Read some scary things about marriage fraud

[Gary and Alla 3,696]

One of my high school friends went to the Moldova/Ukraine region; met a girl there, and had this romance online going for a while. The girl kept asking for items like clothes, perfumes etc. She never asked for money, but my friends radar went on alert when she specifically asked for brand name clothing. The girl was really subtle about it,and at first my friend would dismiss the requests like, 'well, is rough over there to get a job to pay for basic things so i don't mind helping her...' Eventually however, not sure how he woke up, but he realized he was being scammed. So like other members say, is really hard to have one specific tip to spot a scammer out there, but, best to go by common sense, and if you can spend more time to get to know this person in the flesh, then that might be your best indicator.

Good luck.

From living in Ukraine for 2 years I can say no sincere Ukrainian would ask for such things. They just will not. A scammer will, an insincere woman will, but the normal hard working, hard living Ukrainian woman would never do so. If you are dealing with a Ukrainian (I know you're not but maybe the same thing applies) and they start asking for perfume BEFORE you marry them, look out! I think it is real important to learn the culture of the people also. So, go live in Kenya for a couple years! No, seriously, read up on it, study it. If the actions of a person are consistently out of line with tradition and culture, something is amiss

[justashooter 430]

Things to look for? That is a big one. No two people are alike, but common things I have observed:

1. During the "romance" phase of chatting/phone, you get hit for bills to help pay for. Like a brother/father/mother needs an emergency operation, schooling, government issues.

2. Asks for up front money to "bribe" the government for visa/travel permits.

I agree that someone asking for money to pay for thigns the family has to deal with anyway is a red flag.

I have personally bribed Chinese government officials in the process of immigrating my wife.

I would expect bribery to be common in Kenya, as well. They will hold you up over police reports, school records, birth certificates, etc.

[lucyrich 20]

Then there is the support affidavit that one would file, and if I was a target for fraud, I get stuck with the bill for 10 years.

Minor factual correction: The I-864 affidavit of support has five possible terminating conditions, and the passage of ten years on the calendar isn't one of them. They are:

Sponsor dies

Immigrant dies

Immigrant becomes a US Citizen

Immigrant leaves the US permanently

Immigrant accumulates 40 quarters of work for social security purposes

That last one seems like it might be ten years, but only if the immigrant is continuously working. Furthermore, if the immigrant is married, social security will credit work done by each spouse, so it would only take five years to earn 40 quarters of work if married and both spouses are working.

But if the immigrant is continuously earning quarters of work for social security purposes, you probably don't have too much to worry about with the affidavit of support anyway. The potential problem comes if the immigrant stops working. And if that happens, there's no telling when the affidavit of support will terminate. It could literally be a lifetime commitment. Divorce certainly won't end it.

It's worth noting that, barring murder or suicide, none of the terminating conditions are under the sponsor's control.

I'd say you're right to be cautious after spending only one week together in person. And even if there's no scam involved, a cross-cultural marriage has some complications that a same-culture marriage doesn't face. With ordinary same-culture marriages in the US having around a 50% divorce rate, that's a scary thought.

I'd echo the sentiments to get to know her, and get to know her culture and family as much as you can. And watch out for red flags.

[paschwartz 0]

You guys are awesome! After reviewing of all that has been said here, I need to step back and take a good look at the big picture. While the law simply says you must have met in person within the past 2 years, the inference from everything I've read here is that you really should be extremely familiar with each other. That doesn't happen in a week, and it is made more complicated by virtue of the fact that USC is not exposed to the foreign fiancé(e) on a daily basis simply due to geography. Daily exposure via the phone or the internet really doesn't seem sufficient, yet the USCIS and the CO's continue to approve K-1 visas for marginal cases. My case would be marginal at best if I filed now. So time will tell if this is going to be the real thing or not.

