Are DHS agents forbidden to think logically?

[pfroehlich2004 0]

Been thinking about your itinerary. Don't be surprised if USCIS counts the hours between when you landed and the divorce decree was granted and if that's different from how many hours you were actually there, they'll count those too. Do they both add up to 7 X 24?

I did everything by the book, as directed by my attorney. I booked a departing flight that left Guam precisely 7 days and 2 hours after my arriving flight. My flight itinerary, together with a letter from my hotel indicating that I had stayed there for 6 nights, was submitted to the court as evidence that I had fulfilled the 7-day stay requirement. In its judgement, the court stated that I had in fact met the minimum stay requirement and could therefore be granted a divorce.

The reason I am concerned is that the letter from DHS seems to imply that the complaint for divorce had to be filed on the exact day I departed Guam. However, the complaint for divorce was filed 30 days after I left (with the judgement being issued the same day). Clearly, the competent court in this matter did not interpret Guam law as requiring the end of my stay to coincide with the filing of the complaint. DHS however, seems to be applying its own interpretation.

I assume DHS agents can't simply declare divorce decrees invalid on a whim. Do you have any idea under what conditions they are allowed to do so? Could my Senator do anything to pre-empt them from doing this?

[pushbrk 12,247]

I did everything by the book, as directed by my attorney. I booked a departing flight that left Guam precisely 7 days and 2 hours after my arriving flight. My flight itinerary, together with a letter from my hotel indicating that I had stayed there for 6 nights, was submitted to the court as evidence that I had fulfilled the 7-day stay requirement. In its judgement, the court stated that I had in fact met the minimum stay requirement and could therefore be granted a divorce.

The reason I am concerned is that the letter from DHS seems to imply that the complaint for divorce had to be filed on the exact day I departed Guam. However, the complaint for divorce was filed 30 days after I left (with the judgement being issued the same day). Clearly, the competent court in this matter did not interpret Guam law as requiring the end of my stay to coincide with the filing of the complaint. DHS however, seems to be applying its own interpretation.

I assume DHS agents can't simply declare divorce decrees invalid on a whim. Do you have any idea under what conditions they are allowed to do so? Could my Senator do anything to pre-empt them from doing this?

Again, they cannot "declare divorce decrees invalid" on a whim or otherwise. They can, however, refuse to accept a divorce decree for immigration purposes. It's a distinction with a huge difference, you would be wise to get your head around.

[pushbrk 12,247]

Been thinking about your itinerary. Don't be surprised if USCIS counts the hours between when you landed and the divorce decree was granted and if that's different from how many hours you were actually there, they'll count those too. Do they both add up to 7 X 24?

What exactly does the request for evidence say that gives you the impression USCIS is interpreting Guam's divorce laws to require you file on the last day of your stay? What exactly did they ask for, in THEIR words, not your interpretation of their words.

[NigeriaorBust 4,087]

A US senator mostly likely is cluesless about divorce law in another country. You can research the law there yourself and see what it says about filing the complaint ( do you have to do it during your residency ? )

[pushbrk 12,247]

Posting like a dork tonight. I meant to add a question?

What exactly does the request for evidence say that gives you the impression USCIS is interpreting Guam's divorce laws to require you file on the last day of your stay? What exactly did they ask for, in THEIR words, not your interpretation of their words.

From what I'm reading, the words "immediately before filing" or something to that effect are part of the statute. It could be that they have their own legal interpretation of what that means, or maybe they just want independent evidence you spent the 7 days there. No way to predict. You just comply and see what happens. If you don't like what happens then, it's attorney and appeal time for some big bucks.

[grrrrreat 109]

Being divorced or not from a first spouse doesn't affect your ability to marry a second. My ex married his second wife wife long before we divorced ( 10 years) .

Wut??!?? You should realize that in the U.S., bigamy is illegal and bigamous marriages are void, even if they occurred overseas. Immigration law specifically declares marriages invalid if one of the parties is already married. That is why USCIS requires specific proof that someone is not already married to another person.

[grrrrreat 109]

I did everything by the book, as directed by my attorney. I booked a departing flight that left Guam precisely 7 days and 2 hours after my arriving flight. My flight itinerary, together with a letter from my hotel indicating that I had stayed there for 6 nights, was submitted to the court as evidence that I had fulfilled the 7-day stay requirement. In its judgement, the court stated that I had in fact met the minimum stay requirement and could therefore be granted a divorce.

