A Question of PROOF ....

[ILoveTan 0]

I was reading the thread about the petition that was rejected due to lack of proof that there was a relationship prior to meeting.... here is my problem:

I met my fiance the last time I was in Vietnam. I can prove I was in Vietnam and even in his city with plane ticket stubs but I have NO proof that we were together. I chatted with him every day by yahoo but never saved ONE message, email, etc and had no pictures from that trip. HERE IS MY ISSUE.....>>>> Since this is a REAL relationship, I didn't know I wanted to marry him until my SECOND trip to visit him. Only THEN did I inquire about this process and find out I needed "proof". I didn't know I was going to marry him in the beginning so why would I save yahoo chats and emails? That makes NO SENSE. Of course NOW I am saving everything from pictures to receipts but there is no way to prove that we communicated for 6 months prior to my second visit. To me, if you have that kind of proof, it seems that your relationship is LESS real and more likely a scam because you pre-planned to have "proof" - does this make sense????? What should I do about my lack of proof of meeting him on my third trip to Vietnam? (I have been in Vietnam 4 times now).

Also, went to see a lawyer who told me 50% or more of visa applications are denied here. Said it was nearly impossible to get approved. #######?! Is he just saying that because he wants my money? He also told me that having $100,000 in cash was not good enough if I didn't work for 2007 (which I did not). He said co-signers for k1 are not accepted in Vietnam anymore and only co-signers for k3. Can I hear again (sorry for the paranoia) that $100,000 liquid assets will be accepted in lieu of a tax return for 2007 .... I was working on a BOOK for petes sake and will get an advance for AT LEAST $100,000 (not to mention royalties for years that will well exceed the $$ limit they want). Why does this have to be so difficult. I love him and he loves me.... I HATE THIS. Please, what do you all think about the question of proof and the lawyer telling me its almost impossible???????

Linda - crazy in love with Tan

[ILoveTan 0]

oh p.s. the lawyer (marc ellis by the way for all of you who think he is the best - he struck me as rude, strange and not very bright, sorry, but its that was my impression - plus the consulate in vietnam doesnt like him, why hire a lawyer who the officials DONT LIKE DEALING WITH?) also said that the consulate runs credit checks, background checks, phone checks, checks where you live and who you live with.... its that involved. ????? Is this true? I have NEVER heard this before and have consulted with other lawyers. I was previously married and I live with my ex-husband now because he is my BEST FRIEND. Now I wouldn't state that on any paperwork but Marc Ellis said, oh, the consulate runs phone records, they know who lives where, etc etc.... that sounds like bull to me... we rent our house, its in MY name and the phone is only in MY name.... I dont know for certain but isnt all that a little involved?? Talk about feeling discouraged after talking with Mr. Ellis.... UGH. Why doesnt the consulate just shoot me up with truth serum and lock me in a room with no food or water for days and ask if I really love my fiancee .... if its really like Mr. Ellis says, where does it end? TROI OI (oh my GAWD!! In Vietnamese language) :-)

[Teacher Mark 53]

oh p.s. the lawyer (marc ellis by the way for all of you who think he is the best - he struck me as rude, strange and not very bright, sorry, but its that was my impression - plus the consulate in vietnam doesnt like him, why hire a lawyer who the officials DONT LIKE DEALING WITH?) also said that the consulate runs credit checks, background checks, phone checks, checks where you live and who you live with.... its that involved. ????? Is this true? I have NEVER heard this before and have consulted with other lawyers. I was previously married and I live with my ex-husband now because he is my BEST FRIEND. Now I wouldn't state that on any paperwork but Marc Ellis said, oh, the consulate runs phone records, they know who lives where, etc etc.... that sounds like bull to me... we rent our house, its in MY name and the phone is only in MY name.... I dont know for certain but isnt all that a little involved?? Talk about feeling discouraged after talking with Mr. Ellis.... UGH. Why doesnt the consulate just shoot me up with truth serum and lock me in a room with no food or water for days and ask if I really love my fiancee .... if its really like Mr. Ellis says, where does it end? TROI OI (oh my GAWD!! In Vietnamese language) :-)

You are coming to the wrong site to slam Marc Ellis young lady. Maybe he gave you a dose of reality. Can you handle it?

[Minya's wife 24]

What do you mean by this statement?

What should I do about my lack of proof of meeting him on my third trip to Vietnam? (I have been in Vietnam 4 times now).

If on your second trip to Vietnam you began to inquire about the paperwork, fiance visa and began saving your ...why do you not have proof of your 3rd and 4th trip there?

