divorce waiver filers, Did you also select battered spouse and got approved? or Is it just me?

[pompeilife 15]

 

I have seen few posts about filing rather with battered spouse or divorce waiver.

I have selected both on my i-751 application and My immigration officer also asked me If I am seeking to remove my conditions based on battered spouse and divorce waiver at my interview. 

I had no RFE,  my i-751 journey took a year, 

I have seen posts saying you cannot do both or something, but yea

I got approved after I selected battered spouse and divorce waiver. 

Is it just me?

[Mike E 11,723]

have seen posts saying you cannot do both or something

 

I know of at least one immigration lawyer who advises his clients to select (if appropriate)  both the divorce waiver and battered / cruelty boxes.  His rationale is if the petition is denied, then you can argue both bases for waiver in court.  Whereas if you pick just one box and are denied, you cannot argue the other basis in court … you would have to file a new I-751. 

Edited February 22, 2022 by Mike E

[pompeilife 15]

1 minute ago, Mike E said:

I know of at least one immigration lawyer who advises his clients to select (if appropriate) to select both the divorce waiver and battered / cruelty boxes.  His rationale is if the petition is denied, then you can argue both bases for waiver in court.  Whereas if you pick just one box and are denied, you can argue the other basis in court … you would have to file a new I-751. 

totally, I saw your posts the other time and I was with you 100% (and still with you 10000%)  but I saw another posts about how it can complicate the process or confuses the USCIS or something but I had no issue, not even RFE.. 

 

Edited February 22, 2022 by pompeilife

[pompeilife 15]

22 hours ago, Mike E said:

From the I-751 form:

 

I entered the marriage in good faith, and, during the marriage, I was battered, or was the subject of extreme cruelty, by my U.S. citizen or lawful
permanent resident spouse.

 

My understanding is that

 

* physical violence is not required to qualify for and prove this waiver.  

 

* verbal abuse qualifies 

 

 

I agree!! with you. 

Edited February 23, 2022 by pompeilife

[pompeilife 15]

 

20 hours ago, Mike E said:

IME every  IOs at interviews ask questions that were already asked and answered on the written form.  I don’t see anything strange about the question.  Asking the same question and having it affirmed is not a decision.  

 true, they even ask your birthdate, address to confirm all the info on the form. 

But, just because you get asked at the interview hahaha I have no idea where this person's logic comes from. 

[Angel2023 8]

On 2/22/2022 at 6:01 PM, Mike E said:

From the I-751 form:

 

I entered the marriage in good faith, and, during the marriage, I was battered, or was the subject of extreme cruelty, by my U.S. citizen or lawful
permanent resident spouse.

 

My understanding is that

 

* physical violence is not required to qualify for and prove this waiver.  

 

* verbal abuse qualifies 

 

 

That's true: Extreme cruelty means mental abuse not physical

[Mike E 11,723]

On 2/23/2022 at 2:02 PM, Rocio0010 said:

 your chances of approval do not depend on what you pick. They depend on how strong of a case you build. 

Approval can happen from USCIS or from an immigration judge. 
 

The point of selecting both (if and only if both apply) is to increase ones chances of winning in immigration court if USCIS denies the petition.  

[Villanelle 4,121]

1 hour ago, Mike E said:

Approval can happen from USCIS or from an immigration judge. 
 

The point of selecting both (if and only if both apply) is to increase ones chances of winning in immigration court if USCIS denies the petition.  

Technically the Judge can't adjudicate 751s. Odd fact, but true. They either uphold the denial from USCIS or send it back to USCIS to adjudicate again. 

 

 

[Mike E 11,723]

6 hours ago, Villanelle said:

Technically the Judge can't adjudicate 751s. Odd fact, but true. They either uphold the denial from USCIS or send it back to USCIS to adjudicate again. 

 

 

That would seem like an endless loop and this this is difficult for me to accep  
 

https://www.ilrc.org/sites/default/files/resources/i-751_advisory_final.pdf says

 

“An immigration judge can only review the reasons for the USCIS denial. Therefore, if the conditional resident wishes argue that the petition should be approved on a different basis than the one adjudicated by USCIS, s/he cannot do so in immigration court.”

 

The above affirms what OP, others, and myself have been saying. If multiple waiver conditions apply, then check corresponding boxes.  Failure to do precludes options for the conditional LPR in front of an immigration judge 

 

“While the I-751 is pending with the immigration court, conditional residence will be extended until the immigration judge makes a final determination on the petition.”

So i might not know what adjudicate means but I’ve found several lawyers saying that immigration judges can decide I-751 petitions. 

 

I stand behind my advice to check both boxes if they both apply. 

Edited March 2, 2022 by Mike E

[Villanelle 4,121]

58 minutes ago, Mike E said:

That would seem like an endless loop and this this is difficult for me to accep  
 

https://www.ilrc.org/sites/default/files/resources/i-751_advisory_final.pdf says

 

“An immigration judge can only review the reasons for the USCIS denial. Therefore, if the conditional resident wishes argue that the petition should be approved on a different basis than the one adjudicated by USCIS, s/he cannot do so in immigration court.”

