Chinese Birth Certificate for person born in the 1930's

[macron 0]

Hi.  My father was born in Mainland China in the late 1930's, moved to Taiwan as a child, then moved to United States where he's currently a citizen.  He's thinking about retiring in South America, so he'll need a birth certificate to live there for more than a few months at a time.  However, China didn't issue birth certificates when he was born.  I saw a few threads saying that China can issue a notarial birth certificate, which may work, but that his parents will need to go with him to the government office or he'll need certified evidence of who his parents are.  His parents are deceased and the only evidence that he has of who his parents are is a certified Taiwan hukou.  Since he left Mainland China as a child in the 1940's, he's not aware that they issued him an ID number.  He's also a U.S. citizen, so if it existed, I assume they'd cancel it.  He's also not aware of anyone in China who can testify who his parents were, let alone recognize my father.

 

Has anyone been in a similar situation?  Is a Taiwan hukou enough to get a birth certificate?  I wrote to a Chinese lawyer two weeks ago and haven't heard back.  Let me know if you know a reliable representative whom my father can hire to get the certificate on his behalf.  Also, let me know if you have experience using a notarial birth certificate in countries besides the U.S.  Thanks.

[Chancy 6,233]

*** Moved from CRBA sub-forum to the China regional forum, for country-specific input ***

 

[Timona 3,972]

How'd he become USC?

[macron 0]

He applied for U.S. citizenship in the 1970's when the hukou was enough.  The U.S. probably had many more cases of immigrants without formal birth certificates back then.

[Pleasework89 46]

From my understanding of how they do the 公证处 which is what you need for your dad? They understand that if you were born before 1996( when they started issuing birth certificate?) You just need to give them some official document that states both their parents name, your dad's name and date of birth. With those things listed, they might be able to issue you a notarial birth certificate. 

[Family 3,560]

I would attempt to authenticate his hukou w the Taiwan Embassy in the US .…..

perhaps do an English translation ,get translation notarized and slap an apostille for good measure. 

 

He can also begin dialogue ( shoot a email) with the proposed country of retirement and get a pre screen of document.

 

Would not even bother w China..

[RandyW 149]

11 hours ago, macron said:

He applied for U.S. citizenship in the 1970's when the hukou was enough.  The U.S. probably had many more cases of immigrants without formal birth certificates back then.

The hukou record IS China's official record of his birth. From this hukou record, the notarial certificate of birth is produced at a notarial office in China. This IS an official Chinese certificate of birth.

 

DO NOT attempt to fabricate your own interpretation of a "birth certificate". It WILL be rejected.

 

Medical certificates of Birth - those issued at the time of birth were not issued before 1994. The Notarial Certificate of Birth, issued from information contaioned in the hukou book, serves this purpose.

 

The notation on the notarial birth certificate is 出生公证书, or chu sheng gong zheng shu, which is what you need to ask for at the Gong Zheng Chu, or 公证处֤֤֤.

 

Edited May 25, 2023 by RandyW

[RandyW 149]

13 hours ago, macron said:

Hi.  My father was born in Mainland China in the late 1930's, moved to Taiwan as a child, then moved to United States where he's currently a citizen.  He's thinking about retiring in South America, so he'll need a birth certificate to live there for more than a few months at a time.  However, China didn't issue birth certificates when he was born.  I saw a few threads saying that China can issue a notarial birth certificate, which may work, but that his parents will need to go with him to the government office or he'll need certified evidence of who his parents are.  His parents are deceased and the only evidence that he has of who his parents are is a certified Taiwan hukou.  Since he left Mainland China as a child in the 1940's, he's not aware that they issued him an ID number.  He's also a U.S. citizen, so if it existed, I assume they'd cancel it.  He's also not aware of anyone in China who can testify who his parents were, let alone recognize my father.

 

Has anyone been in a similar situation?  Is a Taiwan hukou enough to get a birth certificate?  I wrote to a Chinese lawyer two weeks ago and haven't heard back.  Let me know if you know a reliable representative whom my father can hire to get the certificate on his behalf.  Also, let me know if you have experience using a notarial birth certificate in countries besides the U.S.  Thanks.

from the United States Dept. of State reciprocity tables on Taiwan - 

 

Exceptions: Records on Chinese who came to Taiwan from mainland China after World War II date back only to the date they first applied for registration with the local Office of Household Registration and are based on information provided by the applicant.

Comments: Immigrant visa applicants are required to submit a current Household Registration Record as well as a birth certificate.  Applicants who are unable to obtain their birth certificate – for example, those born in Taiwan during the Japanese occupation that ended in 1945, or those who came from mainland China following WWII — may provide their initial Household Registration Record as an alternative to the birth certificate.

 

If there is no obtainable record of his birth in China ( as it seems may be the case), then it seems that the Taiwan hukou serves as his birth record and that Taiwan does not produce a notarial certificate.

The US government accepted his "certified Taiwan hukou" - I expect that his target South American country will also, especially if the certification includes an English translation of the record of his birth - that is exactly what the Chinese notarial certificate of birth is.

 

No - Taiwan is NOT "part of China" for this purpose. It sounds like the record of his existence was first established in Taiwan, even if there is possibly an older hukou book somewhere (unlocatable) in China.

Edited May 25, 2023 by RandyW

[macron 0]

Thanks for everyone's replies.

 

@Pleasework89:  I think you're right, but from previous threads on this board, the process may require multiple trips or may not work at all.  We're hoping to get more information before going to China.

 

@Family:  We think alike   We got the official English translation of the Taiwan hukou and showed it to a few South American lawyers - they all rejected it saying that it wouldn't pass as a birth certificate.  I'll need Taiwan or their U.S. Embassy to write an official document explaining why my father can't produce a standard birth certificate and why the hukou should be accepted as an alternative.  Dealing with fewer governments would make my life easier.

 

@RandyW: Your explanation about the hukou is very helpful - thanks.

[RandyW 149]

17 minutes ago, macron said:

Thanks for everyone's replies.

 

@Pleasework89:  I think you're right, but from previous threads on this board, the process may require multiple trips or may not work at all.  We're hoping to get more information before going to China.

 

@Family:  We think alike   We got the official English translation of the Taiwan hukou and showed it to a few South American lawyers - they all rejected it saying that it wouldn't pass as a birth certificate.  I'll need Taiwan or their U.S. Embassy to write an official document explaining why my father can't produce a standard birth certificate and why the hukou should be accepted as an alternative.  Dealing with fewer governments would make my life easier.

 

@RandyW: Your explanation about the hukou is very helpful - thanks.

ALSO - reference the US Dept. of State reciprocity schedule for Taiwan. The Exceptions and Comments that I quoted above came from that under "Birth, Death, Burial Certificates". 

 

https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/us-visas/Visa-Reciprocity-and-Civil-Documents-by-Country/Taiwan.html

The South American countries should have equivalent policies that those lawyers MAY be able to tell you about.

Edited May 25, 2023 by RandyW

[macron 0]

23 hours ago, RandyW said:

ALSO - reference the US Dept. of State reciprocity schedule for Taiwan. The Exceptions and Comments that I quoted above came from that under "Birth, Death, Burial Certificates". 

 

https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/us-visas/Visa-Reciprocity-and-Civil-Documents-by-Country/Taiwan.html

The South American countries should have equivalent policies that those lawyers MAY be able to tell you about.

I'll look into it.  Thanks.