As far as your paperwork goes...you need minimal proof to get your initial petition approved here at the USCIS service center. For the I-129F you must prove that you and your fiance met at least once during the two year period leading up to you filing the petition. You do that w/ the stamps in your passport, your plane tickets, some receipts from your time there and some photographs.

It is at the consulate visa interview, that your burden of proof is more significant. There you are proving an ongoing communication(relationship). So if it was during your second trip to Vietnam that you became engaged, state that on your initial petition...(in the question inquiring how you met) and then you will need to prove your relationship from that point forward.

For the consulate related details you're seeking, perhaps those who have gone though the Vietnam consulate will chime in and give you details regarding the process there.

Good luck,

-P

Good luck.

[truffles 2]

OI OI OI!!!! the lady is simply expressing her experience ,,,,you may think Marc Ellis is the best thing since sliced bread ...and good for you ...you of course, have the right to defend him. You are in a position to be able to explain what he did for you if you have used his services you could have constructive information ....but our primary purpose here is help each other - the OP is asking for confirmation that this information is correct...she is seeking help from people who have been there - she is a little frustrated because as i read her post she has more or less had her hopes dashed ( at least that her perception) and in her shoes i might have written the same kind of sentiment in my haste .....so lets just ease up on the defensive and see if anyone can add to her experience.

[pushbrk 12,247]

I was reading the thread about the petition that was rejected due to lack of proof that there was a relationship prior to meeting.... here is my problem:

I met my fiance the last time I was in Vietnam. I can prove I was in Vietnam and even in his city with plane ticket stubs but I have NO proof that we were together. I chatted with him every day by yahoo but never saved ONE message, email, etc and had no pictures from that trip. HERE IS MY ISSUE.....>>>> Since this is a REAL relationship, I didn't know I wanted to marry him until my SECOND trip to visit him. Only THEN did I inquire about this process and find out I needed "proof". I didn't know I was going to marry him in the beginning so why would I save yahoo chats and emails? That makes NO SENSE. Of course NOW I am saving everything from pictures to receipts but there is no way to prove that we communicated for 6 months prior to my second visit. To me, if you have that kind of proof, it seems that your relationship is LESS real and more likely a scam because you pre-planned to have "proof" - does this make sense????? What should I do about my lack of proof of meeting him on my third trip to Vietnam? (I have been in Vietnam 4 times now).

Also, went to see a lawyer who told me 50% or more of visa applications are denied here. Said it was nearly impossible to get approved. #######?! Is he just saying that because he wants my money? He also told me that having $100,000 in cash was not good enough if I didn't work for 2007 (which I did not). He said co-signers for k1 are not accepted in Vietnam anymore and only co-signers for k3. Can I hear again (sorry for the paranoia) that $100,000 liquid assets will be accepted in lieu of a tax return for 2007 .... I was working on a BOOK for petes sake and will get an advance for AT LEAST $100,000 (not to mention royalties for years that will well exceed the $$ limit they want). Why does this have to be so difficult. I love him and he loves me.... I HATE THIS. Please, what do you all think about the question of proof and the lawyer telling me its almost impossible???????

Linda - crazy in love with Tan

Since you've been to Vietnam four times now and as I recall have spent some significant time there, proof of a relationship wouldn't normally be your concern. I'm sure you'll have more time together before the visa interview. Sometimes reality really sucks though. Your case isn't "normal" so "normally" may not apply.

For starters, your relationship so far, has been between a married woman and a single man. At best, you'll file a fiance petition after a recent divorce, with said petition ending up in one of the highest fraud Consulates in the world. Your indignance, however justified you may think it to be, will not serve you well there.

Yes, you may be required to show evidence you and your current/soon to be former husband have separate domicile. This is a fairly common requirement from high fraud posts, for newly divorced petitioners. Yes, the Consulate can and will investigate any and all the things Marc Ellis indicated, so you should be prepared to humbly comply with those requests, even if they are "demands".

One thing you must avoid at all costs, is any misrepresentations, such as referring to a current spouse as a former spouse.

If you have a contract that shows you are due an advance, you certainly could use that to help satisfy the public charge concerns but if you don't have such a contract and are instead speculating, I would caution you to be careful in your representations in that regard as well.

Your posts give me the impression that like me but for somewhat different reasons, you are just the kind of person an underpaid cynical government bureaucrat would really enjoy "inconveniencing", so if I were you, I'd find a way to start thinking more in terms of "humble compliance" than your potentially well founded indignance.