[pushbrk 14,465]

You guys are awesome! After reviewing of all that has been said here, I need to step back and take a good look at the big picture. While the law simply says you must have met in person within the past 2 years, the inference from everything I've read here is that you really should be extremely familiar with each other. That doesn't happen in a week, and it is made more complicated by virtue of the fact that USC is not exposed to the foreign fiancé(e) on a daily basis simply due to geography. Daily exposure via the phone or the internet really doesn't seem sufficient, yet the USCIS and the CO's continue to approve K-1 visas for marginal cases. My case would be marginal at best if I filed now. So time will tell if this is going to be the real thing or not.

It's quite common to have additional visits during the process even if you file after only one visit. Use all your time wisely, including assisting her in getting to know you and your life and what her life would be like with you.

[baron555 934]

Daily exposure via the phone or the internet really doesn't seem sufficient, yet the USCIS and the CO's continue to approve K-1 visas for marginal cases.

I don't really think one can make such a categorical statement. Every case and every relationship is different.

To the original poster.

What is the content of the email discussions? (I really don't want you to tell the forum, that's your business, but just something for you to think about.)

Do you exchange photos of each other in everyday situations?

Can you verfiy you are communicating with the same person?

What about Skype? This is way better than emails, SMSs and phone calls. You can talk and see each other. (Skype is free.)

Are you both good at writing and describing your feelings in words? (Some people are and some are not.)

Had you been communicating with other women prior?

How did this woman come into your life?

Are the discussions about every day happenings or more like I love you so much and I miss you so much?

Just trying to stimulate some thoughts.

Good luck. Use your head (the upper) but also follow your heart.

Phil

[EasyRider 3]

You guys are awesome! After reviewing of all that has been said here, I need to step back and take a good look at the big picture. While the law simply says you must have met in person within the past 2 years, the inference from everything I've read here is that you really should be extremely familiar with each other. That doesn't happen in a week, and it is made more complicated by virtue of the fact that USC is not exposed to the foreign fiancé(e) on a daily basis simply due to geography. Daily exposure via the phone or the internet really doesn't seem sufficient, yet the USCIS and the CO's continue to approve K-1 visas for marginal cases. My case would be marginal at best if I filed now. So time will tell if this is going to be the real thing or not.

Forget about the fraud thing for a second. Lets say that she's genuinely interested in you and that your relationship is "legitimate," to use a very cold term to describe a relationship of any kind. But lets put that aside for a second. There are countless threads started here regularly talking about how two people met and the relationship soured soon after the spouse came to the USA. Then you read about the history and you see that they've "known" each other for about a year some even much less and petitioned for a K1 visa after the first visit. These relationships failed not because there was some kind of fraud but because some of these people didn't take the time to get to know their spouse before they got married. So there are other things to consider besides fraud. I would take the advice of everyone here and take it slow. If you can, go visit her as often as possible and stay a little longer than a week. Give yourself the time to get to know her and her family and most importantly give her the opportunity to get to know you. After all, she's leaving her family, her home and everything and everybody she knows and loves for YOU! She's risking a lot too. Who knows, you could end up being a horrible person and now she's a foreigner stuck in a country that doesn't like foreigners married to an a$$hole. I'm not saying you are one but you get my meaning. Don't be put off by the horror stories you've read here, you may be passing on something wonderful. But be careful and take your time.

[lucyrich 20]

yet the USCIS and the CO's continue to approve K-1 visas for marginal cases.

Understand that it's absolutely not their business to determine whether the marriage will be long-lasting and happy. It's ONLY their business to determine whether the alien is just in it for the green card. And determining someone's intent is difficult, so they don't always get that one right.

An interesting article, which has made the rounds and been mentioned on VJ before, but is probably worth digging up again, is this one

http://cis.org/marriagefraud

It's an account from a former consular officer, describing the problem of marriage fraud from his point of view. He's got some interesting stories to tell, and has seen a lot of scam artists. Sure, his point of view is biased and distorted, but then so is the point of view of most people here (mine included). His bias and distortion are from a much different perspective and based on a much different set of experiences than what you usually hear on VisaJourney, so it can be quite illuminating to read what he says.