Gifts for Proof Ongoing relationship

[Utha 10]

Is it okay to attach the receipts of Western Union to complete of our Proof Ongoing Relationship?.

[payxibka 10,048]

Is it okay to attach the receipts of Western Union to complete of our Proof Ongoing Relationship?.

depends... some people think this type of evidence might give the impression that you are providing a monetary incentive to you fiance(e) to come to the USA

[Utha 10]

depends... some people think this type of evidence might give the impression that you are providing a monetary incentive to you fiance(e) to come to the USA

Thank you for the quick feedback.

[Indy90 21]

Is it okay to attach the receipts of Western Union to complete of our Proof Ongoing Relationship?.

Many people have said the same thing about money being sent to fiancées, although it is perhaps different if you were doing a CR1. Rather than send her money, how about sending her/him other types of gifts (if you are not already), like personal letters, clothes, etc?

Personally, I think that there is a difference between sending $200 for a special occasion (like her birthday so that she/he can go out to a nice restaurant with friends) than sending $100 every month, but that is my personal opinion.

[Utha 10]

Many people have said the same thing about money being sent to fiancées, although it is perhaps different if you were doing a CR1. Rather than send her money, how about sending her/him other types of gifts (if you are not already), like personal letters, clothes, etc?

Personally, I think that there is a difference between sending $200 for a special occasion (like her birthday so that she/he can go out to a nice restaurant with friends) than sending $100 every month, but that is my personal opinion.

Thank you for the feedback. Well, my address can not be reach by the post man, so that he prefer just to send gifts in cash.

[Indy90 21]

Thank you for the feedback. Well, my address can not be reach by the post man, so that he prefer just to send gifts in cash.

That is understandable...if I were you, I would make sure that the money is not sent monthly and that it is usually for a very specific reason, like I suggested. There are varying opinions on sending money to fiancées here on vj, but I would say that it is better to error on the side of caution. It also varies according to the consulate, and I have no idea what Indonesia is like. If it is not possible to receive mail at your address, perhaps he could send it to a friend or relative at a different address, with your name on the packaging. Personally, I believe that a monthly letter and the occasional gift through the mail make for great proof of a relationship, because it is something that you physically can bring to the interview. Emails and phone records are nice as well, but 35 hand written letters is something special.

[JimVaPhuong 4,864]

Is it okay to attach the receipts of Western Union to complete of our Proof Ongoing Relationship?.

First, you understand that proof of an ongoing relationship is not required with the petition, right? Aside from the required forms and documents, the only evidence you need to provide is proof that you've met within the past two years, and proof of your intent to marry. Any proof of an ongoing relationship is frontloading for the consulate.

With that in mind, any evidence you decide to frontload should probably be selected to either address what the consulate might consider to be red flags in your case, or to show that your relationship meets social and cultural norms. If there's any chance that a specific type of evidence might only raise suspicions with the consulate then you should leave it out.

Do Western Union receipts address any red flags? They might, if you think it's possible the consulate might believe the petitioner is being paid to help the beneficiary immigrate. Showing a steady flow of cash in the other direction might help reduce that suspicion.

Do Western Union receipts show your relationship meets social and cultural norms? It depends on the country. In third world countries where incomes are low there might be an expectation that a girl who is engaged to an American has a little better standard of living. In countries where a formal engagement is customary it might be expected that the fiance is helping to provide support for his fiancee, since a formally engaged couple might be considered to be married for all intents short of shacking up and making babies.

Do Western Union receipts demonstrate a real relationship? It depends on how the consular officer wants to interpret them. He could just as easily interpret them as showing the petitioner is paying off a debt.

Can Western Union receipts raise suspicions with the consulate? Yes, depending on the circumstances. Remittances might make the consulate suspect the petitioner is 'buying' a wife, especially if it looks like he might have a motive to do so. For example, if the beneficiary is young and pretty and the petitioner is much older then it might look like the petitioner is buying a trophy or sex toy. Another example would be if the petitioner is disabled and the beneficiary is a trained nurse then it might look like the petitioner is buying a live-in caretaker. Remittances can also make the consulate suspect there might be some money dealing going on behind the scenes. For example, if the petitioner doesn't qualify on his own to sponsor the beneficiary because his income is too low, the consulate might wonder where he's getting the money for the remittances.

Think about your own case. Think about your own country. Most of all, try to think like a consular officer. What would money transfer receipts say to the consular officer, and is it the sort of message you want to send to them? Because of the possibility that the receipts could generate suspicion, some people choose to save them until the interview, and only provide them if the consular officer asks to see them.

[Utha 10]

First, you understand that proof of an ongoing relationship is not required with the petition, right? Aside from the required forms and documents, the only evidence you need to provide is proof that you've met within the past two years, and proof of your intent to marry. Any proof of an ongoing relationship is frontloading for the consulate.

With that in mind, any evidence you decide to frontload should probably be selected to either address what the consulate might consider to be red flags in your case, or to show that your relationship meets social and cultural norms. If there's any chance that a specific type of evidence might only raise suspicions with the consulate then you should leave it out.

Do Western Union receipts address any red flags? They might, if you think it's possible the consulate might believe the petitioner is being paid to help the beneficiary immigrate. Showing a steady flow of cash in the other direction might help reduce that suspicion.

Do Western Union receipts show your relationship meets social and cultural norms? It depends on the country. In third world countries where incomes are low there might be an expectation that a girl who is engaged to an American has a little better standard of living. In countries where a formal engagement is customary it might be expected that the fiance is helping to provide support for his fiancee, since a formally engaged couple might be considered to be married for all intents short of shacking up and making babies.

