Smoking ban in cars

[garya505 2]

Garya505,

I already stated earlier, my agreement that smoking should not occur around children.

With that said, is car/bus exhaust, environmental pollution, contagious disease, "doing it to yourself"?

It's not about banning unhealthy activities that you do to yourself. Go ahead and kill yourself if you like, that's your choice. On the other hand, smoking in a closed vehicle with children present is child abuse, no different from intentionally feeding them poisoned food or water.

No, but you threw in everything but the kitchen sink which muddied the issue. Certainly things like obesity, unhealthy fast food, and char broiled meat are things you choose or don't choose to do to yourself. The rest are things we all have to deal with.

[eric&gen 0]

Smoking is gross it should be banned forever. Whats the point of smoking anyways to look cool lol. Its one big health hazard smells your cloths, car house stains your teeth. puke I hate visiting my grandparents for the holidays because they smoke like fish out of water lol i cant handle the smoke flowing through the air directing toward my way at the table lol.

[Robor007 0]

There's some evidence for you.. after she moved out she was no longer subject to second hand smoke, and her lungs were better... pretty resilliant if you ask me... And yes of course its unfortunate that they all got lung cancer, but quitting smoking once you have lung cancer is much to late for lungs to recover on their own.

However, I dont agree with smoking when there are children present in the car just because cars are so closed off and younger children dont usually know enough to ask someone to stop smoking if it bothers them. I know I didn't enjoy being in a smoky car growing up...

I'm not saying she didn't recover - that part is obvious. My point is second hand smoke does affect those around the smoker and that fact that the asthma went away after she moved out proves that. However, it doesn't change the fact that she had to endure asthma for 23 years caused by second hand smoke. I still remember going there to pick her up for dates. I hated having to go inside because the place reeked. We'd come home after the date and it would be even worse and she would complain to her mom about smoking in the house again. FWIW, my ex's mom is dead - lung cancer. She died a widow though. Her husband died (non-smoker) of lung cancer. Second hand smoke related? I don't know but I'm sure it didn't help. Don't bother defending smoking to someone who's seen the outcome because it falls on deaf ears.

[William33 110]

Garya505,

I already stated earlier, my agreement that smoking should not occur around children.

With that said, is car/bus exhaust, environmental pollution, contagious disease, "doing it to yourself"?

It's not about banning unhealthy activities that you do to yourself. Go ahead and kill yourself if you like, that's your choice. On the other hand, smoking in a closed vehicle with children present is child abuse, no different from intentionally feeding them poisoned food or water.

No, but you threw in everything but the kitchen sink which muddied the issue. Certainly things like obesity, unhealthy fast food, and char broiled meat are things you choose or don't choose to do to yourself. The rest are things we all have to deal with.

Well, the kitchen sink is appropriate here. We are talking about legislation, on an issue that should be self regulated. There are a great many things that occur everday, that are much worse, in fact, already illegal.

The blind eye turns again.

[Robor007 0]

Ill stop smoking and stop polluting myself and ppl around me, when ppl stop driving cars and stop polluting the air and killing earth.

That has got to be the most ridiculous defense of smoking I ever heard. You do realize:

1. You're a hypocrite unless you don't own a car, ride in a car or any other vehicle that pollutes the earth. Walk, bike, etc. Otherwise - hypocrite.

2. Tobacco growing is a waste of the earth's resources as the land could be used for growing food to feed the hungry.

3. Much of the earth's natural resources are wasted in the production and distribution of tobacco - I'm guessing your arrived by truck. Trucks pollute, right?

4. 'Polluting the air and killing the earth'... Hmmm... I know cigarettes are a meaningless fraction of overall air pollution but what about the 'butts'? They're fscking everywhere!

[William33 110]

Ill stop smoking and stop polluting myself and ppl around me, when ppl stop driving cars and stop polluting the air and killing earth.

That has got to be the most ridiculous defense of smoking I ever heard. You do realize:

1. You're a hypocrite unless you don't own a car, ride in a car or any other vehicle that pollutes the earth. Walk, bike, etc. Otherwise - hypocrite.

2. Tobacco growing is a waste of the earth's resources as the land could be used for growing food to feed the hungry.

3. Much of the earth's natural resources are wasted in the production and distribution of tobacco - I'm guessing your arrived by truck. Trucks pollute, right?

