brothers, and one sister-in-law. Her mother receives a pension equivelant to US $150.00 per month. Her brother earns the US equivelant of $280.00 per month. Her sister-in-law earns the US equivelant of $160.00 per month. In her city, she lives a middle-class life style in a pretty good part of town. Early in our relationship, my wife said she expects US $400.00 per month additional to afford her what she needs. I have been sending about $600.00 per month. She helps her family and spends money on what she needs.

I learned early in our relationship, that her Ukraine culture, does not allow her to speak comfortably about money topics. She has no history of receipts to reference her costs of living, and does not have a reasonable concept about how money works. She knows how to receive and spend.

I do not have a realistic concept (neither does she) of how much money it takes someone in her position to live in Krivoy Rog, Ukraine.

QUESTIONS:

Should I be sending more?

Is the amount I send plus what she makes, along with living at home with family, enough to support her?

Does anyone know about the cost of living in Krivoy Rog, Ukraine?

If anyone cares to volunteer how much they send a foreign spouse, I am interested to know.

Thank you.

Edited August 14, 2008 by zhenia and brent

[Yiyi and Chris 0]

Well I know about Russia culture that is almost the same as Ukraine (lived there for 5 years)... Girls do that!!! spend, spend and spend and don't care... Man has to pay for "everything"

I think that the amount that you are sending is reasonable actually more than reasonable, remember that she's gonna be moving to USA, she needs to learn how the US culture is, she needs to learn how to be independent and work for what she wants... don't get me wrong, you have to support her in every way, but in order for her to be successful in USA, you have to let her know!

In my case, well I have an open credit card for $10.000, I don't spend more than $600 each month...

[zhenia and brent 0]

Thanks for the information. I plan to show her how $ works when she arrives here (interview on the 28th of August!). I have tried to teach her about this in chats and on the phone... wow, what a challenge! I hope she catches on when she get here.

[Yiyi and Chris 0]

If you give me a couple of days I can find you a discouraging post about a Russian girl and a USC, I was amazed, I really hope that won't happen to you... let me try to look for it now....

[Yiyi and Chris 0]

Read this!!!

[Brad and Vika 129]

Hi Brent, has something changed this week? I thought the gentle-but-firm no was working for you. I see the same issues that the rest of "the guys" see, but I found that a firm no when I think the demand is not necessary works OK. You just have to be prepared for some pouting and disagreement. I think this is pretty common, and I wonder how a Russian/Ukrainian guy would handle it. I just ignore the pouting (easy, because she doesn't much), and meet each request with a firm discussion about budget. This tac came from the sound advice several married VJers gave me. They all told me that immediately caving and sending what is requested is a HUGE sign of weakness, and might earn you doormat status. I am not married yet, but definitely do not want to spend my life as an ATM with feet.

[Scott and Iryna 2]

My SO lived in Sumy, Ukraine. Several moths ago, she earned the equivalent of $200 per month, and lived alone in her own flat, and was able to make ends meet (barely). Back then, I asked her to quit her job, so she could focus on preparing to move to America. She was very reluctant, but eventually agreed. I sent her $400 per month, and that covered all of her expenses, plus a private English tutor 3 times per week, driving lessons, and such. She even found a way to go to the tanning salon (her skin is now like chocolate) and the occasional trip to the disco with friends. It was plenty of money. You are sending MORE THAN ENOUGH!

It will be very difficult for you to properly teach her budgeting remotely. My best advice to you is to give her an allowance when she comes over. Maybe $50 per week. That should be more than enough to spend on "extras", like getting her hair or nails done. If she wants to blow the whole wad on one pair of designer jeans, so be it. But don't give her more money until it's time for the allowance. It's effective, and it will also help you to control a budget for yourself.

Good luck...

[payxibka 10,044]

I feel for guys in this situation... Not only is my wife and economizer but demanded we go on a much stricter budget in order to put money in the bank. When she was in Ukraine I supoported her with covering the increased incidentals cost incurred for the visa plus $100 a month.

Edited August 14, 2008 by fwaguy

[Anastassia 0]

Interesting topic.... Just out of curiosity: do married women in former Soviet Union countries work ? I know several of them here and they either don't work and don't complain because husbands make enough or work and complain all the time what kind of losers they married that they have to work instead of staying home.

I am from Poland (which is not that far from them) and in my country majority of women work. Could be that former Soviet Union women are all stay-at-home wives ?

[payxibka 10,044]

Interesting topic.... Just out of curiosity: do married women in former Soviet Union countries work ? I know several of them here and they either don't work and don't complain because husbands make enough or work and complain all the time what kind of losers they married that they have to work instead of staying home.

I am from Poland (which is not that far from them) and in my country majority of women work. Could be that former Soviet Union women are all stay-at-home wives ?