I'd be interested in hearing about any second opinions you get from immigration attorneys in Vietnam.

[Minya's wife 24]

push,

Has the OP posted before, am I missing something. She only states that she was married before, and now lives w/ her ex-husband.

I was previously married and I live with my ex-husband now because he is my BEST FRIEND.

Why would you say:

For starters, your relationship so far, has been between a married woman and a single man. At best, you'll file a fiance petition after a recent divorce,...

Maybe she's posted before and I've missed it, but I do not see anything in her current post to state she is still married, or even recently divorced.

-P

[DerekJ 0]

pshbrk....she said she was previously married but lives in the same house as her ex-husband. She does not say how long she has been divorced.

[Teacher Mark 53]

OI OI OI!!!! the lady is simply expressing her experience ,,,,you may think Marc Ellis is the best thing since sliced bread ...and good for you ...you of course, have the right to defend him. You are in a position to be able to explain what he did for you if you have used his services you could have constructive information ....but our primary purpose here is help each other - the OP is asking for confirmation that this information is correct...she is seeking help from people who have been there - she is a little frustrated because as i read her post she has more or less had her hopes dashed ( at least that her perception) and in her shoes i might have written the same kind of sentiment in my haste .....so lets just ease up on the defensive and see if anyone can add to her experience.

I actually prefer flatbread. Regardless ,I do have one piece of advice that I am willing to share with the OP:

If you are using Yahoo Messenger then the chats will be stored on your computer automatically.

[Y's_habibitk 2]

OI OI OI!!!! the lady is simply expressing her experience ,,,,you may think Marc Ellis is the best thing since sliced bread ...and good for you ...you of course, have the right to defend him. You are in a position to be able to explain what he did for you if you have used his services you could have constructive information ....but our primary purpose here is help each other - the OP is asking for confirmation that this information is correct...she is seeking help from people who have been there - she is a little frustrated because as i read her post she has more or less had her hopes dashed ( at least that her perception) and in her shoes i might have written the same kind of sentiment in my haste .....so lets just ease up on the defensive and see if anyone can add to her experience.

I actually prefer flatbread. Regardless ,I do have one piece of advice that I am willing to share with the OP:

If you are using Yahoo Messenger then the chats will be stored on your computer automatically.

Actually you need to set that under "preferrences" then "archive"

[rebeccajo 14]

pshbrk....she said she was previously married but lives in the same house as her ex-husband. She does not say how long she has been divorced.

ILoveTan -

Did you not recently post inquiring about the best place to obtain a quickie divorce?

It's unfortunate that you equate what Mr. Ellis told you with incompetence. That's rather a 'shoot the messenger' mentality, don't you think?

[ILoveTan 0]

Ok - I was married to my best friend (if I explained the circumstances, you would understand why we got married) but it was not a "real" marriage, we didn't even have sex. Obviously, those details aren't going to be asked for but my NOW ex husband went to Guam to obtain our divorce since I can get the divorce decree in about 1 more week. I am in Vietnam now. So, I will be officially divorced in 1 week - then I will have an engagement party with Tan and file the k1 visa.

I apologize if I ruffled your feathers about Marc Ellis... but here are 2 cold hard facts and not opinion: 1)the consulate here does not like him and if they want to be bitchy and see Marc Ellis as your attorney, do you think that will make them less bitchy or MORE? Secondly, the man has a vietnamese wife but YELLED AT HER while I was there, talked down to her and ordered her out of the room. I am sorry, but I do not respect anyone like that. He didn't listen to me, and didn't know anything about divorces out of the u.s. such as Guam or Dominican Republic. There were a lot of things he didn't know and he SHOULD. So that is my opinions, facts and feelings about him. If he helped you, great - but he seemed tired, exasperated and like he didn't want to help anyone at all. He was like, "this is basically a lost cause but you can hire me if you really want". EGADS. Also, he didn't believe me that I was in love and asked me about 10 times if I had sponsered someone before, etc etc.... so enough about Mr. Ellis - I just think the other Vietnam filers here should have all the perspectives.

So in 1 week I am officially divorced. I will file the k1. I have receipts, hotels, 400 photos in every and all places plus bizarre photos like us getting our hair washed together... you just couldnt have that if you werent together alot. So, I am stressed alot because I was married and am doing the quickie divorce but I am in love and STILL have to wait 6 months or MORE for his interview.... I cant wait 6 months in the u.s. for my divorce to be final THEN another 6 months for his interview... it will kill me, SERIOUSLY. This guy is my SOULMATE. I never even believed in that before him, but it's really true. Can't I explain the quickie divorce exactly that way?!? I have to go back to the U.S. for work, I cant stay in Vietnam with Tan or I WOULD and time wouldnt have been of the necessity this way. Is that understandable?