The reason I am concerned is that the letter from DHS seems to imply that the complaint for divorce had to be filed on the exact day I departed Guam. However, the complaint for divorce was filed 30 days after I left (with the judgement being issued the same day). Clearly, the competent court in this matter did not interpret Guam law as requiring the end of my stay to coincide with the filing of the complaint. DHS however, seems to be applying its own interpretation.

I assume DHS agents can't simply declare divorce decrees invalid on a whim. Do you have any idea under what conditions they are allowed to do so? Could my Senator do anything to pre-empt them from doing this?

Unless you tell us what the RFE said specifically, we can't comment on whether USCIS is actually adopting the interpretation that you propose. If I were interpreting Guam law as you stated it, I would say that you had to file the complaint divorce after staying in Guam for 7 days and while you were still present in Guam, not necessarily on the "exact day" you departed Guam. However, I understand that the Guam court apparently had a different view and accepted your proof of stay.

I am guessing that something in your package indicated that you were not present in Guam when the divorce was applied for and obtained, which alerted them to the possibility that you did not meet the stay requirement. If I were you, I would send in the same proof that you submitted to the Guam court, and write an explanation of why you met the 7 day stay requirement under Guam law. It's possible that you're blowing it out of proportion by ascribing a Guam law interpretation to USCIS that they don't necessarily have. And even if they did you can try to explain why they're wrong.

[grrrrreat 109]

I assume the answer is no, but no harm in asking.

In my I-130 packet, as required, I included a copy of the divorce decree dissolving my previous marriage. DHS responded with an RFE, demanding that I prove I fulfilled the minimum time of residence required in the jurisdiction where my divorce was granted. In my case, this was the US Territory of Guam, which requires a minimum stay of 7 days from at least one party to the divorce.

Now, I have copies of my flight itinerary which shows that I arrived in Guam and departed precisely 7 days later as well as a letter from my hotel, confirming that I stayed there for six nights. Furthermore, I have an original, officially stamped interlocutory judgement of divorce from the Superior Court of Guam, in which it is stated: "The Court finds that it has acquired jurisdiction over this matter and finds that the defendant has been a resident of Guam for at least 7 days."

Given that the court has ruled that I fulfilled all the statutory requirements for filing a divorce petition, does DHS have any authority to declare the court's decision invalid? If not, what recourse would I have were DHS to exceed its legal authority?

You're misunderstanding USCIS's role in this. USCIS isn't obligated to accept the rulings of any foreign court, although the U.S. government generally does as a matter of friendship and comity toward other nations. But USCIS is specifically instructed by federal law to ensure that marriages are non-bigamous and valid. Bigamous marriages are specifically declared invalid by federal law, which is why they're trying to make sure that you're current marriage is valid.

USCIS can't un-divorce you, but they can't make sure that your divorce was properly granted and not procured by fraud.

[rade2rising 205]

great explanations

[pfroehlich2004 0]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. This is what concerns me about the wording of the RFE:

"According to the laws that govern the issuance of a divorce from a court of law in Guam, there is a requirement that a non-resident of Guam who submits a petition for a divorce must be present for a minimum of 7 days in Guam immediately proceeding[sic] the filing of a petition for a divorce from a court of law in Guam."

So, the court with jurisdiction in this matter has ruled that I complied with the laws of Guam and was therefore entitled to a divorce. I'm concerned as to whether USCIS is permitted to reject a Guamanian court's interpretation of Guam law.

@pushbrk: Do you have any idea under what conditions USCIS may refuse to accept a US divorce decree for immigration purposes?

PS - To those of you who are unaware, Guam is NOT A FOREIGN COUNTRY. It is a US territory and the decisions of its courts are entitled

to full faith and credit under the US Constitution, as are those of all other US states and territories.

[pushbrk 12,247]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. This is what concerns me about the wording of the RFE:

"According to the laws that govern the issuance of a divorce from a court of law in Guam, there is a requirement that a non-resident of Guam who submits a petition for a divorce must be present for a minimum of 7 days in Guam immediately proceeding[sic] the filing of a petition for a divorce from a court of law in Guam."

So, the court with jurisdiction in this matter has ruled that I complied with the laws of Guam and was therefore entitled to a divorce. I'm concerned as to whether USCIS is permitted to reject a Guamanian court's interpretation of Guam law.

@pushbrk: Do you have any idea under what conditions USCIS may refuse to accept a US divorce decree for immigration purposes?

PS - To those of you who are unaware, Guam is NOT A FOREIGN COUNTRY. It is a US territory and the decisions of its courts are entitled

to full faith and credit under the US Constitution, as are those of all other US states and territories.