 

The above affirms what OP, others, and myself have been saying. If multiple waiver conditions apply, then check corresponding boxes.  Failure to do precludes options for the conditional LPR in front of an immigration judge 

 

“While the I-751 is pending with the immigration court, conditional residence will be extended until the immigration judge makes a final determination on the petition.”

So i might not know what adjudicate means but I’ve found several lawyers saying that immigration judges can decide I-751 petitions. 

 

I stand behind my advice to check both boxes if they both apply. 

Im not disagreeing with your advice. Personally I think anyone eligible to file under 751 abuse waiver should because if the spouse was or becomes a USC they will qualify for Naturalization at the 3yr mark that way. Often they are discouraged from doing the abuse waiver and told to do only the divorce waiver as its simpler to prove.

 

But yes the 751 denial process is an ongoing never seem to end loop.

 

Adjudicate means to make a formal decision whereas the judge makes a determination (determination being denial is correct and stands or denial was incorrect and USCIS needs to adjudicate it again in a favorable way). 

[Mike E 11,723]

20 minutes ago, Villanelle said:

Im not disagreeing with your advice. Personally I think anyone eligible to file under 751 abuse waiver should because if the spouse was or becomes a USC they will qualify for Naturalization at the 3yr mark that way. Often they are discouraged from doing the abuse waiver and told to do only the divorce waiver as its simpler to prove.

 

But yes the 751 denial process is an ongoing never seem to end loop.

 

Adjudicate means to make a formal decision whereas the judge makes a determination (determination being denial is correct and stands or denial was incorrect and USCIS needs to adjudicate it again in a favorable way). 

So a judge can decide to order USCIS to approve the petition.  Seems like a difference with no practical distinction  other than USCIS can drag its feet. Which leaves it open  to an APA suit.  

[Villanelle 4,121]

36 minutes ago, Mike E said:

So a judge can decide to order USCIS to approve the petition.  Seems like a difference with no practical distinction  other than USCIS can drag its feet. Which leaves it open  to an APA suit.  

No,  they cant order them to approve but rather they reject the denial and tell them to do it again.

 

To make it even more difficult when the judge does send back 751s its like the K getting sent back. It technically goes back but then nothing. You typically need to file another 751 so USCIS has something to adjudicate.

 

The strategy of selecting multiple waiver boxes (including hardship) is so that IF you are denied and it ends up in front of the judge you have multiple paths to ask for reconsideration on.

 

IMO that reason is not typically something a ROC filer should be overly concerned with unless they have a weak case or a specific reason for thinking it would be denied.

 

But even if you didn't select multiple boxes and are denied you can immediately file another 751 with other boxes checked. The problem with picking multiple boxes is every box you check you must prove. 

 

Typically if someone files as divorce and abuse and don't have enough proof of the abuse they will get an RFE about the abuse aspect. They can either reply with the proof needed or request the abuse box be dropped and for it to be adjudicated as divorce only.

[Ontarkie 13,918]

~~Judgmental and non conductive posts have been removed. These forums are not open to attacking members who have asked a question.~~

[Angel2023 8]

On 3/2/2022 at 9:16 AM, Mike E said:

That would seem like an endless loop and this this is difficult for me to accep  
 

https://www.ilrc.org/sites/default/files/resources/i-751_advisory_final.pdf says

 

“An immigration judge can only review the reasons for the USCIS denial. Therefore, if the conditional resident wishes argue that the petition should be approved on a different basis than the one adjudicated by USCIS, s/he cannot do so in immigration court.”

 

The above affirms what OP, others, and myself have been saying. If multiple waiver conditions apply, then check corresponding boxes.  Failure to do precludes options for the conditional LPR in front of an immigration judge 

 

“While the I-751 is pending with the immigration court, conditional residence will be extended until the immigration judge makes a final determination on the petition.”

So i might not know what adjudicate means but I’ve found several lawyers saying that immigration judges can decide I-751 petitions. 

 

I stand behind my advice to check both boxes if they both apply. 

Mike she is right. It's a never ending loop because they can refile and go through the process again. However, I do agree that they should check both boxes because if they qualify for it why not? They can become a USC under three year rule in that case. 

[Mike E 11,723]

4 hours ago, Angel2023 said:

Mike she is right. It's a never ending loop because they can refile and go through the process again. However, I do agree that they should check both boxes because if they qualify for it why not? They can become a USC under three year rule in that case. 

1. Then what is the immigration judge’s purpose in a removal proceedings?
 

2. Why is it that multiple sources claim the immigration judge can review the case?

 

3. Why is that multiple sources claim the CPR can bring new evidence and call witnesses to argue the case?

 

4. Why is it that multiple sources claim the immigration judge can make a final determination?

 

5. I’d like to hear from someone who was a CPR and went to removal processings, and presented a divorce certificate.  I’d like to know what actually happened in court and what happens after the judge made a “decision”, and what the “decision” was.