The only other thing I stress about is my weird financial situation. But its explainable and I WILL be able to show the $$$ as long as $100,000 is good enough and a 2007 tax return is NOT required. Thanks so much to everyone who posted, I am not trying to upset anyone, I just can't live without Tan and I don't know where to turn, I don't want to make a mistake.....

Linda

lindachaidez@yahoo.com

[ILoveTan 0]

Oh and just to clarify - I have been in vietnam 5 times total .... on my fourth trip (sorry, I think I said third before) I met Tan, that was last time in Vietnam. I was married then, we weren't dating ... just friends. We talked by internet from September 2007 until now. I told my husband I was falling for someone else and he said he wanted whatever made me happy. I didnt know anything about this process at the time which is why I dont have saved proof of any communications with Tan before now. Of course I can prove I was in Vietnam and in his home town city (which is where we met last time).

This is my fifth trip and I came to see him. Its almost been 2 months together, every day. Around the 1 month mark I began reading, making inquiries. It just never occured to my pea brain that there would be a waiting period and a lengthy process to bring him to america to be with me.... I just figured, get a divorce, remarry - end of story, you know? I only didnt divorce before because for what? I didnt want to date or look for love... I was happy with my job and with my best friend (husband) - I've never really felt that warm, gushy, or (well lets just say it) horny for men before Tan. So don't ask me why a short skinny asian man makes me hotter than hell - but he DOES and that is basically the whole story (I could get into the mushy girl stuff too if you want and tell you how gentle, sensitive, affectionate, sweet, funny and completes my soul in a way I thought was only for fairytales....but it would probably bore you to sleep!) ;-). What would you do in my place? Divorce takes 6 months to be final in the U.S. mainland. 2 weeks in Guam. Why would I want to wait?!? Will I have an opportunity to explain this to the consulate?

Finally, I am just curious but for those of you who had good experiences with Marc Ellis.... did you hire him to help you with your visa application or do you just know of him or have heard good about him? Really, I would like to know how many here actually used him as their lawyer. How many were approved after using him? Maybe I am just stressed and misjudged him or judged to harshly... please sympathize, I am REALLY REALLY REALLY STRESSED AND WORRYING. Perhaps the fault is mine, maybe I will take a couple of Zanax and meet with him again when I am not a high strung mess! :-P I really apologize if I was too harsh on him, I am a writer and sometimes my creative skills get the better of me and I go overboard and go on and on (can you tell?). Thanks for understanding all... I need you guys. This is my whole lifes happiness right here....

Linda

CRAZY IN LOVE WITH TAN

[StillThePrettiest 3]

I cant wait 6 months in the u.s. for my divorce to be final THEN another 6 months for his interview... it will kill me, SERIOUSLY. This guy is my SOULMATE.

we are ALL waiting, some of us for longer than that, and most of us for people who are our 'soulmates'... of course we all feel that our own suffering / love / relationship trumps all others, and in many ways that's healthy, but in other ways it's just not helpful

this is a LONG AND DIFFICULT PROCESS, however you go about it; divorces or not

very few of us will die going through it; we'll just be as patient as we can and get through it how best we can, and that would be my thoughts to you

do what you can to speed up the process and make things simpler, by all means, but your waiting time is NOT out of the ordinary, by any stretch of the imagination... although none of us would choose it, many of us agree that in the end it has made our relationships stronger, so perhaps you can look at it that way

[Teacher Mark 53]

OI OI OI!!!! the lady is simply expressing her experience ,,,,you may think Marc Ellis is the best thing since sliced bread ...and good for you ...you of course, have the right to defend him. You are in a position to be able to explain what he did for you if you have used his services you could have constructive information ....but our primary purpose here is help each other - the OP is asking for confirmation that this information is correct...she is seeking help from people who have been there - she is a little frustrated because as i read her post she has more or less had her hopes dashed ( at least that her perception) and in her shoes i might have written the same kind of sentiment in my haste .....so lets just ease up on the defensive and see if anyone can add to her experience.

I actually prefer flatbread. Regardless ,I do have one piece of advice that I am willing to share with the OP:

If you are using Yahoo Messenger then the chats will be stored on your computer automatically.

Actually you need to set that under "preferrences" then "archive"

I stand corrected. My fault.