As Grrrrreat stated, they may well be interpreting "immediately preceding" (Did they really write "proceeding"?) in such a way that filing 30 days later would be a problem or they may just want verification you spent the 7 days there. To my understanding, the full faith and credit requires the States and territories to honor decisions, in the same way married is married an divorced is divorced. USCIS is NOT a "State". It's their job to determine whether your circumstances entitle you to have the petition approved, so your spouse can apply for an immigration benefit based on that petition approval.

Quickie divorces in Guam, particularly if obtained just prior to remarriage abroad are huge red fraud indicators. This kind of fraud scenario includes the US Citizen and current spouse obtaining a divorce that would NOT be published in their local papers, so that one can marry a foreigner, get them a green card and then the original couple resumes their marriage.

Again, USCIS is doing their job. Give them what they want and wait until they either approve your petition or don't. If they don't, you can hire an attorney and appeal. FYI, there's lots of material you can Google regarding "immigration" not accepting Guam divorces. How much of it would apply to your case is hard to say.

[pfroehlich2004 0]

As Grrrrreat stated, they may well be interpreting "immediately preceding" (Did they really write "proceeding"?) in such a way that filing 30 days later would be a problem or they may just want verification you spent the 7 days there. To my understanding, the full faith and credit requires the States and territories to honor decisions, in the same way married is married an divorced is divorced. USCIS is NOT a "State". It's their job to determine whether your circumstances entitle you to have the petition approved, so your spouse can apply for an immigration benefit based on that petition approval.

Quickie divorces in Guam, particularly if obtained just prior to remarriage abroad are huge red fraud indicators. This kind of fraud scenario includes the US Citizen and current spouse obtaining a divorce that would NOT be published in their local papers, so that one can marry a foreigner, get them a green card and then the original couple resumes their marriage.

Again, USCIS is doing their job. Give them what they want and wait until they either approve your petition or don't. If they don't, you can hire an attorney and appeal. FYI, there's lots of material you can Google regarding "immigration" not accepting Guam divorces. How much of it would apply to your case is hard to say.

They really did write "proceeding"! Hopefully they'll be satisfied with the same evidence that the court accepted. I'm simply astounded that any case officer could suspect fraud in my case given the mountains of supporting evidence I provided: photos of my family attending our wedding here in Vietnam, affidavits from my parents and siblings attesting that they're aware of our marriage and visited us in our home, evidence of foreign travel together, etc. -maybe I should send them pictures of my wife and I in the hospital delivery room with our daughter!

[pushbrk 12,247]

They really did write "proceeding"! Hopefully they'll be satisfied with the same evidence that the court accepted. I'm simply astounded that any case officer could suspect fraud in my case given the mountains of supporting evidence I provided: photos of my family attending our wedding here in Vietnam, affidavits from my parents and siblings attesting that they're aware of our marriage and visited us in our home, evidence of foreign travel together, etc. -maybe I should send them pictures of my wife and I in the hospital delivery room with our daughter!

Then they are simply independently verifying you complied with their interpretation of Guamanian law. If you did, no worries.

[Harsh_77 716]

As Pushbrk mentioned USICS is doing its job, you would not believe how creative ppl can be and how various immigration frauds are committed.

They look at the cases all day, they know what to look for in a case and what stands out in a case.

Especially Guam is a territory and USCIS would be very familiar with the laws in Guam. Also it seems you had help from lawyer and his recommendation you file for divorce this way if you have any issues to prove your divorce was legit than it would be time to revisit this lawyer.

[grrrrreat 109]

As Grrrrreat stated, they may well be interpreting "immediately preceding" (Did they really write "proceeding"?) in such a way that filing 30 days later would be a problem or they may just want verification you spent the 7 days there. To my understanding, the full faith and credit requires the States and territories to honor decisions, in the same way married is married an divorced is divorced. USCIS is NOT a "State". It's their job to determine whether your circumstances entitle you to have the petition approved, so your spouse can apply for an immigration benefit based on that petition approval.

Quickie divorces in Guam, particularly if obtained just prior to remarriage abroad are huge red fraud indicators. This kind of fraud scenario includes the US Citizen and current spouse obtaining a divorce that would NOT be published in their local papers, so that one can marry a foreigner, get them a green card and then the original couple resumes their marriage.

Again, USCIS is doing their job. Give them what they want and wait until they either approve your petition or don't. If they don't, you can hire an attorney and appeal. FYI, there's lots of material you can Google regarding "immigration" not accepting Guam divorces. How much of it would apply to your case is hard to say.

Full faith and credit doesn't apply to territories because they aren't sovereign states, only between states of the U.S. I agree on everything else though.

Edited June 26, 2012 by grrrrreat