Obamacare Architect: Lack of Transparency Was Key Because ‘Stupidity Of The American Voter’ Would Have Killed Obamacare

[JohnR! 5,495]

QED.

I cannot believe you came out and admitted to the fact that you would not be able to comprehend it.

Since you're making such astounding progress, perhaps you can read this and get back to us with a brief summary:

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/PLAW-111publ148/pdf/PLAW-111publ148.pdf

That should keep you busy for a while. And no, there are no pictures in it.

[The Nature Boy 4,224]

I cannot believe you came out and admitted to the fact that you would not be able to comprehend it.

Since you're making such astounding progress, perhaps you can read this and get back to us with a brief summary:

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/PLAW-111publ148/pdf/PLAW-111publ148.pdf

That should keep you busy for a while. And no, there are no pictures in it.

Home Run

[DavenRoxy 1,073]

QED.

Yes, it "had to be demonstrated" that you are a blowhard, attempting to mock others for not reading the ACA, when in fact you have not done so yourself. Good on you. Nicely done.

Oh wait, I am assuming you didn't read it, and that's not fair... can you tell the group here how many of the 906 pages you actually read?

Edit - BTW, it's Q.E.D., not QED.

Edited November 11, 2014 by DavenRoxy

[JohnR! 5,495]

You seem to have me confused by someone who gives a flying flip.

Yes, it "had to be demonstrated" that you are a blowhard, attempting to mock others for not reading the ACA, when in fact you have not done so yourself. Good on you. Nicely done.

Oh wait, I am assuming you didn't read it, and that's not fair... can you tell the group here how many of the 906 pages you actually read?

Edit - BTW, it's Q.E.D., not QED.

[DavenRoxy 1,073]

You seem to have me confused by someone who gives a flying flip.

Not confused at all. Just pointing out your general hypocrisy, assininity, and attempted mockery of your betters. If I were you, I'd throw in something like this:\

Good thing I'm not you...

[GandD 5,966]

Guys, if you don't want to talk about the topic at hand, don't post. If you two continue to attack each other, expect a thread ban. And that includes questioning this warning.

[DavenRoxy 1,073]

So no off topic posts will be allowed from now on on VJ. Got it.

[GandD 5,966]

So no off topic posts will be allowed from now on on VJ. Got it.

Its the attacks Dave. They've never been allowed and they're not going to be.

[DavenRoxy 1,073]

Its the attacks Dave. They've never been allowed and they're not going to be.

I'm down with that, always have been. Here's hoping it works the same for all...

[Merle 458]

In countries with single payer systems are people able to sue doctors and hospitals for millions if something doesnt go right?

[JohnR! 5,495]

In some countries doctors are required to keep malpractice insurance. Their work is still their responsibility.

In countries with single payer systems are people able to sue doctors and hospitals for millions if something doesnt go right?

[Merle 458]

I was in New Zealand a couple years ago and a few in our group went to a place called Adrenaline Forest where you can ride a zip line high above the forest from tree to tree. The people running the place asked if their were any Americans in the group. The Americans who raised their hands were all made to sign a liability waiver. I just don't think a single payer system will work very well in the sue happy U.S. just for that reason. There needs to be reform on many levels.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Tort reform

That's about 2% of the healthcare system. Not even close to being a solution.

Here is the problem. Obama care sucks, I agree. It needs major overhauls. The Repubs want to repeal it. Ok and replace it with what ?

We already pay almost 2 X times as a % of GDP in health costs compared to other 1st world nations. We are already paying for health care for everyone, but at champagne price. every man woman and child should be picked up in a Limo for their doctor appt for what we pay.

But you argue, we have the best in health care in the world. No we don't. Most of the countries with single payer systems score as well or better than us in most categories for 1/2 the cost.

I am a convert , a believer . I have looked at the data and read a lot of material. I know it hurts to admit we are not number 1 and suck at something, but it's the truth.

We all holler about lowering taxes and keeping more of what we earn. Can you imagine lowering the cost of something by 9% of our total GDP

It's like drowning in the ocean and you are picked up by a leaky old raft. The raft is not ideal and you have to bail a lot. So you decide to scrap it. Guess what at least you had a raft, then you will have nothing.

And there you have it. That is what your newly elected Congress will attempt to do - leave you with nothing.

[rlogan 2,036]

It's like drowning in the ocean and you are picked up by a leaky old raft. The raft is not ideal and you have to bail a lot. So you decide to scrap it. Guess what at least you had a raft, then you will have nothing.

I hate analogies for just this reason. No, it isn't like drowning in the ocean.

We have a medical monopoly called the AMA (American Medical Association) that restricts the number of medical graduates per year. It could be doubled if they felt like it. What other industries do we let determine themselves how many competitors there will be? It's absurd. We have the largest financial corporations in the USA bribing congressmen to make sure insurance companies get to administer every dollar of medical transactions. Injecting insurance companies anywhere raises costs by 15% just to administer, but then it interferes in service as well.

The insurance companies were writing this bill while making noises about not wanting it, just like the banks did to get the Federal Reserve Act passed. This point is in harmony with the OP about how easily duped the electorate is. The media plays a perverse role in framing every damned issue as Democrat vs. Republican even when both sides are getting money stuffed in their pockets by the financial powers. Not one person convicted in the massive loan securitization fraud that brought down our whole economy. The mainstream media is owned by people with interests contrary to the electorate.

This state is the most expensive in the country on a lot of things for both medical and dental. We pay less doing 100% cash in the Philippines than we do for the 20% co-pay on a lot of things in Alaska. A lot of people we know go to Mexico or Canada for dental work, same reason. Cheaper to do a vacation plus the dental work than to have it done here. There are a lot more policy options when the insurance companies and government aren't restricting what we are allowed to buy, and one of them is self-insurance.

We should not be forcing the young to buy insurance for the old. First of all, they aren't buying health care. They are buying executives of insurance companies a new yacht every year. That's what these mindless melodramatic allegories above get us. But I am not exaggerating here - these financial corporation bonuses are in the millions. The white heat of truth - transparency - is the antidote to crony capitalism.

[GandD 5,966]

~~One member thread banned for failing to adhere to in thread warning and post removed~~

Edited November 11, 2014 by GandD