4. 'Polluting the air and killing the earth'... Hmmm... I know cigarettes are a meaningless fraction of overall air pollution but what about the 'butts'? They're fscking everywhere!

Robor,

I generally agree with your position on most issues. On this one, your opinions are approaching militant levels. Does anything else bother you? Do you automatically dislike smokers?

You are stretching the facts, to make your anti-smoking point here, based on unscientific, anecdotal experience. Seriously, get on another train, more important issues abound.

[Robor007 0]

Ill stop smoking and stop polluting myself and ppl around me, when ppl stop driving cars and stop polluting the air and killing earth.

That has got to be the most ridiculous defense of smoking I ever heard. You do realize:

1. You're a hypocrite unless you don't own a car, ride in a car or any other vehicle that pollutes the earth. Walk, bike, etc. Otherwise - hypocrite.

2. Tobacco growing is a waste of the earth's resources as the land could be used for growing food to feed the hungry.

3. Much of the earth's natural resources are wasted in the production and distribution of tobacco - I'm guessing your arrived by truck. Trucks pollute, right?

4. 'Polluting the air and killing the earth'... Hmmm... I know cigarettes are a meaningless fraction of overall air pollution but what about the 'butts'? They're fscking everywhere!

Robor,

I generally agree with your position on most issues. On this one, your opinions are approaching militant levels. Does anything else bother you? Do you automatically dislike smokers?

You are stretching the facts, to make your anti-smoking point here, based on unscientific, anecdotal experience. Seriously, get on another train, more important issues abound.

Sorry but I'm just making a point. To try and justify a smoking habit because other people drive cars is well... See above.

I don't dislike smokers, I dislike smoking. I dislike it because of what I've seen it do to family members, because it bothers me physically, and because I don't care for the smell. To be honest it doesn't affect me directly that much. Living in FL the restaurants are smoke free. Most 'bars' aren't but it's no big deal as I'm not a barfly and I don't go to those places that are smoky because it's my choice. My only gripe is my neighbors smoke outside all the time (they don't smoke inside) and if I open my front kitchen windows it drifts right through. Do I like it? Absolutely not. Will I say anything? Absolutely not. Why? Because I have no business, period. I wouldn't even consider mentioning it. Instead I keep those windows closed and open just my small bedroom window on the other side of the place. If that's not enough airflow I close the place and turn on the A/C. Problem solved.

In response to your second sentence, there's many scientific studies with mounds of evidence proving smoking and second hand smoke's harm and it's already been posted here so I'm not going to repost it.

[ChristinaM 0]

I'm not going to bother providing links, because it's a waste of time. This an emotional issue for many people, not a completely scientific one.

One thing I would ask you to remember is that most scientific research on smoking is paid for by the anit-smoking lobbies. That means it's just about as unbiased as information that comes from the smoking lobbies.

[Sinergy 3]

Ill stop smoking and stop polluting myself and ppl around me, when ppl stop driving cars and stop polluting the air and killing earth.

That has got to be the most ridiculous defense of smoking I ever heard. You do realize:

1. You're a hypocrite unless you don't own a car, ride in a car or any other vehicle that pollutes the earth. Walk, bike, etc. Otherwise - hypocrite.

2. Tobacco growing is a waste of the earth's resources as the land could be used for growing food to feed the hungry.

3. Much of the earth's natural resources are wasted in the production and distribution of tobacco - I'm guessing your arrived by truck. Trucks pollute, right?

4. 'Polluting the air and killing the earth'... Hmmm... I know cigarettes are a meaningless fraction of overall air pollution but what about the 'butts'? They're fscking everywhere!

Well really since your a nonsmoker no matter what a smoker says your always going to be right. And if you didnt hear the sarcasm in that then you have the personality of a wall.

Lets face it, you cant make smoking illegal and you cant ban it 100%, no matter what anyone does it wont happen. remember back in the ancient days when they tried and i repeat TRIED to ban alcohol?? yea it came back and hasnt left again. The thing is, no one is perfect, and everyone is going to find something to criticize everyone about. Smoking just has to be the #1 thing. Lets think about it here. i smoke, big whoopdie doo. I dont drink, i dont do drugs, i work my ### off and im one hell of a mom and wife. So i smoke, my one downfall in life, BUT i do it and i like it, and im not going to have a bunch of non smoking whiners tell me i cant smoke in my car that i paid for, or my backyard that i pay for. I wish one day ppl will realise that they cant control other ppl, that day wont come before i die, but this is why i ignore the rest of the world

oh and FYI, if you actually open your eyes and not blame smokers for the polluted air, youll see their are far more cars, trucks and other means of transportation then there are cig butts on the ground!! so your theory is just a cig butt on the ground

