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Posted
I have mixed feelings. Anybody that wants to should be able to buy insurance. I would rather unlawful permanent reseidents have insurance, rather than show up at the ER to take care of their healthcare needs.

On the otherhand, it will be difficult to determine whether or not the premium paid by the UPR will contain any taxpayer subsidies, since the program itself will be have to be heavily subsidized to compete with private insurance companies. As it stands now, a stand-alone public option will have to charge more than what private insurance plans are charging, if the current state plans are to be used as evidence.

Which is what others would prefer. We have to think things through a little more pragmatically.

We'll see what the public plan charges when its in effect, and as it stands, and how it plays as a competitor. If what you say (to scare against it, perhaps) is true, then people simply won't sign up for the public option and stick with 'cheaper' (LOL) private coverage.

See Dan + Gemvita's post above yours.

Different reason for the plan, maybe?

Different legislation, more likely. I suppose such a law would lose its purpose once a competitive national plan would go into pragmatic effect.

But I would be curious as to the premium costs of MN public plans as compared to non-employer sponsored (self-employed) plans.

Minnesota has 2 programs. MinnesotaCare which is subsidized care for low income families and individuals.

The other is MCHA http://www.mchamn.com/.

Premiums charged to policyholders are generally higher than rates for comparable policies in the marketplace By law, MCHA premiums must be set between 101% - 125% of the weighted average for comparable policies.

keTiiDCjGVo

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Filed: K-1 Visa Country: Russia
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Posted
Taxpayer funded subsidies shouldn't go to to illegals, but I don't see the problem letting them buy policies (other than those provided by public option) with their own money. The larger the pool gets, the cheaper it is for everyone. And it'll just mean illegal money will end up benefiting legals... its just kind of how insurance works.

I see a problem. They're illegals. If they have money in the first place to buy the policy, they almost certainly are earning money somehow. That's illegal.

I have no problem with people coming here and would actually like if it was easier. But if you make it easy for people to live here after violating the law and coming here illegally, it doesn't help the country. You need to either enforce the law or change the law. Making a system that is specifically designed to not catch people that are violating the law disregards any definition of justice that I can think of and should be offensive to every law abiding American.

The point is, a healthcare system should be pretty much ambiguous to immigration status except when providing tax payer funded subsidies. If you require every person to have a legal status in the US, in order to buy health coverage, then you make the system less efficient. As each provider, government or otherwise has to spend money and time verifiying each applicants legal status.

Keep it simple, don't make the healthcare system the immigration police.

Why should the government run healthcare system ignore who someone is? As it is now, health insurance requires a social security number. You have to be positively identified (usually this is wrapped in with getting a job in the first place when you get employer provided health insurance).

Trying to run a system where you aren't required to have ID and SS# would actually be more expensive and less efficient since you would have to create a system to document undocumented aliens that would be oblivious to the fact that they are undocumented. I'm not suggesting that we need to run a background check on every person as they apply for health care. Just require them to have the basic documents required to work in America or a valid entry visa and I-94.

Not always the case. BCBS and Humana can do 000-00-0000 as SSN options during enrollment. We should all know this, having spouses that didn't have SSNs at the time of enrollment.

Well, my wife had a SS# at time of enrollment. But you have really missed the point. A system which required that someone be documented wouldn't be more complicated or expensive, or less efficient. We all know a SS# isn't a requirement for legal residency, but a list of documents that establish legal residency is pretty easy to create. Requiring someone to have something on that list at time of enrollment wouldn't be difficult and would actually simplify the system.

Filed: AOS (apr) Country: Colombia
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Posted

Sure, I didn't miss that point. That could be legislated for public plans. But for private plans? That seems a little too punitive and definitely in the realm of having business acting like the government- which is the flipside, but equal in magnitude as the government controlling the entire system.

I'd prefer to look at things from several other points of view- mainly, a humanist perspective in not denying health care to human beings, specially if they can pay for it (regardless of where the money came from on the labor side of things).

Wishing you ten-fold that which you wish upon all others.

Filed: Country: England
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Posted (edited)
Sure, I didn't miss that point. That could be legislated for public plans. But for private plans? That seems a little too punitive and definitely in the realm of having business acting like the government- which is the flipside, but equal in magnitude as the government controlling the entire system.

I'd prefer to look at things from several other points of view- mainly, a humanist perspective in not denying health care to human beings, specially if they can pay for it (regardless of where the money came from on the labor side of things).

That's too broad a brush, though. What if the money to pay for the treatment came as a result of heroin dealing?

Admitted it's an extreme case, but nonetheless, it's just an extension of working here illegally. (Not to say that illegal aliens are drug dealers - that was badly put - but the source of the money is illegally earned).

Edited by Pooky

Don't interrupt me when I'm talking to myself

2011-11-15.garfield.png

Filed: AOS (apr) Country: Colombia
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Posted
Sure, I didn't miss that point. That could be legislated for public plans. But for private plans? That seems a little too punitive and definitely in the realm of having business acting like the government- which is the flipside, but equal in magnitude as the government controlling the entire system.

I'd prefer to look at things from several other points of view- mainly, a humanist perspective in not denying health care to human beings, specially if they can pay for it (regardless of where the money came from on the labor side of things).

That's too broad a brush, though. What if the money to pay for the treatment came as a result of heroin dealing?