My wife has worked outside the home, she is also now attending school in addition to PT work, so she can earn more than $6.85 per hour. She is a pharmacist by education and when we get her certified here in the USA... I will stay at home!!!!

[Anastassia 0]

She is a pharmacist by education and when we get her certified here in the USA... I will stay at home!!!!

Way to go

[zhenia and brent 0]

TO: Everyone who posted to my topic above.... THANKS!!

Related to my orginal post:

I am curious to know if anyone is sending money back to Ukraine to "help out" or support the family of your spouse. I know that some girls think differently... some work and send money home, others send nothing. My wife is one who wants to send as much home (to her Ukraine family) as possible, yet she wants all the benefits that the same money can afford us in the US. She does't get it... for example: if she has $700.00, she will send it (the whole $700.00) to her mother, and still want to spend the same $700.00 on herself. This is a sure way to financial problems, and ruin, over time.... sorry, I am not going to support an entire family before I support my own.

If you read my original post above, you know that I have been sending about $600.00 per month to live on until she and I are together here, in the US.... Hopefully, the interview will go well on August 28th, and she will be here on the 12th of September!! (hmmmm... my dad always said to be careful what I wish for - hahaha).... Anyway, the same $600.00 per month sent for her to live on in Ukraine, is supposed to be sent to her mother each month -- she informed recently. I just had to laugh when she said that was her expectation.... Of course, after I stopped laughing, I said no, and explained why.

This is comical in a sad sort of way. Not that my wife thinks money grows on trees in the USA.... but she does think that it comes a lot easier in large sums, than it does. She says that the way a man can show care for his wife is to "provide". ????????? Is this a generally conditioned belief of the females with in the Russian culture? What did I get myself into??? I am sure that everything will work itself out in the end for the best; that my wife will understand how earning and spending works, and that you can't spend one dollar twice and still have the same dollar in the bank to spend later. Lets see... $1.00 - $2.00 = $1.00. Are there any mathematicians who have time to show me how my wife's math works?

This reminds me of my son's concept of money when he was 3 years old... when going to the grocery, I would take him with me... he would watch as the groceries went through the line, then I would pay, for example with one $20.00 bill. He watched as the cashier gave me the change, for example, two one-dollar bills. He thought that going to the grocery was not only a way to have food for home, but a way to receive more money than you came into the store with. He would see me give a quantity of one bill (a $20.00), and receive two bills (two one-dollar bills) from the cashier. He was focused on quanty of bills, rather than face value on the paper that the money was printed. Often, he would say that we need to go to the grocery to get more money... just a funny memory of his childhood perceptions of the way things work from his vantage point, at three years old.

Is anyone else experiencing the same?

If yes, What is your solution?

[Wei&Shu(Joe) 2]

TO: Everyone who posted to my topic above.... THANKS!!

Related to my orginal post:

I am curious to know if anyone is sending money back to Ukraine to "help out" or support the family of your spouse. I know that some girls think differently... some work and send money home, others send nothing. My wife is one who wants to send as much home (to her Ukraine family) as possible, yet she wants all the benefits that the same money can afford us in the US. She does't get it... for example: if she has $700.00, she will send it (the whole $700.00) to her mother, and still want to spend the same $700.00 on herself. This is a sure way to financial problems, and ruin, over time.... sorry, I am not going to support an entire family before I support my own.

If you read my original post above, you know that I have been sending about $600.00 per month to live on until she and I are together here, in the US.... Hopefully, the interview will go well on August 28th, and she will be here on the 12th of September!! (hmmmm... my dad always said to be careful what I wish for - hahaha).... Anyway, the same $600.00 per month sent for her to live on in Ukraine, is supposed to be sent to her mother each month -- she informed recently. I just had to laugh when she said that was her expectation.... Of course, after I stopped laughing, I said no, and explained why.

This is comical in a sad sort of way. Not that my wife thinks money grows on trees in the USA.... but she does think that it comes a lot easier in large sums, than it does. She says that the way a man can show care for his wife is to "provide". ????????? Is this a generally conditioned belief of the females with in the Russian culture? What did I get myself into??? I am sure that everything will work itself out in the end for the best; that my wife will understand how earning and spending works, and that you can't spend one dollar twice and still have the same dollar in the bank to spend later. Lets see... $1.00 - $2.00 = $1.00. Are there any mathematicians who have time to show me how my wife's math works?

This reminds me of my son's concept of money when he was 3 years old... when going to the grocery, I would take him with me... he would watch as the groceries went through the line, then I would pay, for example with one $20.00 bill. He watched as the cashier gave me the change, for example, two one-dollar bills. He thought that going to the grocery was not only a way to have food for home, but a way to receive more money than you came into the store with. He would see me give a quantity of one bill (a $20.00), and receive two bills (two one-dollar bills) from the cashier. He was focused on quanty of bills, rather than face value on the paper that the money was printed. Often, he would say that we need to go to the grocery to get more money... just a funny memory of his childhood perceptions of the way things work from his vantage point, at three years old.