Do Western Union receipts demonstrate a real relationship? It depends on how the consular officer wants to interpret them. He could just as easily interpret them as showing the petitioner is paying off a debt.

Can Western Union receipts raise suspicions with the consulate? Yes, depending on the circumstances. Remittances might make the consulate suspect the petitioner is 'buying' a wife, especially if it looks like he might have a motive to do so. For example, if the beneficiary is young and pretty and the petitioner is much older then it might look like the petitioner is buying a trophy or sex toy. Another example would be if the petitioner is disabled and the beneficiary is a trained nurse then it might look like the petitioner is buying a live-in caretaker. Remittances can also make the consulate suspect there might be some money dealing going on behind the scenes. For example, if the petitioner doesn't qualify on his own to sponsor the beneficiary because his income is too low, the consulate might wonder where he's getting the money for the remittances.

Think about your own case. Think about your own country. Most of all, try to think like a consular officer. What would money transfer receipts say to the consular officer, and is it the sort of message you want to send to them? Because of the possibility that the receipts could generate suspicion, some people choose to save them until the interview, and only provide them if the consular officer asks to see them.

Thank you for the feedback JimVaphuong. Your explaination makes a sense.

[Utha 10]

That is understandable...if I were you, I would make sure that the money is not sent monthly and that it is usually for a very specific reason, like I suggested. There are varying opinions on sending money to fiancées here on vj, but I would say that it is better to error on the side of caution. It also varies according to the consulate, and I have no idea what Indonesia is like. If it is not possible to receive mail at your address, perhaps he could send it to a friend or relative at a different address, with your name on the packaging. Personally, I believe that a monthly letter and the occasional gift through the mail make for great proof of a relationship, because it is something that you physically can bring to the interview. Emails and phone records are nice as well, but 35 hand written letters is something special.

Thank you Indy90. Yes, i think i will just use my family address who stays under the postal reach where he could send both airmail or package.

[Indy90 21]

Thank you Indy90. Yes, i think i will just use my family address who stays under the postal reach where he could send both airmail or package.

Jim definitely gave some very good advice...he said basically what I was trying to say in much fewer words. Where evidence is very helpful is during the interview, which is why I am stressing things like letters, which I am already sure that you know about (aka I am not trying to be redundant).

If he sends letters to your parent's house, I would try the US Postal Service. It costs a little less than a dollar I believe for 10 business day delivery, whereas Fedex and UPS cost like $50. Whatever I have sent to Ecuador has arrived in about a week without problems, although it may be a bit different in Indonesia.

[BlueBonnet 84]

I sent a western union money order reciept in as proof. My fiance wanted a fish tank for his birthday, it was x amount of $ ... I think I sent him enough to pay for 1/2 of it as a birthday present. Its not like I could buy one and ship it down. This way he got what he wanted and I helped a bit, plus he got what he wanted instead of me buying something he wouldnt like. But I have also sent him clothes - hockey stuff, its the Canadian in me eh .. I couldnt help it. Hes sent me Dallas Cowboys stuff. Both those exchanges were Christmas presents. We have exchanged cards, he has sent me chocolate, Ive sent him hershy kisses for valentines day one year.

I think keeping it real is whats its about. Would you do this is you were with that person ie: give them money to buy what they wanted on a special occasion. Or are you trying to " buy " into a marriage.

Someone said here once ... look at it from a third person point of view, what do you think they think when seeing this " proof ".

I personaly see nothing wrong with western union money orders, but I can also understand how that third person may see it differently.

[Advanced Aardvark 82]

Is it okay to attach the receipts of Western Union to complete of our Proof Ongoing Relationship?.

My grandfather used to say, "It is better to go into the woods loaded for bear, and to meet a rabbit, than to have it go the other way around." Go to the interview loaded for bear.

[tom&tanya 48]

I'm not sure I understand how $100 or $200 dollars a month would raise red flags. It seems perfectly logical that someone with a much better standard of living would send his or her fiancé(e) a small amount each month to make life a little easier. If you have lots of other proof of an ongoing relationship, I can't see this little "care package" being any kind of negative indicator. It would make more sense about raising concerns if there was a large lump sum payment of something like that but I'm sure a person doing that would not make mention of it.

[Gary and Alla 3,696]

I'm not sure I understand how $100 or $200 dollars a month would raise red flags. It seems perfectly logical that someone with a much better standard of living would send his or her fiancé(e) a small amount each month to make life a little easier. If you have lots of other proof of an ongoing relationship, I can't see this little "care package" being any kind of negative indicator. It would make more sense about raising concerns if there was a large lump sum payment of something like that but I'm sure a person doing that would not make mention of it.

Tom

In most consulates, I doubt it would. There are some consulates that are just rife with visa fraud and to them almost anything is a red flag. Kiev is not one of those.

In many other consulates, Kiev included, the reaction of a steady contribution of money is "Meh...who cares?" It really is not much of anything either way. So while it may not be a "red flag" in some consulates, it is, at best, really low on the totem pole of "evidence".

[payxibka 10,048]

Tom

In most consulates, I doubt it would. There are some consulates that are just rife with visa fraud and to them almost anything is a red flag. Kiev is not one of those.

In many other consulates, Kiev included, the reaction of a steady contribution of money is "Meh...who cares?" It really is not much of anything either way. So while it may not be a "red flag" in some consulates, it is, at best, really low on the totem pole of "evidence".

In addition, if you are relying on this information to "make or break" your case for a bonafide relationship, then you have bigger problems....

Edited June 29, 2010 by payxibka