Admitted it's an extreme case, but nonetheless, it's just an extension of working here illegally. (Not to say that illegal aliens are drug dealers - that was badly put - but the source of the money is illegally earned).

Of course its an extreme case, one that should never be used to argue against an ill-perceived 'broad brush.' ;)

Wishing you ten-fold that which you wish upon all others.

Filed: Country: Belarus
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Posted
Taxpayer funded subsidies shouldn't go to to illegals, but I don't see the problem letting them buy policies (other than those provided by public option) with their own money. The larger the pool gets, the cheaper it is for everyone. And it'll just mean illegal money will end up benefiting legals... its just kind of how insurance works.

I see a problem. They're illegals. If they have money in the first place to buy the policy, they almost certainly are earning money somehow. That's illegal.

I have no problem with people coming here and would actually like if it was easier. But if you make it easy for people to live here after violating the law and coming here illegally, it doesn't help the country. You need to either enforce the law or change the law. Making a system that is specifically designed to not catch people that are violating the law disregards any definition of justice that I can think of and should be offensive to every law abiding American.

The point is, a healthcare system should be pretty much ambiguous to immigration status except when providing tax payer funded subsidies. If you require every person to have a legal status in the US, in order to buy health coverage, then you make the system less efficient. As each provider, government or otherwise has to spend money and time verifiying each applicants legal status.

Keep it simple, don't make the healthcare system the immigration police.

Seeing how these same people also make that point in everything that has anything to do with illegal aliens, it is easy to see why there is a 'disgust' level with the American public at large.

For decades we have been promised E-Verify in exchange for 7 illegal alien amnesties, but the same enablers and cheerleaders always have the same lame excuses while moving the mass amnesties right along. Verification is very doable. We already have a workable system in place that is not being used to its full and intended purpose. And these same people do all they can to block it and any other proposal to deny illegal aliens.

The American people are getting wise to it and it pisses us off. It's about time to stop this charade once and for ever.

"Credibility in immigration policy can be summed up in one sentence: Those who should get in, get in; those who should be kept out, are kept out; and those who should not be here will be required to leave."

"...for the system to be credible, people actually have to be deported at the end of the process."

US Congresswoman Barbara Jordan (D-TX)

Testimony to the House Immigration Subcommittee, February 24, 1995

Filed: Country: Belarus
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Posted
Well it looks like all of you very angry people will have to swallow another amnesty/legalized path.

With 10+% unemployment and no end in sight I do believe it would be political suicide for anyone stupid enough to even try it. So suck on that for a while and swallow! ;)

"Credibility in immigration policy can be summed up in one sentence: Those who should get in, get in; those who should be kept out, are kept out; and those who should not be here will be required to leave."

"...for the system to be credible, people actually have to be deported at the end of the process."

US Congresswoman Barbara Jordan (D-TX)

Testimony to the House Immigration Subcommittee, February 24, 1995

Filed: AOS (apr) Country: Colombia
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Posted
Well it looks like all of you very angry people will have to swallow another amnesty/legalized path.

With 10+% unemployment and no end in sight I do believe it would be political suicide for anyone stupid enough to even try it. So suck on that for a while and swallow! ;)

No end in sight??

See, peejay, not everyone is shriveled up in their own misery. Or stuck in a weird Freudian slip.

Like I've stated above, go through things a little more rationally and you'll get better points across.

Wishing you ten-fold that which you wish upon all others.

Filed: Citizen (pnd) Country: Mexico
Timeline
Posted (edited)

hi y'all! :D

I just follow brother Hal's advice: To wish people ten-fold that which they wish upon all others

and may I add...So suck on that for a while and swallow ;) it's up to the person to see if they are going to profit or not from this :)

Edited by TävôLuDô

05/01/08 Green Card in mailbox!!

06/05/10 Real GREEN Card RECEIVED!

01/17/13 Sent application for US Citizenship!!!

01/19/13 Arrived to Arizona Lockbox

01/24/13 Notice of Action

01/25/13 Check cashed

01/28/13 NOA received by mail and biometrics letter mailed as per uscis.gov

02/14/13 Biometrics appointment

03/18/13 In-line for inteview

Filed: AOS (apr) Country: Colombia
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Posted

Or the treasury. For all we know, any future legalization could always increase the treasury's revenue stream, but that is OTT. Allowing illegals to fund their own private health insurance policies would keep costs lower for the other insured via a reduction of actual medical service provider costs and would increase revenues for the insurers themselves, and would push illegals to avoid the ER because they'd be healthier. A win win.

But wait... I guess that makes that humamistic, pro-business, pro-recovery point of view bitterly pro-illegal. Oh well. Some will see what they want to see, as usual.

Wishing you ten-fold that which you wish upon all others.

Filed: Citizen (pnd) Country: Mexico
Timeline
Posted

blah blah illegal immigration stomp stomp slam!

see ya have a nice weekend and happy dreams :D

05/01/08 Green Card in mailbox!!

06/05/10 Real GREEN Card RECEIVED!

01/17/13 Sent application for US Citizenship!!!

01/19/13 Arrived to Arizona Lockbox

01/24/13 Notice of Action

01/25/13 Check cashed

01/28/13 NOA received by mail and biometrics letter mailed as per uscis.gov

02/14/13 Biometrics appointment

03/18/13 In-line for inteview

 

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