Is anyone else experiencing the same?

If yes, What is your solution?

I don't know this culture. I only know China and there it can vary a great deal by region and family. Chinese girls ask for support for family after marriage ( and often a "gift" at engagement) but they are very frugal...down to making you use less toothpaste to brush.

I sent my fiancee money for the first time recently (we're a couple about 15 months) when her cell phone broke. It took me 3 days to convince her to go pick up the money. When she did, she bought tea and clothes for me and paid for the shipping to US. She used her own money to buy a much less expensive phone than I had suggested.

My concern for you would be that you have a major unresolved issue concerning money in the relationship and you're hoping that you can change her once she is here. Not very likely that you'll be successful, as probably thousands of spouses who thought their spouse would change after marriage could attest to.

It seems you will be moving ahead to bringing her here soon and this issue really needs intense attention between you two (in my humble opinion). How much are you willing to move toward her system of spending money twice? (I was married to an American woman with this idea, not fun!) Is she willing to behave any more responsibly about finances now? If she isn't, the chances that contact with American soil will suddenly change her are nil.

I really think that you've identified something here that has the potential for disaster. I would be very very clear with her about what she needs to do to be trusted with your money. If she isn't willing to send receipts, no problem...next month you'll only send the amount she has receipts for from the previous month. If she can't demonstrate that she can understand money, budgeting, spending money once, I would say no problem, I will control all money and expenditures and you'll need to ask me every time you need something. I'll send this much to your family every month, period. If she demonstrate that she can be responsible with your families resources, you'll think about changing the rules. Until then, this is how things will be. It won't be pleasant if her first month here is spent maxing out your credit cards. The credit card companies aren't going to want to hear about "cultural differences" between you and your wife! I hope you spend every waking moment resolving this with her before it creates big trouble for you.

I really hope that you can resolve it before it becomes a financial and relationship mess. Good luck to you and stay strong!

[ronjie 0]

take the good advice from ur vj family and straiten this out ASAP before she gets here. I send my wife what she needs to cover her bills and to be an equal to me. In other words, if I eat out twice a week and go to the movies once a week. well then she should also live as I do. after all it is now our money. although the most responsible person with the knowledge of all the income and bills should take charge of the budjet. and as time goes by teach your spouse about everything you do with the finances. I told my wife the only money we will send to her family other than a true emergency would be about $100.00 a month. that is to cover the internet and phone in the house. so she would have easy and constant communication with her family. There is no way we can go on vacations and save for cars, college, home repairs, etc. if we send our money to them. yes we make more here, but we also need to spend more here. ( cost of living ).

you said they don't speak comfortably about money, yet early in your relationship she told you she expects $400.00 per month, hmmm..thats not what I call shy. you need to tell her point blank what your intentions are as far as money goes before she gets here. save yourself a lot of trouble if she does not agree. once you sign the affidavit of support and she adjust there is no turning back....good luck

[ChuckandOlga 0]

I am very fortunate enough that my future wife understands a little about the American economy. She is from Lugansk, Ukraine and when she was working she made the equivalent of about $11.00 USD a day. While she was working I was giving her $250 a month to offset any costs she might incur for daily life. I had a conversation with her that I would rather see her stay at home and to spend the quality time of raising her daughter so that she would not miss out of these precious years so she has quit her job. She has been also studying English at a school and her daughter as well. Later she has told to me that she will now need to find work because she needs more money for her daily life. Not once has she ever asked me to support her. I had offered to give her the $250 USD and then I had upped it to $400 USD. She was very grateful that I take care of her in this way. I had also asked her why she does not tell me about money matters that she is hurting in some form or another. Her response was she does not want to trouble me with her matters.

I have heard in the past of many horror stories of how women in Russia and in the former soviet country’s scam men for money. And I have tested her on all of this to see if she would take and take. Olga has never shown me that she is a scammer so we will continue on our path to bring her to America and to become married.

Olga has no idea of the American economy completely and this is understandable. I have told her for the first few months I shall pay all of the bills and she will watch me in this then later she will pay all of the bills and see in the bank register online just how much monies we have left over. I do joke with her that she will become the very expensive wife in America and she knows that I joke about this because of the horror stories.

I think also that $400 USD is more than enough to give to her. $800 to $900 hryvnia is a lot of money in Ukraine and this gives her some extra spending money for her trips to the lake and to drink beer on the park benches with her girlfriends… I always laugh about this. In America we would be arrested for drinking in open public LOL.

When Olga finally comes to America she will understand more and I will have to re-teach her about many things. After all she will be entering a new country, a new culture, new economics everything shall be completely different then what she knows of now.