Edited January 20, 2007 by Ionescu

[Ban Hammer 14,297]

so your theory is just a cig butt on the ground

that's gotta be the quote of the day

[KarenCee 3]

I'm not against anyone who smokes. That's a completely personal choice. However, I feel a parent should not be so selfish as to smoke in a closed up area when their children are around. They don't have a choice. As for the research not being scientific and printed by anti smoking proponents...I'm not so sure I agree with that. Even the companies that make the cigarettes post information on how to quit smoking. Maybe it's one of those "CYA" moves, not sure. But, regardless of what you think, it cannot be good for babies and children (or anyone for that matter) to breathe second hand smoke. Even now, as an adult, smoke bothers me tremendously. I have asthma pretty bad. I never smoked a day in my life...never had the desire to yet I have this bloody disease. Why is it that any research that comes out referring to the health hazards of second hand smoke and the exposure of children to it is questioned as a tactic of the anti smokers? Even if I did smoke I think I would have enough respect for my child to NOT expose her to my habit. I have children that come to school who reek of cigarette smoke. Their clothes, their hair, their bookbags...makes me gag sometimes with how strong the odor is. Ugh. Then there is the parent who picks their child up from school on a very cold winter day. I am outside doing car pick up duty. The door opens...smoke billows out...the child gets in and rolls down the window. The door closes and before the car drives off I hear the parent yell, with cigarette dangling from her lips "roll up that damn window, it's cold out there!" Doesn't sound like this child had much of a choice.

[Sinergy 3]

And i agree with you Karen, it shouldnt be done around children. I have for 11 yrs since having shonna NEVER smoked in the house or in the car with her. She knows i smoke and she knows i dont do it around her in closed areas for her health, and she is thankful.

[eric&gen 0]

Does anyone in here like to smoke sausages??!!!!

[William33 110]

Does anyone in here like to smoke sausages??!!!!

Did you hear the news? Smoked products and charred meat are now illegal!!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Where's that pet peeve thread, 'cause I got one:

Using "oh, think of the children" to justify intrusive laws.

Smoking is not good for you. Neither is secondhand smoke. Ban it in public, fine. Ban it in bars, okay, because it's not fair to the employees who work there, since they can't choose not to smoke, and it is the sort of decision that needs to be made unilaterally.

But a private car is one's own personal property. Smoking is legal. If smoking is so dangerous that we can't allow people to smoke around their kids in the car, then screw the car ban. Make it entirely illegal. If it's generally not so dangerous that we don't ban it entirely, then whether they smoke in private is their own business.

The law does not currently seem to think that smoking cigarettes is so dangerous as to be bannable.

I do not smoke. My dad smoked like a chimney, thought it was fun to blow smoke in my face, and then blamed my allergies on the media telling me smoking was bad. He's an ####### for that, but on his property, it really is his right.

(Gonna be fun if he ever visits, 'cause he's going to smoke outside.)

Hey, we normally agree about 99 percent of the time, but yay, we found something we disagree on!

A few issues. First, although you may own the property of your car, you're using that car on public roads which belong to everyone. Also, you don't own the air in your car anymore than you own the air that you breathe.

When it comes to children in society, they have no voice. I'm a big advocate of creating and maintaining laws which give a voice to the voiceless. If all things being equal, and its two adults in a car and the driver wants to smoke, the passenger has several options. He can ask the driver to stop smoking, put up with the smoke or he can get out of the car. A child does not have those choices. Our civil rights don't begin at 18, they begin at birth, and civil rights should always take precedent over property. (Example: A racist store owner cannot put up a sign in his window - No Blacks Served Here).

Speaking of pet peeves - one of mine is this idea that ownership of property is absolute. Who owns the air? The water? A mountain? Some people want to take ownership to such an extreme that everything is owned by somebody and I find that outrageous. Ownership exists as a contractual reality within a society and its laws. Without society and its laws, ownership is just an idea. I know that's going into an entirely different subject, but it is related to this and many issues because there is the presumption as you expressed that because one owns something they have exclusive rights to do as they wish with the property. However, the reality, that doesn't exist anywhere. You have rights to your property but those rights are conditional and limited.